Sea survival suggestion - would it work?

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I just wear a dry suit with optional wooly bear fleece underlayer, when things are wet and cold.

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In winter and spring the air temp can be quite high on a sunny day but the sea temp will be just as lethal .

IfI had to choose between a lifejacket and an immersion suit on a sinking vessel I would go for the immersion suit.It would be virtually impossible to get into an immersion suit in the water but I think Simons draw string bag idea would be possible and could make a huge difference to your survival chances.
 
Above all keep hope. A chap called Sam Skinner survived for, I think, 36 hours in the water in the Irish Sea clinging to a pot buoy. He took some time to recover but survived.
 
" the bin bags have very little in the way of insulation properties."

You are right - but you miss the point that your clothing under the bags will be soaked in water and this will be retained by the bin bags. No - it won't be brilliant, but may give you a bit more survival time ?
Ken
 
I have an idea.

If all crew were kitted out with a pair of these shoes, the heels could be hollowed out and the survival bag contained within. It'll be just a matter of bending down and pulling the bag out and up over your body.

cs_photo12.jpg


What does the panel think?
 
"It would be virtually impossible to get into an immersion suit in the water but I think Simons draw string bag idea would be possible and could make a huge difference to your survival chances."
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I find it difficult enough getting into a binbag in my kitchen to dump my rubbish. Even getting them open requires the patience of Job & the bloody things never seem to open up completely.

Transfer that scenario to 'at sea', when, after I've finished panicking & I'm struggling to make sure
(1) I'm not being dragged alongside by my harness strop, which might still be attached to the boat, (find & open knife if it is?)
(2) my lifejacket is inflated & crutch strap is comfortable,
(3) my visor is covering my face to prevent inhaling water due to my bodies involutary reflex gasping,
(4) my personal EPIRB (if I have one) is activated,
(5) I have managed to get those 'useful oneday' miniflares out of that tight pocket.
(6) now take my attention away from my chattering teeth & frozen fingers, by getting into that heavy duty rubbish bag I just happen to have about my person, whoops, I've dropped it & its been swept away - 'bugger'!

Of course it'll work! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

How about a 'kill-cord' type attachment which activates a MOB, when detached? Maybe it could simply work like those electronic security things in shop doorways.
 
Oilies no doubt help to some extent but they have lots of apertures for arms legs at waist etc. so water flows in and out and gets replaced with cold every time you move.
 
It is a good idea and climbing into a survival bag is a recognised strategy in sea kayaking. It can also be exited and used as a marker when rescue arrives.
Guernseyman - I don't think you will drown from inhaling spray any more than you drown inhaling rain on land when its windy.
 
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I don't think you will drown from inhaling spray any more than you drown inhaling rain on land when its windy.

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I bow to more knowledgeable types, but I believe it's called 'splash drowning'. Because of the windage of head and lifejacket, as compared with the water drag of legs, you will end up looking in to the wind and breaking waves. Without some sort of visor/hood, you will inhale some of the splashes and thus drown.

On the question of survival bags, I well remember the first time I had any liferaft training. It was as part of the RYA Yachtmaster Instructor's Conference, then held at Cowes. We did what was effectively the Sea Survival Course in a swimming pool at Yarmouth. Pool temperature was 58F, roughly peak temperature mid-Channel. We had been warned to bring sailing clothes, but oilies and life-jackets were supplied. Some people (worried about drying their gear for the trip home) had just brought shorts and singlets. I had two pairs of trousers, sweat shirt and two sweaters. The course took about an hour and a half in the water, at the end of which most of the shorts and singlet brigade were ashore being treated for hypothermia. My abiding memory, though, is of the warm water running out of my oilie sleeves over my cold hands as I got out of the pool. Maybe a pair of bags to put round one's hands would help?
 
"I don't think you will drown from inhaling spray any more than you drown inhaling rain on land when its windy."

Politely speaking - The above statement is rubbish!

You might want to talk to the RN or better still, go on a sea survival course.

(1) when you fall into cold water, your body reacts by causing you to violently gasp through your mouth. This is a reflex action which you are unable to prevent.
(2) Your lifejacket, will when inflated, hold you in a position facing any waves breaking over your face,
(3) Open, gasping mouth + breaking waves = ???

Thats why RN lifejackets et al, are fitted with visors, to prevent this happening (& they don't spend money lightly). They were losing too many fit/well clothed/trained young matelots before they worked out why.

If you survive a drowning, due to the salt water inhalation you will also likely suffer secondary drowning some hours later! You are a diver, so should be aware of this.
 
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Guernseyman - I don't think you will drown from inhaling spray any more than you drown inhaling rain on land when its windy.

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I believe the Royal Navy Sea Survival School may disagree with you there.
 
Yes, i thik it would work but in quite limited fashion.

First the mobility of mob is severely limited, perhaps even to not waving... so mebbe all that happens is that death is assured, but less quickly. Well, you know what i mean. You wd have to be in the bag fairly firmly, unable to grab things thrown to you frinstance. My first impulse would not be to get in a bag.

Second, the amount of water in bag is high compared with say a wetsuit, so warm body will have a lot of heat to transfer to bagwater which itself is watercooled. The less bagwater the better, so body-shaped bag i spose, cept not easy to get into...

So, since it is all a bit empirical I reckon you should try it and see, in perhaps less lethal conditions and report back!
 
When I was in the Air Force I came across a scheme being tested by the US Military. It was essentially a heavy duty plastic bag (like a bin liner) with an inflatable ring moulded around the rim. It was not against hypothermia but was to protect downed fliers and sinking sailors from shark attack in the Pacific. I think the trouble was that when the fins were circling, the panic to get in the bag caused a head first entry which drowned the guy upside down in the bag because he couldn't get out. All from memory so bit vague.
 
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Second, the amount of water in bag is high compared with say a wetsuit, so warm body will have a lot of heat to transfer to bagwater which itself is watercooled.

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I believe I've been lakesailored.
 
In fairness my response only referenced woodlouse as I used "Quick Reply"; mine was a response extending from Cliff's response to the original poster.
Since I don't want to be drawn into a 9(a) infraction, I'll just ask that you explain how this doesn't apply:

"4b) “Lakesailoring” rules apply from the moment a second (different) person gives the essentially same answer as an earlier answer in the same thread. With a second similar or identical answer in the thread, the second chronological answer is “a lakesailor”, and that poster is “lakesailoring” the first responder with the same answer. The first responder is “being lakesailored” by the second (and subsequent) responders with that same answer."
 
lakesailoring sidebar

Um, i think there is enough similarity for a Danger of Lakesailoring to exist, so i will give way to cruiser2b and and hereby apologise. Except, erm i can't edit it, so just have to hope it turns out ok.

However, technically my post went a bit further and suggstd simoncr tries it. But there is enough similarity for lakesailoring despite my post suggesting the same issues as crusier2b and importantly, as though they were first and original, instead of merely second and original.

BrendanS - you are correct that the lakesailoring has not been completed, but a Danger of Lakesailoring nevertheless exists.

Also note that the same or similar answer merely has to be within the same thread - it does not have to be a directly-tagged reposnse to the original poster but sort-of-obviously in the same thread. Otherwise we could have (using the BrendanS Standard Illustration 2007 of Lakesailoring)

A question
..B answer
..C gosh, A, I bet nobody knows the answer to that
....D answer
......A thanks D

This is still lakesailoring, eventho D did not "answer" A directly. The danger exists before A's thanking of D (instead of B). Crusier2b is fair enough to raise the protest and i suppose, again, the rules oughta be changed a bit to make it clear.

Note that simoncr did not thank either of us, so the actual full akesailor has been avoided, at least for the time being.

However, depite the care of Cruiser2b - who clearly recognises the danger of rule 9a (where he's always wrong) we are nevertheless here involved in a lakesailoring discussion with cruiser2b - and so rule 9a applies regardless, and despite him being absolutely correct about a danger of lakesailoring, he nevertheless somehow "loses" the discussion. So, i'm sorry about that as well, but rules is rules.
 
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