smelly toilet

[Nick_H]

Any ideas how I stop the sea water in the inlet pipe of an electric flush toilet from going off and stinking the whole boat out when I flush it after its been standing for a week. I filled the pipe with disinfectant and left it for a week and the smell went away for a month or so, but now its back. I've seen some in line devices that you can install and you put disolvable tablets in, but I'm not keen on having three extra connections below the water line.

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[Jelly]

I now hang a Toilet Duck in mine. Its the only thing I have found that stops the smell completely. The in-line filter/deodorants did nothing much. Bit concerned that its not very marina friendly though ?!?

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[tcm]

can you hose or fil or flush it thru with fresh water? Also, with hard water areas, i wd chuck some calcium disolver from supermarket - Viakal or similar will clean the pipes a bit.

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[dickh]

The smell comes from the stagnant salt water in the inlet hose from the seacock to the loo.
The ONLY way to stop the smell is to fill the INLET pipe with FRESH water. Not sure how you would do it on an electric flush toilet, but on my manual toilet, I've Tee'd in another ¾" hose immediately after the seacock, with a ball valve on this Tee. I keep a 5 gallon container of fresh water adjacent and at the end of the weekend, I close the inlet seacock, open the ball valve, dip the hose into the fresh water and pump until flushed through. Close the ball valve, then close the outlet seacock. I also tie off the ball valve so it can't be inadvertantly opened. This method is guaranteed to work! Don't bother with the inline deodorants - all they do is add a blue colour to the water.
I've used this for the last 3 years. I also fitted new 'No Smell' hoses earlier & although they loked nice also did not stop the smell.


<hr width=100% size=1>dickh
I'd rather be sailing... /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[jfm]

dickh's idea sounds excellent. I'd just add, repeating headmistress's advice, you must get the fresh water supply from a tank like dickh's, and not by T-ing into your existing frssh water system, due to obvious contamination risk

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[Wiggo]

Think I saw somewhere the suggestion of tee-ing into the drain from the sink in the heads. That way, you can fill the sink with fresh water, and then pump it through the khazi without danger to your domestic supply, or having to bugger about with a dedicated water tank.

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[mjf]

Tcm usually does all the toilet work on our pontoon - very good at blockages and general blow throu's.....

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[HeadMistress]

That will work for both electric and manual toilets--close the intake seacock, fill the sink with clean fresh water and flush the toilet. Because the seacock is closed, the toilet will pull the water out of the sink, rinsing the sea water out of the system. However, if the toilet is an electric that has an impeller intake pump, you must be very careful to avoid continuing to flush after all the water is gone from the sink...because running the toilet dry will "fry" the intake impeller. It's also necessary to keep a plug in the sink drain when the toilet is in use...otherwise, the pump will pull in air from the sink, preventing it from priming.

Avoid using household chemical bowl cleaners (including the Toilet Duck)...they contain chlorine and other chemicals that are highly damaging to the rubber parts in marine toilets and also to hoses--making them less resistant to odor permeation. They're also corrosive. Never use any cleaning product in the toilet that contains chlorine, pine oil solvents, petroleum products, acids, or other chemicals such as those in Lysol etc, Sno-Bowl etc. However, you can clean the bowl with anything you like, provided you don't flush it but wipe it all out. A cupful of white vinegar flushed through the hoses once a week will not only help to prevent odor, but also sea water mineral buildup. But don't leave vinegar standing in the bowl. Vinegar just passing through the rubber parts in a toilet won't harm them...but anything left in the bowl seeps through the pump...and rubber parts left to soak in vinegar will swell up and distort.

<hr width=100% size=1>Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987

 

[mjf]

I do not think that would work on my boat - the sink and shower discharge into a grey water tank that pumps out O/B or to the hoding tank.

How does the toilet draw water from the sink?

The sink is not connected to the toilet or am I missing something here?

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[Wiggo]

yup. You need a Y valve on teh sink outlet that lets it drain down to another Y just above the bog inlet seacock. Switch both of them to fill the bog from the sink. Doing so leaves fresh water in the pipe all the way from just above the inlet seacock to the khazi, so no nasty niffy bacteria can grow in there while you're away.

FWIW, Peggy, does leaving the inlet seacock open to the sea help stop the anaerobic stuff growing in the pipe? Aside from the issue of leaving the boat with an open seacock, of course...

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[BrendanS]

You need to make the connection. Or get a plumber to do it.

<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni

 

[Medskipper]

Hmmm, I am amazed at all the complicated advise here!

I have manual sea loos on board, your problem is that there is water going stagnant in the outlet pipe from the toilet to the outlet underneath your boat. If you empty that pipe of water then hey presto no smell! therefore when I leave my vessel I shut the intake valve and pump the loo handle after turning lever to no flush until I can hear air bubbles underneath the boat, then I shut off the gate valve in the bilge and I get no foul water in the pipe when I next return to the boat and turn everything back on again there is never a foul smell!
Simple eh!
I am sure that with an electric loo you can do the same! just turn off the flush and continue pumping out all the water from the bowl until you hear air rising from under the boat then shut the valve!

Barry


<hr width=100% size=1>I just want to retire with my boat to the Med!

 

[Wiggo]

Nice plan, Barry, but no cigar. The issue is the water in the inlet pipe, which, being seawater, contains bacteria. Left in a closed pipe in the dark, the anaerobic ones take over, resulting a stench of hydrogen sulphide (rotten eggs) first time you flush (the bad water is drawn up and into the bog). What you leave in the outlet pipe is up to you, but when you flush, it can only go outside the boat. What we have here is bad water being drawn into the boat.

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[HeadMistress]

Wiggo is right...y'all are confusing the head intake with the head discharge. It's the micro (and not so micro)-organisms in sea water left in the head flush water INTAKE, pump and channel in the rim of the bowl to die and decay that causes the odor in the first flush after the boat has been sitting...and just pouring something down the toilet through the bowl won't clear that out because nothing poured into the bowl (thank God!) is recirculated through the intake. The only way to prevent intake odor is to find a way to use fresh water to rinse it all out of the line, pump, and channel in the rim of the bowl...which requires teeing a means of doing that into the head intake line.

It's fairly easy to do on most sailboats because most sailboat sinks drain through below-waterline thru-hulls...but most powerboat sink drain thru-hulls are above the waterline. That still doesn't make it hard to do...it just means disconnecting the head sink drain from its existing thru-hull and rerouting it to tee it into the head intake line. (Before anyone asks, the sink WILL drain just as well below the waterline as above it...and has the added advantage of no more streaks on your hull below the drain thru-hull). And anyone who needs a plumber just to disconnect a hose from an above-waterline thru-hull and connect it to an existing line using a tee or wye fitting is too helpless to own a boat!

Once done, it's easy to use: Close the intake thru-hull, fill the sink with fresh water, flush the toilet. Because the seacock is closed, the toilet will pull the water from the sink...rinsing out not only the head intake line and pump, but also the head discharge line as the toilet is flushed. In fact, you could even use this method to flush the toilet instead of using sea water...just keep the intake seacock closed and put water in the sink each time.

However, if the sink drains on the opposite side of the boat from the head intake, this method obviously won't work because plumbing it would be more trouble than it's worth. The next best thing is a short line teed anywhere into the head intake line, with a shut-off valve... After closing the intake seacock, stick the end of the short hose into a gallon jug of clean fresh water and flush the toilet. It's a bit more effort than just filling a sink with water...and you would have a short piece of dangling hose in the head or somewhere near it in an accessible location...but if the odor from the first flush after the boat has sat is bad enough, it's worth it.

Btw, Wiggo...leaving the seacock open won't help. The environment inside a hose is anaerobic (no air circulation), so ANY water in the line will stagnate...you'd have a water "barrier" that's just as effective in promoting anaerobic conditions as a closed thru-hull. Nor would it be necessary to install a y-valve when connecting the sink drain and head intake...in fact, a y-valve would only complicate things, especially for landlubber guests. Rarely would anyone in the head be using the toilet and sink at the same time, so a simple tee or wye fitting and a plug in the sink when the toilet is in use (even landlubbers can understand that instruction) are all that's needed.

<hr width=100% size=1>Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987

 

[Medskipper]

Ah, but perhaps you didn't quite read my note correctly! I said close the inlet valve and then pump the water through to the pan, then close the flush and pump until you hear lots of air bubbles coming up from bottom of boat! pan will now be empty and so will inlet and outlet pipes! I assure you it works for me! I used to get rotton egg smells but don't any more! been doing it a few years!

Anyway, Iv'e given up cigars!!!

Barry


<hr width=100% size=1>I just want to retire with my boat to the Med!

 

[Medskipper]

Well Peggy,

Thanks for the explanation, (I trained as a plumber many years ago!) but I have been doing what I have described for a few years now and I don't get bad smells at all! I did say close intake first and pump! I accept that it will not pump pipe dry but I don't get any bad smells anyway! I do use a marine loo cleaner as well which is squirted around the bowl after emptying same.

Barry


<hr width=100% size=1>I just want to retire with my boat to the Med!

 

[HeadMistress]

Whether intake odor is even an issue or not depends on the waters you're in...how "organic" they are. Typically, the colder, the deeper, and/or the better the tidal or current cleansing, the less there is in the water to stagnate and stink in the toilet intake. Nor is it typical on boats in fresh water...but that's not always the case either.

So if you're lucky enough not to be knocked off your feet by the first flush after the boat has been sitting awhile, count your blessings...but that doesn't mean it won't happen on your boat if you should move to another marina or even to another part of the same marina. So let's not be too smug about it...'cuz it ain't due to anything you're doing to prevent it, it's only 'cuz the waters you're in don't cause it.

<hr width=100% size=1>Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987

 

[deborahann]

I dont know wot all the fuss is about. It's a boat after all, without some of it's vagriencies it would not be half the fun. Anticeptic boating, engines with no oil leaks, bilges with no water in them. Heating that worked all the time. Oh and whilst I'm on about it. MF's water is a bit suspect. Well to put it bluntly, Jock the dog got diarea every time he's been on the boat and we are needing a new carpet. Anyway I had a spare bit so that's ok now. Anyway I stuck some tablet thingies down the water tank. So is that mended now. Well thats if it was the water that was iffy in the first place. Can I have the answer in simple english please. No long words or lengthy discriptions as my attention span is limited..Ta.
Upps!! Sorry, that was me not err!.

<hr width=100% size=1>deborah on delft.
Nothing to do with Mucky Farter or hlb in drag

 

[Wiggo]

Aha! Vindication. I can't pump anywhere close to dry with the inlet cock closed. I reckon your pump's buggered, mate, cos I can't get a single stroke on mine with the seacock shut.

Sure enough, if I pump the thing dry, I hear the bubbles going out under the hull, but that's so rare. I mean, when did you last pump out into the marina, Barry?

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[Medskipper]

Peggy, I'm not being smug at all! just offering another point of view! If it works for me it might be a simpler way to cure the problem for someone else!

I am in a saltwater/brackish marina and I did used to get this type of smell after leaving loo for two or more weeks and now I don't! The only thing that is different is that I empty all the pipes out! I'm sorry if that offends your professional standing in the business! If I still had the problem I would take your advise and change the pipe work, all I'm saying is that my advise my help someone with the same problem without going to all the effort of installing a fresh water flushing system! at least they can try my method without doing all that work first! after that if its not cured the problem as you insist it won't then put in a fresh flush!

Barry


<hr width=100% size=1>I just want to retire with my boat to the Med!