Siting a chart plotter

[stevensuf]

I think it makes a lot of sense to have the plotter in the cockpit, easy to reference to without having to remember every detail and I also display AIS on mine and it would be a pain in the rectum running up and down every time an alarm goes off.

 

[sailorman]

I think it makes a lot of sense to have the plotter in the cockpit, easy to reference to without having to remember every detail and I also display AIS on mine and it would be a pain in the rectum running up and down every time an alarm goes off.

do you have flipper ball on it for when you get bored of sail trimming & steering

 

[Richard10002]

If we were to put a plotter on the binnacle, I would have to go round behind the wheel to see where we were. At sea, I don't often sit behind the wheel, as I hate steering for long periods on passage and the auto pilot goes on very quickly

I wrestled with this for some time, hence the swivel. Apart from the restrictions of the wires, I made it so that mine could rotate through 360 degrees. If this isn't possible, I would still be looking at having it visible from the helm.

Most criticisms of chart plotter use at the helm seem to relate to training and experience. Exactly the same criticisms could be levelled at any navigational aid in isolation, which is all a plotter is, albeit a bloody good one that is wasted if you can't see it.

As has been taken on board - each to his own. perhaps I should have phrased my opener as "a no brainer for me"

 

[onesea]

I am sure I have mentioned the idea before but:

http://sites.garmin.com/montana/

http://www.google.co.uk/products/ca...a=X&ei=F3g2T8KJBci30gGc1OHWAg&ved=0CG0Q8wIwAA

(Ok I have an old Oregon but) Handy in the cockpit you can pass it round the crew, get OS maps and use ashore or road maps in car.

It serves as a back up GPS, personally I am not bothered about plotter, it has worked for me so far....

 

[Simondjuk]

Every time this question comes up, I am reminded of the sad story of a little boat called Kishmul of Ayr.

She'd had a rough cross-channel passage, on which most of the crew were so seasick that the skipper had spent much of the trip effectively sailing single handed.
They were almost home, when -- unable to get to the chart table, and navigating by eye and memory -- he miscounted a row of buoys, and ran onto a rock.
The crew were rescued, but the boat was wrecked and the skipper died.
Investigators were able to trace her track from the GPS, which had faithfully (and apparently accurately) recorded her movements right onto the rock.

I can't help thinking that if he'd had a chart plotter in the cockpit, the skipper and boat would have survived.

Thanks Tim, that's a fairly convincing argument for the benefits of a plotter in the cockpit.

My concern is that people trust electronic information too implicitly. We tend to assume that electronics won't make errors as we do, leading to failure to seek verification from another source as we might of our own judgements should what we see differ from our expectations. In the event of an error, the lack of such a double check could lead the boat onto a hazard. I know for sure that on at least one or two occasions trusting the plotter would have put me in strife when my own independent checks kept me safe. You only have to review the plotter tracks to see how often this happens, albeit on many occasions not when it really counts.

 

[JayBee]

Thanks Tim, that's a fairly convincing argument for the benefits of a plotter in the cockpit.

I think it's a fairly convincing argument against sailing on, trying to count a row of buoys in poor conditions.

It is a good argument for heaving to for a few minutes to establish the boat's position with certainty, and not press on, clinging to the wheel or tiller, hoping for the best.

 

[Simondjuk]

I think it's a fairly convincing argument against sailing on, trying to count a row of buoys in poor conditions.

It is a good argument for heaving to for a few minutes to establish the boat's position with certainty, and not press on, clinging to the wheel or tiller, hoping for the best.

I thought the same... If in doubt, stop!... but then considered that he may have been entirely unaware he had counted incorrectly and thought he was good. In such an instance, a plotter in view may have highlighted his error and made him seek verification.

 

[ksutton]

Thanks Tim, that's a fairly convincing argument for the benefits of a plotter in the cockpit.

My concern is that people trust electronic information too implicitly. We tend to assume that electronics won't make errors as we do, leading to failure to seek verification from another source as we might of our own judgements should what we see differ from our expectations. In the event of an error, the lack of such a double check could lead the boat onto a hazard. I know for sure that on at least one or two occasions trusting the plotter would have put me in strife when my own independent checks kept me safe. You only have to review the plotter tracks to see how often this happens, albeit on many occasions not when it really counts.

The converse can also be true. Entering a narrow channel at night, no moon and very black, you are following the relevant flashing green marker buoy lights. Then notice the depth meter quickly dropping, only 0.5 meter under keel, slow down or stop. Checking with the chart plotter you see you have missed a starboard buoy, (its light has failed), you are a little disoriented, there is a dog leg in the channel, your eye sight navigation has led you to the right hand side of the channel and into shallow water with a close encounter to grounding.

 

[JayBee]

As an aside...

Counting buoys

In the 1970's I had the job, on two separate occasions, of refloating two 100,000 tonnes plus, fully laden tankers, which had left the Ras Tanura departure channel one buoy earlier than their planned course alterations. (Honam Topaz and Globtik Saturn).

No GPS, poor Decca, no good radar targets on the low lying shore and poor visibility with fine sand in the air. They simply lost count of the buoys, but fortunately came to no great harm on the soft seabed.

 

[Simondjuk]

The converse can also be true. Entering a narrow channel at night, no moon and very black, you are following the relevant flashing green marker buoy lights. Then notice the depth meter quickly dropping, only 0.5 meter under keel, slow down or stop. Checking with the chart plotter you see you have missed a starboard buoy, (its light has failed), you are a little disoriented, there is a dog leg in the channel, your eye sight navigation has led you to the right hand side of the channel and into shallow water with a close encounter to grounding.

Precisely why I valued Tim's account. A very similar scenario.

 

[LadyInBed]

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't really see the point of a chart plotter in the cockpit. . . . .
. . . what's the benefit of having it in the cockpit?
What am I missing?

From what you have said above, I am guessing that you don't do much (any) sailing on your own.
If you are sailing with a navigator and a helm and maybe even a sail trimmer, not forgetting a cook and bottle washer, you are correct.
Sailing alone means that you need to be able to see your instruments in the cockpit and from the saloon. One solution is to double up on instrumentation as I have with an echo sounder repeater but two Radars is a bit OTT. My solution was to mount the Chart Plotter and Radar on hinge out mounts.

You also mentioned that your chart plotter sometimes lies to you, I have also noticed that my echo sounder also sometimes tells fibs but as we all still have brains, we take in all these inputs, wind the handle and come up with what is hopefully a reasonable answer

 

[scottie]

After you have found the he ideal place to sight it do you set it north up or head up?

 

[sailorman]

After you have found the he ideal place to sight it do you set it north up or head up?

only ever North up

 

[Seajet]

I have my plotter and radar displays on a swing-out panel in the main hatch, I can see both clearly from the helm and operate sitting on the bridgedeck, or from inside the cabin either cowering in fear or inputting waypoints etc before setting off.

The panel attaches by 'terry clips' onto a handrail at the companionway, so just pushes aside if one wants to go below. Even if I felt like spending the dosh on a repeater or extra unit, there's nowhere to put it, and this way I have the radar as well, also a switch for the red night lighting, binocular holder etc.

I've had this arrangement for a few years now and it works well;
I don't follow it blindly, did 40 years before without such luxuries so I'm quite used to generating my own cockups without electronic assistance...

 

[Simondjuk]

Agreed, north up.

 

[Simondjuk]

From what you have said above, I am guessing that you don't do much (any) sailing on your own.
If you are sailing with a navigator and a helm and maybe even a sail trimmer, not forgetting a cook and bottle washer, you are correct.
Sailing alone means that you need to be able to see your instruments in the cockpit and from the saloon. One solution is to double up on instrumentation as I have with an echo sounder repeater but two Radars is a bit OTT. My solution was to mount the Chart Plotter and Radar on hinge out mounts.

You also mentioned that your chart plotter sometimes lies to you, I have also noticed that my echo sounder also sometimes tells fibs but as we all still have brains, we take in all these inputs, wind the handle and come up with what is hopefully a reasonable answer

I'm starting to think I might just be a luddite in denial.

 

[jwilson]

You must have a very old chart plotter if it's not rain and spray proof. I think mine claims it can be submerged to a depth of one metre.

Pete

So does my Garmin at the helm claim to be waterproof to 1 metre. When it stopped working last year I undid the screws at the back of the sealed case, and about an eggcup of water dribbled out. Two weeks on top of the boiler at home and it worked again, but I don't rate it's long term life. The water (very slightly salty tasting) could only have got in round the screen edges or through the buttons on the front: it's set into a pod.

Nevertheless I believe the right place for a plotter these days is at the helm, unless you only ever sail with a full competent crew. When you are singlehanded or the only pilotage-competent person on board and you're close to unfamiliar rocky bits with lobster pots around you don't want to put on the autohelm and go below to the chart table.

But please don't drive the boat along the XTE highway: except in a few very special circumstances this is silly.