Metalicmike
Active member
Just discovered this Spanish directive stating all boats Spanish flagged or not with a Spanish home port must conform to Spanish safety regulations. 
Royal decree 339/2021
- Thread starter Metalicmike
- Start date
justanothersailboat
Well-known member
NOT with a Spanish home port? (hmm, that invites misparsing)
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Wansworth
Well-known member
Not particularly arduous atJust discovered this Spanish directive stating all boats Spanish flagged or not with a Spanish home port must conform to Spanish safety regulations.
ash2020
Active member
Seems sensible.Just discovered this Spanish directive stating all boats Spanish flagged or not with a Spanish home port must conform to Spanish safety regulations.
Buck Turgidson
Well-known member
Need to be careful with your interpretation.
"Regarding the novelties included in this Royal Decree, developed in six chapters and several final provisions, the extension of its scope of application stands out (art. 2), which will be extended: (i) to recreational vessels that are registered or pre-registered in Spain; (ii) to those that carry out an activity for commercial or lucrative purposes in maritime waters in which Spain exercises sovereignty, sovereign rights or jurisdiction, regardless of their flag State; (iii) and that navigate in Spanish internal maritime waters or the Spanish territorial sea, regardless of their flag State, and that are owned or have their use and enjoyment, natural or legal persons with residence or registered office in Spain."
I'm a foreign resident with foreign flagged boat so it does not apply to me.
"Regarding the novelties included in this Royal Decree, developed in six chapters and several final provisions, the extension of its scope of application stands out (art. 2), which will be extended: (i) to recreational vessels that are registered or pre-registered in Spain; (ii) to those that carry out an activity for commercial or lucrative purposes in maritime waters in which Spain exercises sovereignty, sovereign rights or jurisdiction, regardless of their flag State; (iii) and that navigate in Spanish internal maritime waters or the Spanish territorial sea, regardless of their flag State, and that are owned or have their use and enjoyment, natural or legal persons with residence or registered office in Spain."
I'm a foreign resident with foreign flagged boat so it does not apply to me.
William_H
Well-known member
It is possible that some particular part of safety requirements are onerous. (like carrying in date flares) but generally I think regulations are worth complying with for your own and your guests safety even if they do not apply to you. ol'will
Metalicmike
Active member
My reason for raising this was to call on the wealth of knowledge here and maybe get some clarification. Very often legislation in Mainland Spain differs in the Canaries. I understood that there was a requirement for Inspections by a surveyor (not sure of the frequency).
colind3782
Well-known member
I am also a UK resident with a UK flagged boat in Spain. When this came out I had a look at it and decided to comply anyway as a lot of it made sense and wasn't too difficult.
Stemar
Well-known member
That strikes me as a sensible approach. Claiming to be exempt on a technicality may not work on a pedantic local harbourmaster with only a sketchy understanding of the rules. You may win eventually, but at what cost in time, money and hassle?
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
We also have a safety regulation that requires boats to be inspected very year for compliance with the regulations.
As this is a requirement in law any inspection is to IMHO to ensure that you are complying with the law of the country you are in either visiting or by residence.
As this is a check that you are complying with the laws, just like the diving and tax laws it is up to the state to provide the facilities and personal to perform these inspections, just like the police do on the roads.
The issue I see is that we boat owner are seen as a rich bunch and so the authorities try to pass the cost of these inspections on to the boat owner, whereas the cost should be for the authorities and no those being inspected for compliance with the laws of the country.
Our authority call this inspection a "service" but it is a service I do not wont or require as I can determine if my boat complies with the legal requirements just like the roadworthy of my motor car so why should I pay for an MOT test in the UK as this is verifying that I have kept my car in roadworthy condition, correctly licensed ,insured and the driver has the correct driving license
Comment please.
As this is a requirement in law any inspection is to IMHO to ensure that you are complying with the law of the country you are in either visiting or by residence.
As this is a check that you are complying with the laws, just like the diving and tax laws it is up to the state to provide the facilities and personal to perform these inspections, just like the police do on the roads.
The issue I see is that we boat owner are seen as a rich bunch and so the authorities try to pass the cost of these inspections on to the boat owner, whereas the cost should be for the authorities and no those being inspected for compliance with the laws of the country.
Our authority call this inspection a "service" but it is a service I do not wont or require as I can determine if my boat complies with the legal requirements just like the roadworthy of my motor car so why should I pay for an MOT test in the UK as this is verifying that I have kept my car in roadworthy condition, correctly licensed ,insured and the driver has the correct driving license
Comment please.
William_H
Well-known member
Fortunately here in West Oz the authorities do not require an annual inspection of boat for safety gear. They have the laws of requirements but rely on ad hoc checks. Fine by me. However my Yacht Club require meeting of Cat 7 safety gear requirements as set by Yachting Australia for racing. That involves a certification each year by me. No real problem. https://cdn.revolutionise.com.au/site/3iga7ijoamqagvnv.pdf However yes the authoritiess (government) seem convinced that boating people are rich and can afford to pay for all the facilities SAR etc via registration fees. No discounts for seniors. ol'will
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
I have no objection to any inspection to ensure I am complying with the rule of law like on the roads, but I do object to paying a fee to the authorities to check I am complying with the laws the authorities set up.
I my business I had to collect VAT and would have to be audited by the authorities to ensure I complied with the laws, but I was never charging a fee for the audit, just a fine if I failed the audit.
I would have no issue with that, and we do have the port Police who can do ad hoc checks and if found deficient will issue a summons to court
Is Cat 7 safety gear requirement only for racing and does a boat who is not a racing boat but just a cruising boat have to comply with the cat 7 requirements
That is interesting and any sensible boat owner would have similar kind of safety gear anyway
Discount no government will give any senior discount I even have to pay tax on my pensions local any my UK pensions
Refueler
Well-known member
As others have mention other states reqt's ... its interesting comparing.
Here in Latvia - to register the boat as Latvian - if the boat is for personal use only and not for hire or commercial activity - then it has an initial inspection to comply with Latvian Rules but that's all ... no follow up inspections unless they have information that indicates non compliance - or boat changes category / usage. Inspection as I had came down to them requesting I change my Pump to Sea toilet to holding tank or other such as chemical type.... and two lifebuoys instead of one..... lifejackets for registered number of persons allowed to be on board.
If the boat is for commercial use such as rental / hire trips etc - then it has annual inspection and stricter safety rules ...
Here in Latvia - to register the boat as Latvian - if the boat is for personal use only and not for hire or commercial activity - then it has an initial inspection to comply with Latvian Rules but that's all ... no follow up inspections unless they have information that indicates non compliance - or boat changes category / usage. Inspection as I had came down to them requesting I change my Pump to Sea toilet to holding tank or other such as chemical type.... and two lifebuoys instead of one..... lifejackets for registered number of persons allowed to be on board.
If the boat is for commercial use such as rental / hire trips etc - then it has annual inspection and stricter safety rules ...
dunedin
Well-known member
If you choose to live in another country, you need to accept their rules. Or return to your native country if prefer.
It is impolite to complain when a guest.
Refueler
Well-known member
But surely that's the case whether its Road ... Boat ... whatever ...
Car MOT (technical Roadworthiness) is by Govt decree and you pay.
Boat Safety Inspection / Compliance is by Govt decree and you pay.
I've never heard of a free Compliance Inspection ... other than one you can conduct yourself ... but even then you often have a Submission or Documentary Admin fee ....
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
That is my point it is Govt decree and my point it is not my choice and I an capable to determine if my Car is Road worthy. and in my country, I can as in he UK by the police to determine if my car is correctly licensed and road worthy at no cost to me
I contend that as Boat Safety Inspection / Compliance is by Govt decree, and you pay the ost should be paid out of our taxes and not a service as it is NOT a service it is by Govt decree just like any other law and enforcement of the country.
If my car is on the public road and is found to be unroadworthy I will be summoned to court and if found guilty will be fined that to me is how the law works not by imposing stealth taxes on those who have charges imposed on, them by imposition of laws.
Well, I am a citizen so do have the right to vote, like I do in the UK
We have an act of parlement caller the Public Finance Management Act and an annual budget that defines what money from aur taxes are used for.
We also have a constitution that gives us citizens certain rights of protection from abuses by the state similar to the EU bill of rights.
I accept that my car and boat must be in a safe condition to use in a public space but object to paying a fee for the authorities to simply confirm my car or boat comply with the law of the country.
It's just another way for the govt to shirk its responsory and expenses the govt is libel for
If you disagree, why do you pay taxes and what are host taxes for. My answer if for the govt to administer and enforce the laws the govt has put in place to Safegard the citizens of the country, which is the duty of the govt just like the money used to pay for the army, Navy and Airforce as well as the police force to investigate anyone who beaks the law of the land.
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
No response to the above.
The government of the country you live in have a duty to protect the citizens and collect taxes to protect its citizens by having a national health service in the UK we have private health service.
We have a police service to prevent crime and a defense force to repel any invasions and a pension for the old and many other services that the government provide from the taxes we all pay to the government.
Also, it the government are required to pay for the inspections to comply with the laws the government put in place there may be a different position just like any company or person wish to buy but may not be justifiable or affordable.
When the government do not have to pay for the inspections imposed by the law the would be no limitation on what the government can impose as there is no cast to the government and the money can be used else ware
The government of the country you live in have a duty to protect the citizens and collect taxes to protect its citizens by having a national health service in the UK we have private health service.
We have a police service to prevent crime and a defense force to repel any invasions and a pension for the old and many other services that the government provide from the taxes we all pay to the government.
Also, it the government are required to pay for the inspections to comply with the laws the government put in place there may be a different position just like any company or person wish to buy but may not be justifiable or affordable.
When the government do not have to pay for the inspections imposed by the law the would be no limitation on what the government can impose as there is no cast to the government and the money can be used else ware