wully1
Well-known member
The cops visited the boat that arrived here from Plymouth and did nothing....
Scotland can go sailing on 28th May?
- Thread starter FlyingGoose
- Start date
wully1
Well-known member
My Marina is open and I will be heading down tomorrow a travel there and back 120 miles,
I think I canny walk that or cycle or I will have a sore arse
But will be sensible and drive carefully , screaming at everyone to get out of the way. I will dance through the hordes at the marina , and enter my Virus free boat and bask in the glory of an oven box , inside, as I gasp to get out for air,
Do you think if the islands are off limits that one can use the maritime law of safe harbour without getting lynched if your boat has an issue
60 miles each way is stretching the 5 mile rule just a wee bit....just don’t stop for a wee and mind your hand sanitiser for the key pad.
And the islands are definitely off limits.
stevie69p
Active member
I can't seem to find a link to the updated legislation for Scotland. Note 'legislation', not guidance, advice, etc. I've already seen some nonsense posted on a facebook sailing group in relation to these new 'rules' and surpise surprise, the author was quickly shot down in flames for making out that most people would not be able to go to their boats. From here on in, I am following the legislation, as written, and applying my own common sense in relation to what, if any, risk I am taking or posing to others. The same dynamic risk assessment techniques that I use in the rest of my life and when at work. If the numpties need every last thing spelled out for them, then let them sit at home and suck it up, but I am going sailing, will be anchoring out overnight and sleeping on board.
D
Deleted member 36384
Guest
Just because someone chooses to follow guidelines does not make them a numpty or whatever the poster who’s son is in California insinuated.
It is highly likely that no one posting knows anyone’s circumstances (apart from Flying Goose’s) or reasons for following guidelines. To suggest that another interpretation is superior is arrogant and wrong; irrespective of your stance: legal or guidance.
It is highly likely that some people will take time to adjust and settle into a new way of interacting in society. They don’t need to feel insulted and ridiculed by those who take a different view.
It is highly likely that no one posting knows anyone’s circumstances (apart from Flying Goose’s) or reasons for following guidelines. To suggest that another interpretation is superior is arrogant and wrong; irrespective of your stance: legal or guidance.
It is highly likely that some people will take time to adjust and settle into a new way of interacting in society. They don’t need to feel insulted and ridiculed by those who take a different view.
stevie69p
Active member
Apologies... numpties was probably harsh. I'm just thoroughly sick of curtain twitchers at this stage. It does seem though that many (and I mean outwith sailing) need to be led by the hand.
cherod
N/A
that is absolute rubbish ,, he is stating the actual situation not a perceived one from a stream of apologists and paranoid doo gooders.
cherod
N/A
quite happily led by the nose , with the wool firmly pulled down over their eyes , right over the edge of the cliff , and still there will be the appeasers and apologists .
FlyingGoose
Well-known member
Sorry I am back I could not help myself, apsie brain going like a choo choo train
I have listed the corona act 2020 Scottish Government, call me a goose with no hair , but why was marinas and boat s not mentioned in this act, this in my opinion was not a mistake , it is not meant to be there. So why is is been thrown about,
I can make a mountain in a mole hill, nothing else to do for 85 days I am a avid Disability activist and social equality campaigner, I Obey the law not trumped up excuses .
There is no place for variation of the law , this only leads to anarchy
a person who is responsible for carrying on a business consisting of the provision of holiday accommodation, whether in a hotel, hostel, bed and breakfast accommodation, holiday apartment, home, cottage or bungalow, campsite, caravan park or boarding house, must cease to carry on that business during the emergency period.
If you have a decent excuse your Marina must let you stay under the Act 2020 most notably point A., how about to tired to drive
A person referred to in paragraph (4) may continue to carry on their business and keep any premises used in that business open—
(a)to provide accommodation for any person, who—
(i)is unable to return to their main residence,
(ii)uses that accommodation as their main residence,
(iii)needs accommodation while moving house,
(iv)needs accommodation to attend a funeral,
This shows that companies or places like Band Q and your Marina must look after the most vulnerable,, so if anyone has one of these conditions and the list is not exhaustive, or your partner, the Marina needs to make exceptions I fall in Number 5 although it is not listed as it is rare. A lady took Tescos to court via the disability discrimination act because she could not get a delivery slot and it made no reasonable changes for her and other disabled people , guess what , all Supermarkets do this now, that is the power of fighting for your rights
I have forced many changes in Scotland the most notably was the booking system for a disabled driver on Calmac , you could not do it online , you had to get to the office of the ferry travelling on hoping it was not full. this was in 2018 , never stop fighting for your rights , never accept what your are told because they seem important .
SCHEDULE 2Underlying Medical Conditions
1. Chronic (long-term) respiratory diseases, such as asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, emphysema or bronchitis.
2. Chronic heart disease, such as heart failure.
3. Chronic kidney disease.
4. Chronic liver disease, such as hepatitis.
5. Chronic neurological conditions, such as Parkinson’s disease, motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis (MS), a learning disability or cerebral palsy.
6. Diabetes.
7. Problems with the spleen, such as sickle cell disease or if removal of the spleen has occurred.
8. A weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS, or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy.
9. Being seriously overweight, with a body mass index of 40 or above.
The Health Protection (Coronavirus) (Restrictions) (Scotland) Regulations 2020
I have listed the corona act 2020 Scottish Government, call me a goose with no hair , but why was marinas and boat s not mentioned in this act, this in my opinion was not a mistake , it is not meant to be there. So why is is been thrown about,
I can make a mountain in a mole hill, nothing else to do for 85 days I am a avid Disability activist and social equality campaigner, I Obey the law not trumped up excuses .
There is no place for variation of the law , this only leads to anarchy
a person who is responsible for carrying on a business consisting of the provision of holiday accommodation, whether in a hotel, hostel, bed and breakfast accommodation, holiday apartment, home, cottage or bungalow, campsite, caravan park or boarding house, must cease to carry on that business during the emergency period.
If you have a decent excuse your Marina must let you stay under the Act 2020 most notably point A., how about to tired to drive
A person referred to in paragraph (4) may continue to carry on their business and keep any premises used in that business open—
(a)to provide accommodation for any person, who—
(i)is unable to return to their main residence,
(ii)uses that accommodation as their main residence,
(iii)needs accommodation while moving house,
(iv)needs accommodation to attend a funeral,
This shows that companies or places like Band Q and your Marina must look after the most vulnerable,, so if anyone has one of these conditions and the list is not exhaustive, or your partner, the Marina needs to make exceptions I fall in Number 5 although it is not listed as it is rare. A lady took Tescos to court via the disability discrimination act because she could not get a delivery slot and it made no reasonable changes for her and other disabled people , guess what , all Supermarkets do this now, that is the power of fighting for your rights
I have forced many changes in Scotland the most notably was the booking system for a disabled driver on Calmac , you could not do it online , you had to get to the office of the ferry travelling on hoping it was not full. this was in 2018 , never stop fighting for your rights , never accept what your are told because they seem important .
SCHEDULE 2Underlying Medical Conditions
1. Chronic (long-term) respiratory diseases, such as asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, emphysema or bronchitis.
2. Chronic heart disease, such as heart failure.
3. Chronic kidney disease.
4. Chronic liver disease, such as hepatitis.
5. Chronic neurological conditions, such as Parkinson’s disease, motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis (MS), a learning disability or cerebral palsy.
6. Diabetes.
7. Problems with the spleen, such as sickle cell disease or if removal of the spleen has occurred.
8. A weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS, or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy.
9. Being seriously overweight, with a body mass index of 40 or above.
The Health Protection (Coronavirus) (Restrictions) (Scotland) Regulations 2020
cherod
N/A
you have been a busy boy then Mr Goose 
dimdav
Active member
Just a gentle reminder to anyone out sailing today... This forum demands pics
ProDave
Well-known member
Not today but I will try and remember my camera tomorrow.
FlyingGoose
Well-known member
Letter send to RYA today.
I am writing to clarify some of the information you have on your Scottish pages in regards to Covid 19 advice to boaters
Its clearly understood that the First Minster of Scotland had given no laws in regards to the distance people can travel for leisure activities . but has offered a guildline of local and if you can within 5 miles,
So I am dismayed to see your advice to Marinas that you have listed the word MUST
Boating activity must be local to the household with the point of leaving (Club / marina / beach / loch etc) accessible within the current transport restrictions. Local means within about 5 miles with access preferably being on foot or by bike.
This is incorrect and leads to people and Marinas unfairly giving out advice and their making up their owns rules this is clearly wrong and damages the good will between the client and the Marinas,who are already suffering paying for storage with no access.
Also you have mentioned not staying onboard overnight, but clearly in the Covid act 2020 Scotland does not mention boats , as they are not considered as houses or holiday homes,
The regulations clearly also states that if that person cannot leave for a reasonable reason they are allowed to stay overnight in any accommodation.
As a disabled driver , I must use my Car, as walking , cycling are out of the question , my Boat is further than 5 miles as a disabled person I need to use cost as a consideration , some times after a long sail I need to rest before travelling home, this will involve an overnight stay.
Were are you considerations to the disability act 2010 with your broad sweep of your own interpretation of the Guidelines, were you have no authority to do so.
The RYA are not law makers nor should they interpret the guidelines to suit their own agenda , I look forward to hearing back from you and your thoughts on the disability act 2010 which clearly states that reasonably adjustment must be made to those with a chronic illness
May I also give you this suggestion to changing the wording of Must to possible to levitate confrontations between Yards, marinas and the general public
Regards
I am writing to clarify some of the information you have on your Scottish pages in regards to Covid 19 advice to boaters
Its clearly understood that the First Minster of Scotland had given no laws in regards to the distance people can travel for leisure activities . but has offered a guildline of local and if you can within 5 miles,
So I am dismayed to see your advice to Marinas that you have listed the word MUST
Boating activity must be local to the household with the point of leaving (Club / marina / beach / loch etc) accessible within the current transport restrictions. Local means within about 5 miles with access preferably being on foot or by bike.
This is incorrect and leads to people and Marinas unfairly giving out advice and their making up their owns rules this is clearly wrong and damages the good will between the client and the Marinas,who are already suffering paying for storage with no access.
Also you have mentioned not staying onboard overnight, but clearly in the Covid act 2020 Scotland does not mention boats , as they are not considered as houses or holiday homes,
The regulations clearly also states that if that person cannot leave for a reasonable reason they are allowed to stay overnight in any accommodation.
As a disabled driver , I must use my Car, as walking , cycling are out of the question , my Boat is further than 5 miles as a disabled person I need to use cost as a consideration , some times after a long sail I need to rest before travelling home, this will involve an overnight stay.
Were are you considerations to the disability act 2010 with your broad sweep of your own interpretation of the Guidelines, were you have no authority to do so.
The RYA are not law makers nor should they interpret the guidelines to suit their own agenda , I look forward to hearing back from you and your thoughts on the disability act 2010 which clearly states that reasonably adjustment must be made to those with a chronic illness
May I also give you this suggestion to changing the wording of Must to possible to levitate confrontations between Yards, marinas and the general public
Regards
trythalljohn
New member
I notice a contrast between attitudes to following guidelines on this forum and on climbing forums. Apologies to steve69p, as I have picked his post a bit randomly to reply to. Climbers seem to be more concerned than yachtsmen about the perception by none-climbers of their actions, in part because of the effect on relations after the crisis. The difference may be because access to crags is a long term concern of climbers. But is the yachting community sufficiently aware of the importance of being seen to do the right thing? eg If a trawlerman from Stornoway sees a yacht anchored overnight in Loch Torridon, and talks about us not following advice when he gets back home, what effect will this have on our reception in the Western Isles as the lockdown gradually lifts?
CapPugwash
Active member
I don't think anyone is suggesting that they are going to sail off to the islands. This thread is about getting back on water I thought.
trythalljohn
New member
Please reread my post. Going climbing now ;-)
stevie69p
Active member
I have actually had access to my boat since the lockdown began, and in theory could easily have taken her out for a sail, but have not done so, for the very reason of how it looks to others. I don't want to be 'that guy' who goes around rubbing other people's noses in the fact that they can't get to sail, so I have sat tight and played the long game. What really grinds my gears as our American cousins like to put it, is the constant addendums (addenda?) and 'made up facts', spur of the moment 'advice' etc., that is being banded around, only serving to confuse folk who just want to get back on the water, and the public in general. Write the laws, let me read and understand them, and then I will get on with things within that framework.
CapPugwash
Active member
Enjoy your climb. In answer to your question. Yes I think the yachting community as a whole are very aware of the opinions of local people. I apologise if I have missed your point, I am currently walking my beagles.
TLouth7
Active member
I too have noticed this. I put it down to the fact that sailors feel a lot more secure in their access. Climbers are in many locations subject to the whims of landowners who see no monetary benefit from allowing climbing. By contrast most sailors pay money for mooring, and have considerable rights of navigation. Also the sailing I am familiar with is somewhat less visible to the general public when contrasted with climbing in popular spots in say the peak which are also busy with walkers. I think most sailing locations have dedicated parking, I know that parking on verges in small rural communities is a big issue for climbing.
So I would say there are genuine reasons for the difrerent perspective, though it is interesting to think about. I have seen parallels in the discussion about staying overnight (wild camping vs on board).
seafox67
Active member
ProDave
Well-known member
With or without your Bivouac?
The difference if you decide to spend a night in the hills (and I have no problem if you do) is nobody will see you.
