Small sailboat on a small budget

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DaveBags

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Hi, I am currently looking into buying a boat and beginning sailing on rivers and eventually coastal waters and was just hoping to get some advice from people in the know. I'm really restricted to 19 foot but would like 4 berths and from what I've heard bilge keels are cheaper in terms of mooring and 7ft is the max beam for narrow canal locks. All that said I have managed to find caprice 19 (not sure if this is 3 berth) and manta 19 boats and very little else around my budget. My question is what other boats that meet the criteria should I consider as a novice on a very low budget, where is a good place to look in the northwest and I suppose does anyone have an old favourite sitting around gathering dirt that they want to move on to pastures new? I am expecting to have to do some cosmetic work which I can handle but technically it would have to be ready to sail as I am new to sailing in general, how much should I be looking at spending?
 
Four berths in 19’ is asking a lot! Is there some special reason you can’t go a little bit longer? Our daughters Pandora (7 metres -just under 23’) has four berths ‘officially’ but is cozy for two. I’ve trailed it behind a Landrover.
as others have said, there’s lots of choice if you can stretch your criteria just a little bit longer.
 
19 is the longest I'd fit on the garden, it's mainly to reduce costs when it comes to maintenance but if the initial cost is going to be so much more it might be that I have to hire somewhere. My budget is around 1500 including trailer etc. so far all I have seen in my price range close by is a navigator which is too wide and has a bad reputation on here.
 
Well, lots to choose from. I, we, have just acquired responsibility for a Swift 18, in fine condition and being checked and cleaned etc. One of our elder members can no longer sail and we have been asked to sell it. It is a four berth and sails well.

Swift 18 Trailer Sailer ARCHIVE | Topsail Marine Yacht Brokers

The link should get you to an archived web description, feel free to PM me and I can keep you posted on progress and condition. Located near Rochester, Kent. Does have a road trailer and launching trailer, again we are just beginning to investigate it. Thank you
 
Aurai said:
Well, lots to choose from. I, we, have just acquired responsibility for a Swift 18, in fine condition and being checked and cleaned etc. One of our elder members can no longer sail and we have been asked to sell it. It is a four berth and sails well.

Swift 18 Trailer Sailer ARCHIVE | Topsail Marine Yacht Brokers

The link should get you to an archived web description, feel free to PM me and I can keep you posted on progress and condition. Located near Rochester, Kent. Does have a road trailer and launching trailer, again we are just beginning to investigate it. Thank you
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Keep me updated please, I don't want to right anything off yet but the max 7ft beam is pretty important as I want to be able to get around the locks. I may have to compromise though hopefully not
 
Alacrity 19 would work, although the Vivacity 20 (almost identical) has 4 reasonable berths and generally better accomodation and mine was a delight to sail in most conditions even with halyards at the mast.
 
Seawych 19 would suit. seawych.org/index.php/boats-for-sale-wanted

Be aware that a sailing boat is not suitable for use in the canals, and few rivers are suitable for a sailing boat because they are mostly narrow once you get above the tidal estuary. Lots of boats of this size around but there is not really anywhere where they are obviously found for sale so small ads Apolloduck and ebay are the main places to look. Northwest is not the best place because the boat population is limited by the relatively limited places to keep and sail a small boat.
 
Tranona said:
Seawych 19 would suit. be aware that a sailing boat is not suitable for use in the canals, and few rivers are suitable for a sailing boat because they are mostly narrow once you get above the tidal estuary. Lots of boats of this size around but there is not really anywhere where they are obviously found for sale so small ads Apolloduck and ebay are the main places to look. Northwest is not the best place because the boat population is limited by the relatively limited places to keep and sail a small boat.
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Why are they not suitable for canals? Is that a regulation thing or just a preference thing? I assumed if the beam and draft were small enough it would be ok. And I have noticed a lack of options up this end, I was starting to think sailors thought Hampshire and kent were the north :P
 
DaveBags said:
Why are they not suitable for canals? Is that a regulation thing or just a preference thing? I assumed if the beam and draft were small enough it would be ok. And I have noticed a lack of options up this end, I was starting to think sailors thought Hampshire and kent were the north :p
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Draft would be a major problem in many canals, even a small bilge keeler may have a draft of up to 3’, plus the need for a licence, and various requirements not needed for a seagoing vessel.
Obvioulsly would have to travel without the mast, except maybe on the Manchester ship canal.
4 berths in a smal yacht is not easy , but if you don’t mind ring very snug, then it’s possible, when I started cruising 4 of us (all lads in late teens and between 5’ 10” and 6’ tall) managed several two week sailing holidays (including crossing to Cherbourg) in our Leisure 17.
Have a look at the Leisure 17, it was well built a good design and surprisingly good to sail.
 
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Praxinoscope said:
Draft would be a major problem in many canals, even a small bilge keeler may have a draft of up to 3’, plus the need for a licence, and various requirements not needed for a seagoing vessel.
Obvioulsly would have to travel without the mast, except maybe on the Manchester ship canal.
4 berths in a smal yacht is not easy , but if you don’t mind ring very snug, then it’s possible, when I started cruising 4 of us (all lads in late teens and between 5’ 10” and 6’ tall) managed several two week sailing holidays (including crossing to Cherbourg) in our Leisure 17.
Have a look at the Leisure 17, it was well built a good design and surprisingly good to sail.
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I like the look of the leisure 17 and there's one on ebay at the moment, if it was bilge keel I'd be bidding I think :)
 
DaveBags said:
Manta 19 Sailing Yacht – Cheap Boats

I was looking at this which says it has a draft of 18inches, is that just misinformation or a rarity? I thought canal drafts were around 3ft and most rivers would handle 3ft too
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it's not that rare, you could also look at lifting keels which would be shallower. 3ft is probably reasonable so any small bilge keeler will work but may occasionally hit a shopping trolley. Far more important is that there's a tabernacle of sufficient strength to use regularly, and that you understand how to operate it properly to raise and lower the mast. My Vivacity 20 had one and I could raise or lower single handed, but I would only have done it tied alongside and it probably took 45 minutes for each operation. I could lay the mast along the deck but it did overhang by 1.5m either end which could be problematic in a canal.

Be realistic about whether you'll actually sail. If not get a motor boat. A topper dinghy might represent more fun sailing in the short term while learning too.
 
ghostlymoron said:
I'd recommend the Leisure 17, it's shown in the brochure as 4 berth but at best it's 2+2. Ours was snug with only 2 adults and a medium sized dog - lots of fun though.
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Had some really great sailing in our Leisure 17, lots of them built (over 4000 I think) which suggests something was right with it.
2+ ocasional 2 as ghostlymoron suggests is fairly accurate but as I said in my previous post, 4 of us spent several two week holidays on board, and once on a day sail had 8 of us on board.
No small boat is particularly spacious, but the L17 s very good for its size.
 
Worth bearing in mind that the lengths in boats' model numbers often have more to do with marketing than measurements! Also, it may or may not include things like the overhang of a pulpit, the width of a transom hung rudder, even the length of a bowsprit. SO, if the length is critical, I'd take a tape measure with you when considering a particular boat.

The good news is that in general, builders were more likely to go one up than one down when naming models. There are exceptions to this, though, especially at cost-sensitive boundaries like 12m, where many marinas move into a higher cost regime, and in some countries, yacht taxes move into a different band.

PS: we had a Trotter, a version of the 23' Pandora made by Grimsby Marine Plastics. There was accommodation for two adults and two early teenage children in a very open-plan interior; if my mother wished to use the toilet, it was everyone out; the toilet was between the forward bunks, with no internal division at all. Accommodation in a 19 footer is likely to be spartan in the extreme.
 
I sail a pirate 17,great fun boat and while it would be OK for size, both canal and driveway with only 2ft ish of draft and 6ft ish beam and while I can tell you it's comfy and well appointed after a winter refit I can't imagine where 4 people would go with an extra 2 feet never mind now!! I have had 6 adults on board but that was on the mooring with plug in, a drink in hand and the evening sun shining ! When it's me, the wife and my 2 teenage sons in the big blue it's tight and not often at all we all go out at once, then again we are not on a canal
 
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