Running for home

[jacaldo]

Didn't quite know where to post this.
Presuming that we are able to travel sometime in the near/far future, how many of us would plan on spending time as liveaboards in a foreign country?
We only have to look at how foreigners have been treated when trying to find safe haven in this ongoing crisis, unable to enter marinas for water or food and when able to, finding they are stuck on board for the duration.
I follow a few youtube liveaboards that have perhaps made the mistake of thinking this would be over sooner rather than later, given the choice I'm sure they would prefer to be in their home country.
I understand there are many who have sold up and their boat is their only home. but will this put people off doing the same?

 

[V1701]

I had planned to sail to Portugal this year, not quite for a permanent move but to get a 5 year temporary residency while we're still in the Brexit transition period with a view to a more permanent move in a few more years time. I hope to still be able to do it...

 

[sailaboutvic]

I spend quite a lot of time replying to emails or talking to ocalls to day .
No one happy being locked where every they are but most of us understand the only way we going to get back sailing is if we stay put and wait till things get better .
One thing for sure , I have not talked or had emails where anyone suggested they been put off by what's happened and they plain to stop cruising .
Most live-aboard are use to problems and sorting them as they come alone so although we all having a moan about being locked in consider every thing mostly are dealing with it quite well .
As always there always a few who think no one has the right to stop them sailing in open waters , very few have managed to get away with it may haven't and had to suffer the consequences.
The frightening part for most of us , isn't that we may catch the virus while away from our own country ,
but not knowing when we going to be free to leave our winter marina , some have got the additional problem that from next mouth they will have to pay high mooring fees which they not budget for .
The general thinking amount cruiser is that although at some point country's will open up we may only be able to sail within the country we in for some time to come , although most seen ok with that.

 

[Goldie]

I had planned to sail to Portugal this year, not quite for a permanent move but to get a 5 year temporary residency while we're still in the Brexit transition period with a view to a more permanent move in a few more years time. I hope to still be able to do it...

Ditto!

 

[nortada]

I had planned to sail to Portugal this year, not quite for a permanent move but to get a 5 year temporary residency while we're still in the Brexit transition period with a view to a more permanent move in a few more years time. I hope to still be able to do it...

I suspect you may still be able to sail to Portugal before the end of this year but what would you do then

When you say permanent do you mean emigrate

By the way, I understand there have been cases of people just pitching up at the local council office in Lagos, with a completed application forum for residency BEFORE getting a berthing contract paying €15 per person, registering and getting a 5 year temporary residency.

Begs the question, once lockdown and quarantine is over and the council offices have reopened but before the Transition Period finishes a quick flight to Faro and train onto Lagos could be the answer.

Alternatively, you could register in Faro and save the train trip but Faro doesn't have an international marina so not sure of their approach to boat owners requesting residency in Faro. I understand residencia can only be obtained from the local council where you are 'resident'.

A comprehensive article on Portugal post Brexit (including the 4 page application form (in Portuguese and English)is at:- How To Become A Portuguese Citizen And Keep Your British Passport - All You Need To Know About Registering And Residency. A bit dated but still valid.

Another consideration is EU VAT. To retain your boats EU VAT status post Brexit, it is important for the vessel to be in EU waters on Brexit day.

Hope this all helps.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I had planned to sail to Portugal this year, not quite for a permanent move but to get a 5 year temporary residency while we're still in the Brexit transition period with a view to a more permanent move in a few more years time. I hope to still be able to do it...

It's going to be interesting to see what Italy does in 10 days times.
If we take a look at what's already happening in Europe quite a few have started to lift some restrictions,
It's not over by a long way , by it wouldn't surprise me to see internal country travel within the next four weeks in a lot of countries, in which case not long after you may get your wish .

 

[[3889]]

Ditto!

Me too.

I suspect you may still be able to sail to Portugal before the end of this year but what would you do then

When you say permanent do you mean emigrate

See what pans out. Ideally 5 years residency then citizenship. If not then look elsewhere.
I missed getting to my boat 1 day before lockdown, courtesy of Ryanair. Wish I'd made it. Been watching Youtubers locked down in Mar Menor and it looks a lot better option than Blighty.

 

[nortada]

It's going to be interesting to see what Italy does in 10 days times.
If we take a look at what's already happening in Europe quite a few have started to lift some restrictions,
It's not over by a long way , by it wouldn't surprise me to see internal country travel within the next four weeks in a lot of countries, in which case not long after you may get your wish .

Understand the Portugal Government is debating the way out of lockdown today and hopes to publish a route map in the near future. Problem is President supports continued lockdown, while the P with the economy in mind, wants to lift lockdown ASAP.

 

[jacaldo]

This is going slightly off thread. I was more interested in what cruisers think about future travel from area to area, country to country.

 

[nortada]

This is going slightly off thread. I was more interested in what cruisers think about future travel from area to area, country to country.

Clearly the hope is that we will be able to return to normal before too long. What more is there to say

 

[GHA]

This is going slightly off thread. I was more interested in what cruisers think about future travel from area to area, country to country.

As a full time cruiser yes, been thinking about that. I suspect there's a chance the heyday is over, just rocking up pretty much anywhere and wandering ashore to check in might never be the same again, least in a lot of places. Doesn't put me off one bit though, a bad day on the boat beats a good day living geographically trapped in bricks and mortar anytime

 

[sailaboutvic]

As a full time cruiser yes, been thinking about that. I suspect there's a chance the heyday is over, just rocking up pretty much anywhere and wandering ashore to check in might never be the same again, least in a lot of places. Doesn't put me off one bit though, a bad day on the boat beats a good day living geographically trapped in bricks and mortar anytime

I thînk many experience cruisers will just get on with it , what ever needs to be done some of us remember the days before the EU and it never put us off then , it's not going to put us off now .
One thing at time let get moving again first .

 

[geem]

This is going slightly off thread. I was more interested in what cruisers think about future travel from area to area, country to country.

I think it depends on where you expect to cruise. We are in the Caribbean. Most of the islands here have decrepit healthcare systems and no welfare. Grenada is working very hard to eradicate the virus. The islands are in lockdown. They have three ventilators for their whole population. If the virus was to spread here quickly you would have plenty of deaths. The chances of getting treatment if you caught it would be negligible. Grenada has no other mechanism to fight the virus other than lockdown. I cant see them lifting the border closure until there is a vaccine. We have decided to sail for home as I think cruising the Caribbean will be impossible for the foreseeable future. We will lay the boat up for a year or two then set off back here when the picture has improved.

 

[nortada]

I think it depends on where you expect to cruise. We are in the Caribbean. Most of the islands here have decrepit healthcare systems and no welfare. Grenada is working very hard to eradicate the virus. The islands are in lockdown. They have three ventilators for their whole population. If the virus was to spread here quickly you would have plenty of deaths. The chances of getting treatment if you caught it would be negligible. Grenada has no other mechanism to fight the virus other than lockdown. I cant see them lifting the border closure until there is a vaccine. We have decided to sail for home as I think cruising the Caribbean will be impossible for the foreseeable future. We will lay the boat up for a year or two then set off back here when the picture has improved.

Where is 'home'?

 

[V1701]

I suspect you may still be able to sail to Portugal before the end of this year but what would you do then

When you say permanent do you mean emigrate

By the way, I understand there have been cases of people just pitching up at the local council office in Lagos, with a completed application forum for residency BEFORE getting a berthing contract paying €15 per person, registering and getting a 5 year temporary residency.

Begs the question, once lockdown and quarantine is over and the council offices have reopened but before the Transition Period finishes a quick flight to Faro and train onto Lagos could be the answer.

Alternatively, you could register in Faro and save the train trip but Faro doesn't have an international marina so not sure of their approach to boat owners requesting residency in Faro. I understand residencia can only be obtained from the local council where you are 'resident'.

A comprehensive article on Portugal post Brexit (including the 4 page application form (in Portuguese and English)is at:- How To Become A Portuguese Citizen And Keep Your British Passport - All You Need To Know About Registering And Residency. A bit dated but still valid.

Another consideration is EU VAT. To retain your boats EU VAT status post Brexit, it is important for the vessel to be in EU waters on Brexit day.

Hope this all helps.

It certaibly does help, is much appreciated and encouraging. If I can get there and get a hold of a temp 5 year residency that gives me a bit of breathing space in which to work another year or two before leaving UK. At the moment most likely scenario would be to spend the last 3 of the 5 years temp residency actually in Portugal most of the time with the boat on a 12 month berthing contract and take it from there...

 

[t21]

Back to orig question, i think YES this may put off liveaboards, although this will maybe put everyone off doing ANYTHING much for a good while. I suppose people are beciming used to "doing without" and risk-averse has come to mean not daring to walk to neighbours and chat from the pavement etc.

French islands little more progressive - liveaboards are essentially glorified gypsies, all fine by them but regulated provided you are buying essential food (all food is essential) , or buying essential boat bits (= whatever is at shop) and I dunno if there is an equivalent word in English to "Plaisanciers". Fnch medical care somewhat better than UK I found because unlike UK, GPs are not the Guardians of Healthcare - you find a specialist you go see them. Prices v cheap too - for example and emergency SamU van to marina, all perfcet-english speaking paramedics hoik patient to back of van, off to hospital, re-fit dislocated shoulder and sling was only €158 euros inclusing the sling! Can't I'd recommend it of course, and as I said in the back of the ambulance it could have been worse. It could have been Me! Paramedic appalledheyho. Actually tho I cd do the boat thing she couldn't so it was true. Calling a spade a fcking shovel for digging graves, Yorkshire innit. Bluff Yorkshireman see? Or as others might say "Very rude"....

 

[nortada]

It certaibly does help, is much appreciated and encouraging. If I can get there and get a hold of a temp 5 year residency that gives me a bit of breathing space in which to work another year or two before leaving UK. At the moment most likely scenario would be to spend the last 3 of the 5 years temp residency actually in Portugal most of the time with the boat on a 12 month berthing contract and take it from there...

Looking to the future, when your 5 year residency expires you should then qualify for 10 year residency.

 

[geem]

A friend who has lived in the Caribbean on a boat for a number of years say that all the liveaboards go to Martinique for healthcare but all the locals in Martinique fly to France for their treatment. Having been in hospital in Martinique for a month I can say that the treatment is good but the hospital has to be seen to be believed. It would be condemned in the UK. You dont get a pillow, water or a sheet to cover you. The food is disgusting. My wife brought me food in each day as it was so bad. Not an experience I wish to repeat

 

[Zing]

A friend who has lived in the Caribbean on a boat for a number of years say that all the liveaboards go to Martinique for healthcare but all the locals in Martinique fly to France for their treatment. Having been in hospital in Martinique for a month I can say that the treatment is good but the hospital has to be seen to be believed. It would be condemned in the UK. You dont get a pillow, water or a sheet to cover you. The food is disgusting. My wife brought me food in each day as it was so bad. Not an experience I wish to repeat

Yes. I thought the French didn’t do colonies. They actually disown that word, yet the main hospital in Guadeloupe on the wards is pretty clearly not first world France. Not third world either though. I was there 24 hrs with an emergency and got minimal care, left for 5 hours alone on a trolley in a corridor where I passed out completely unnoticed and then kicked out early, without full tests being done and barely conscious and stumbling due to morphine. I would avoid if at all possible.

 

[geem]

Yes. I thought the French didn’t do colonies. They actually disown that word, yet the main hospital in Guadeloupe on the wards is pretty clearly not first world France. Not third world either though. I was there 24 hrs with an emergency and got minimal care, left for 5 hours alone on a trolley in a corridor where I passed out completely unnoticed and then kicked out early, without full tests being done and barely conscious and stumbling due to morphine. I would avoid if at all possible.

I had two stints in their version of A&E. 13 hours on a trolley in a corridor first time. Sent me out after making an incision in my leg without anaesthetic and the wrong antibiotics. I was back five days later for a 12 hour stint on a trolley in a corridor before they
admitted me to a ward.