shower discharge pump not working

[Andy Bav]

We have a manual overide on ours, so if the same type of unit you can do a number of tests for power etc before getting into the bowels of the system. We found that ours was an integrated float switch that worked intermittently.

We cleaned the unit up - it did have a load of crud around the impeller, but it was definitely a dodgy switch in the unit. We have since replaced the pump, and also wired in a water witch https://www.gaelforcemarine.co.uk/en/gb/Water-Witch-Bilge-Switch/m-5001.aspx as a secondary back up.

We also had another issue with our rear shower sump pump, which is a separate float switch and bilge pump. That problem was twofold.

1. The outlet pipe downstream from the pump was blocked - cleared by "jetting" out the pipe with a hose pipe, and
2. A dodgy float switch - which needed to be replaced.

Good luck. I think you will find this is a common problem regardless of age of boat and for me, now, will be part of my annual maintenance regime

 

[PlanB]

You may find that the mesh filter is an inline fitting some way from the shower - mine is near the seacocks under the floor.

 

[hg2016]

Evening All,
I have investigated my shower pump problem. The pump is a' Attwood V750' with a separate Attwood float switch.
I have found a couple of issues. There is a proper connector plug where the unit plugs into the wiring loom. Both the live feed from the wiring loom and from the pump side have corroded and are totally broken away from the plug. I have removed the whole unit including the sump and have taken it home for testing tomorrow evening. The float does make a positive click when you lift it and looks in good nick. I've removed the pump and the impeller is clear of any blockage. I'll connect it to a battery tomorrow and see if there is any sign of life.
The inlet and outlet pipes are clear. Unfortunately there was no seal under the lid when I removed the screws. Also the inlet and outlet pipes both had silicone around them. I thought that was quite a good precaution. when i undone the jubilee clips i found that they had been done up so tight that they had crushed and cracked the spigots on the sump.
My final concern is that there is water in the 'V' of the boat below the pump sump, although this looks clean. The pump is located under the floor in the aft berth which is situated under the cockpit.
Thanks for all your help so far.
P.S excuse my ignorance but can anybody tell me what ' non OEM' means on the pump description.

 

[Portofino]

View attachment 71568

You might be able to buy a seperate manifold - the white part ( top rhs of the box ) that the pipes connect if that’s cracked

Original Equipment Manufactured .

It might be worth investigating the possibility of fitting a bilge pump in that V under the bed .

On the image shown there happens to be one any how for that section of the boat .slightly hidden on the pic RHS .
In this example it held down and its switch by a alloy L shaped bracket.The pump is fitted through a hole cut out in the horizontal face of the L .The things attached clamping down the pump on the vertical strengthening section of glassed wood .
This means no self tappers into the hull / floor area below it —- for obvious reasons .
An alternative method is with a fibreglass repair kit attach a piece of marine ply 10x15 cm or whatever to the base of the V .This makes a nice platform.
Ok it will form a tiny bridge, then screw the new bilge pump / switch to that .

Don,t self tapper the hull . That’s the point .

Pic above also has a recent Aircon air handler condensation tray drain ( new whitish pipe ) connected , coming from the compartment next door conveniently passed through the limber hole

 

[Andy Bav]

My final concern is that there is water in the 'V' of the boat below the pump sump, although this looks clean. The pump is located under the floor in the aft berth which is situated under the cockpit.

If it’s like ours it will probably be stale shower water, which may whiff after a while. Invest in something like this

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/str...MIgurvvoDL2wIVT7ftCh13EAcLEAQYBSABEgIem_D_BwE

And when you refit, pump out the water in the bilge into your [now working ��] sump box, the remainder is a sponge and squeeze job.

I think quite a few of us feel your pain ��

 

[Momac]

there is water in the 'V' of the boat below the pump sump, although this looks clean. The pump is located under the floor in the aft berth which is situated under the cockpit.
Thanks for all your help so far.
P.S excuse my ignorance but can anybody tell me what ' non OEM' means on the pump description.

My float switch was clicking but not making a circuit - possibly the wires at fault rather than the switch . I went with a new switch which has resolved my problem.

The lid of the box does not make a watertight seal so if the pump was not working it will overflow into the bilge.

OEM means Original Equipment Manufacturer. So Non OEM is an alternative product.

 

[hg2016]

My float switch was clicking but not making a circuit - possibly the wires at fault rather than the switch . I went with a new switch which has resolved my problem.

The lid of the box does not make a watertight seal so if the pump was not working it will overflow into the bilge.

OEM means Original Equipment Manufacturer. So Non OEM is an alternative product.

Thanks for the OEM clarification MartynG. And thank you to all who have helped me out. Don't be offended if I don't quote everybody when I reply. I take note off all the posts and I take on all advice without exception but i'm just so slow at typing.
loving the idea of the syphon pump from 'Andy Bav'. Handy thing to have on board. And the pics and post from 'Portofino' is very comprehensive and gives me a good idea of what elese can be done.
Thanks to all

 

[hg2016]

Is it ok to touch the wires on my car battery and then lift the float to see if anything works?

 

[jrudge]

Is it ok to touch the wires on my car battery and then lift the float to see if anything works?

Yes but ....



If you clean it out there is no reason why you would not run it in situ surely? Removing it and the pipes will be a pain and almost certainly need a heat gun so soften the pipes.

They are temperamental bits of junk so dont be surprised if it runs on the bench and then does not work after a few days reinstalled.

I have tried to repair them several times ( they are hardly complex) but each time it just leads to more grief as few days later so now if there is a fault ( not a blockage) i just sling it away and put in new ones.

Think of them as disposable like oil filters.

You will however need to clean them at least twice a season, and a mesh on the shower tray drain that catches hair will be decent investment ( £1 ish on eBay).

 

[hg2016]

Yes but ....



If you clean it out there is no reason why you would not run it in situ surely? Removing it and the pipes will be a pain and almost certainly need a heat gun so soften the pipes.

They are temperamental bits of junk so dont be surprised if it runs on the bench and then does not work after a few days reinstalled.

I have tried to repair them several times ( they are hardly complex) but each time it just leads to more grief as few days later so now if there is a fault ( not a blockage) i just sling it away and put in new ones.

Think of them as disposable like oil filters.

You will however need to clean them at least twice a season, and a mesh on the shower tray drain that catches hair will be decent investment ( £1 ish on eBay).

I have already removed the whole thing. Its in my workshop at home and I've just cleaned it all out. I'll give it a try in a bit. Mesh on the shower tray is a sound idea.

 

[Momac]

Perhaps the sump should be opened up and dried out over winter if the shower will be unused for some months. I have not done so but it may be a means of prolonging life of the components.

 

[Portofino]

If lifting the float , make it click does not activate the pump , them next is to direct wire the pump , make some conection with your 12 v source - just touch the terminals , should buzz , spin .
If it does,t then the pumps gone .
But before running to the chandler or online shop ? Test the switch connect a car 12 bulb to the it and see if it will illuminate. Then double check the wiring - again !

Assuming you have the time to phaff .
However seeing as you report # pipe spigots that have been gobb ed up with silicon , ( which I guess can be repeated )
For €100 or so buy a whole new complete box and canabalise the good bits on the old as emergency spares , once you know they work .

 

[petem]

Test the switch connect a car 12 bulb to the it and see if it will illuminate.

A Multimeter would be much better than a bulb. If the OP doesn't have a Multimeter then he (and every other boater) should invest in one (I have one of these http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?id=20&method=mViewProduct&productid=17076). Not only would that enable him to test the switch but also the power supply.

 

[hg2016]

A Multimeter would be much better than a bulb. If the OP doesn't have a Multimeter then he (and every other boater) should invest in one (I have one of these http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?id=20&method=mViewProduct&productid=17076). Not only would that enable him to test the switch but also the power supply.

I am in possession of a multimeter. just need a degree in quantum physics to know how to use it. A big dial with lots of different setting stations. Electrics are not my strong point.

 

[petem]

I am in possession of a multimeter. just need a degree in quantum physics to know how to use it. A big dial with lots of different setting stations. Electrics are not my strong point.

Using a multimeter seems daunting but once you've got the basics (measuring voltage) you'll wonder how you did without it! You won't use 95% of it's capability.

Click the dial on "V-" and the range to "2v" then you can check the voltage supply. Doesn't matter if you get the probes the wrong way round, it will just show -12v (I think)!

 

[hg2016]

Using a multimeter seems daunting but once you've got the basics (measuring voltage) you'll wonder how you did without it! You won't use 95% of it's capability.

Click the dial on "V-" and the range to "2v" then you can check the voltage supply. Doesn't matter if you get the probes the wrong way round, it will just show -12v (I think)!

Sounds good to me. One of the lads in our electronics dpt has just confirmed the same and showed me how to use it. Tidy.

More good news. I have tested the unit with a 12vb battery and both the float switch and pump are working fine. Just a matter of re wiring a new plug on the end of the unit and the loom.
corroded and broken wires were the problem. Free fix. Happy days.
Thanks to all who have helped me with this one.

 

[hg2016]

Hello chaps,
I have checked the wiring loom power supply to the pump and there is no power coming through. I done a quick twist together of the wires, lifted the float and I was greeted with silence. Free standing onto a battery (also tested under load) the unit works just fine. The domestic water pump was on as previously advised and no breakers have popped in the fuse box.
Can anybody advise me on my next steps please.
Regards HG

 

[jrudge]

Hello chaps,
I have checked the wiring loom power supply to the pump and there is no power coming through. I done a quick twist together of the wires, lifted the float and I was greeted with silence. Free standing onto a battery (also tested under load) the unit works just fine. The domestic water pump was on as previously advised and no breakers have popped in the fuse box.
Can anybody advise me on my next steps please.
Regards HG

Shower sumps are generally fused either

a. by a named breaker ( I see AC sumps separately but not often shower ones)

b. by the water pump ( if that is on you really need a way to drain it so they go hand in hand )

c. by some other method at the discretion of the builder - bilge pumps ?

I would make sure with a multi meter there is defiantly nil voltage there. The wires can also be cut off so you have fresh un oxidised wire - but that is not likely as if it were that bad I assume you would notice.

You must fault fine using a multimeter - there is simply no other way.

All ones I have seen tend to have a junction box next to them where the unit connects to the supply. Go back to that. Test. Yes / No.

Then see where it goes and follow it. You could also call the prior owner .... he may have put a switch in it as for example if it was running all the time that was his fix - people do odd things.

Call the dealer. Some boats have quirks and the dealers know. Oh yes its a junction under the lower helm, they always fall off or whatever.

Look behind the breakers - anything obvious off?

If you can't find it then on a personal level I would probably using my multimeter find another 12x supply nearby ( there is usually one on a boat) and tap into that.

If you are not happy tracing back electrics then just get someone in. It will not take long to find the fault.

 

[hg2016]

Shower sumps are generally fused either

a. by a named breaker ( I see AC sumps separately but not often shower ones)

b. by the water pump ( if that is on you really need a way to drain it so they go hand in hand )

c. by some other method at the discretion of the builder - bilge pumps ?

I would make sure with a multi meter there is defiantly nil voltage there. The wires can also be cut off so you have fresh un oxidised wire - but that is not likely as if it were that bad I assume you would notice.

You must fault fine using a multimeter - there is simply no other way.

All ones I have seen tend to have a junction box next to them where the unit connects to the supply. Go back to that. Test. Yes / No.

Then see where it goes and follow it. You could also call the prior owner .... he may have put a switch in it as for example if it was running all the time that was his fix - people do odd things.

Call the dealer. Some boats have quirks and the dealers know. Oh yes its a junction under the lower helm, they always fall off or whatever.

Look behind the breakers - anything obvious off?

If you can't find it then on a personal level I would probably using my multimeter find another 12x supply nearby ( there is usually one on a boat) and tap into that.

If you are not happy tracing back electrics then just get someone in. It will not take long to find the fault.

Thanks for that.
The supply to the pump was very corroded and the live wire was totally broken off from both pump and loom. I have traced the wire back as far as I can with my hand but then it disappears into the abis under the aft cabin below the cockpit. If I cut the loom wire back until I get nice fresh wire is it likely to give me a better reading, providing there is power to the breaker. And can I take the breaker out and check the feed to that with a meter.
Thanks for your help.