RNLI vs Daily Mail

JumbleDuck said:
That really is a bit rich, you know.

Sybarite clearly has strong views but he puts them courteously and supports them with figures. It would help the debate if counter-arguments could maintain the courtesy and supply alternative figures. The constant refrain of "you're stupid ... you're ignorant ... you don't understand anything" is wearying and unproductive.
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Well put!
 
skipper_stu said:
I used to do that in Germany too! The fraulein that I was seeing at the time, blue eyed blond haired gennydd mawr (Cymrogwyllt knows what that means!) used to look at me with horror! Is it a fineable offence?
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€5, I believe. I've never been fined, but at that rate it would be well worth it.
 
Perhaps we can have some consensus and harmony on the forum by agreeing thank heavens we don't have the French system, where despite charitable donations and Government tax payers subsidy you still have to pay to have your boat rescued:D
 
jordanbasset said:
Perhaps we can have some consensus and harmony on the forum by agreeing thank heavens we don't have the French system, where despite charitable donations and Government tax payers subsidy you still have to pay to have your boat rescued:D
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You think that you don't pay for rescues? Where do you think that the £700 odd million came from? The only difference is that you paid in advance whereas in France you pay (only with respect to the boat) when you need to. The rate is strictly at cost as the SNSM is not allowed to make a profit and they even have to take flack from commercial towing concerns who claim that the SNSM undercuts them. Also in France the majority of tows will be covered by insurance. The government I believe has recently increased its contribution from the previous rate of 8% of revenues - NB these are French revenues which are about 1/10th of RNLI revenues which means that the French governmental subsidy would probably be less than 1% of the RNLI's revenues.

Also the French government is required by law to ensure that an adequate life-saving service is in place. This obligation is delegated to the SNSM which is a private charity.

While we are at it I read a report from an SNSM centre referring to the number of unpaid towing invoices they had with British yachtsmen.
 
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Sybarite said:
Adjustment of pension liability : cost for the year............. (£67.9 m)
Or more than twice the SNSM’s annual operating budget)

Excess of costs over revenues for the year .......................... (£32.7 m)
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You do seem to be trying to suggest that the pension deficit is the result of poor management when the reality is pension fund balances are largely out of the control of the company even though they have to find the 'lost' money. For some very good reasons pension funds are not managed by the employer so investing choices which fail are not directly the responsibility of the employers management. Equally changes in valuation methods made by both government bodies and accounting bodies can make dramatic changes in the apparent value of a pension fund and how and when the deficit should be made up. To make any real judgement on this we would also have to see the financial state of the pension fund. It could actually suggest that the management of the RNLI is actually being prudent and a good employer
 
Juan Twothree said:
Could you please enlighten us as to which stations are currently closed?
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No, I have handed over critical scrutiny of the RNLI to professional mainstream media. My job is done on this matter as it is with the UK Coastguard and Royal Navy.

I am a forward looking social commentator, there are more worthy matters.
 
dom said:
Somewhat as an aside, UK workers benefit from one of the lowest state pensions in the OECD. They can look forward to 29% of average earnings compared to 74% in France. .
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Just seen this.

I wish..!!

French pensions were capped at 58% of the average earnings of the previous 25 years earnings then capped again at a ceiling. The French don't have a funded pension scheme; their system is by "répartition".

Current employee contributions pay for pensions.
 
Seajet said:
The NHS is magnificent,not 100% perfect but something the UK can be very proud of.
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Still I think if I were going to be ill I would prefer that it be in France. My sister who had a lifetime of service in the NHS visited us in France. I took her on a tour of some of the facilities here and she was flabbergasted.

Eg when our youngest daughter was born there were water bed relaxation massages for both the mother and the baby - and the possibility in the ensuing months to come in for more if she felt like it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNR_6UuVl4s
 
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jordanbasset said:
I was only trying to bring a little harmony to the forum
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Nice try but whilst "RNLI: the charity that runs a free towing service for the leisure boater" might be be said to be a more realistic strap line than the current one, I'm not sure that it would attract quite as much in the way of donations.
 
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You will have to explain that one also. How do we pay up front? The lifeboat will tow you home for nothing even in non life threatening situations?
 
robertj said:
You will have to explain that one also. How do we pay up front? The lifeboat will tow you home for nothing even in non life threatening situations?
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Somebody had to pay money in in order to build up reserves to the level they are now at. It may not have been you personally but others have paid on your behalf. The RNLI is being generous with donated funds.
 
robertj said:
You will have to explain that one also. How do we pay up front? The lifeboat will tow you home for nothing even in non life threatening situations?
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Isn't it the "done thing" to make a generous contribution after the event, if you're ever in that position?
 
Sybarite said:
Just seen this.

I wish..!!

French pensions were capped at 58% of the average earnings of the previous 25 years earnings then capped again at a ceiling. The French don't have a funded pension scheme; their system is by "répartition".

Current employee contributions pay for pensions.
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According to the OECD and the French Stat Office (INSEE) the net French state pension replacement rate is 70%, 74.5% and 69% for pensioners at 0.5x, 1.0x, and 1.5x mean French income. Comparable numbers for the UK are 52%, 29% and 21%.

I am no expert on this but (I think) the comparison goes something like this:

France runs a 3-pillar system: State (Retraite De Base), Compulsory Supplementary, and Voluntary (Collective + Individual).

The French State Pension is (with tweaks) based upon the average inflation adjusted 25 highest paid years in the person's career with a cap at 50% of the social security ceiling (EUR39,852?); i.e. EUR19,926. The UK’s is around £6,500, soon rising to around £7,500.

In addition all French employees benefit from a compulsory supplementary (retraite complémentaire): Arrco, Agric, CNAVPL, etc. some of which required bailouts recently. There is also a minimum to prevent poverty which skews the statistical average in both the UK and France.

Finally, there are over 36 distinct compulsory French retirement schemes, including the 20 ‘special regimes’ covering specific industries, worker groups, and some large semi-nationalised companies such as the SNCF. Each has its own idiosyncrasies and for all I know SNSM volunteers get something somewhere! The new French Government accepts that this system is entirely unsustainable at 14.5% of French GDP and rising, hence the reforms currently underway.

Edit: this is not dissimilar to the RNLI/SNSM debate, intricate country-specific stuff most unsuitable for pub-style comparisons.
 
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