Registering a yacht in Italy under SSR

[tchierici]

Hi,
My dad and I want to register a yacht under British flag (SSR). I am a British citizen resident in the UK, my dad is Italian resident in Italy. The boat is in Italy and was in Greek waters at the time of Brexit change of rules.
Can we do that? Even if it means registering the boat under my sole name, would he be allowed to sail it without me?

 

[MapisM]

I think the short answer is yes.
In fact, in the event of a control, your father can say that the British owner (who happens to be his son, but that's irrelevant) granted him occasional FoC use of the boat - which in fact would be the truth, if I understand correctly?
Mind, if the boat is above 10m LOA or 40hp power, your dad must have an Italian boat license (which isn't required for Brit citizens) while cruising Italian waters, even if the boat isn't IT flagged.
Maybe, check also that your insurance would be valid also when he's helming without you.

 

[Tranona]

Hi,
My dad and I want to register a yacht under British flag (SSR). I am a British citizen resident in the UK, my dad is Italian resident in Italy. The boat is in Italy and was in Greek waters at the time of Brexit change of rules.
Can we do that? Even if it means registering the boat under my sole name, would he be allowed to sail it without me?

You might get away with it but strictly speaking the SSR is intended for boats based in the UK and owned by private UK residents. However many UK residents own boats outside the UK and use the SSR. The problems for you will likely be around your father's use. I assume that the boat is owned by you with all documents including insurance in your name and that you are the main user in which case there is nothing to stop your father from occasional use, but I guess he might attract attention if he is a regular and frequent user of a UK registered boat which he does not seem to own.

 

[Irish Rover]

You might get away with it but strictly speaking the SSR is intended for boats based in the UK and owned by private UK residents.

Is that really so? The SSR website says
"The Small Ships Register (Part 3) has been developed for UK pleasure vessel owners who may wish to take their vessel into international waters and want the peace of mind that they can prove the vessel’s nationality easily."

 

[MapisM]

I guess he might attract attention if he is a regular and frequent user of a UK registered boat which he does not seem to own.

Attention from who?
The OP said the boat is in Italy, and being myself Italian I struggle to think of any particular attention his dad could attract from the local authorities.
BTW, in this respect the fact that the owner is a foreigner but also happens to be his son is likely to be seen as a sound justification, even if not supported by any letter of the law.
I mean, if his dad would repeatedly be found using a UK flagged boat owned by an unknown company, they might well suspect that he is the actual owner, using some tricks to avoid declaring the boat (which in Italy you're obliged to do, if you own a non-IT flagged boat).
But in this case, it's self explanatory that this is not the case, so to speak...

 

[Tranona]

Is that really so? The SSR website says
"The Small Ships Register (Part 3) has been developed for UK pleasure vessel owners who may wish to take their vessel into international waters and want the peace of mind that they can prove the vessel’s nationality easily."

That was the original intention and the lack of clarity of the eligibility requirements (particularly definition of residence and ownership) led to abuse. The latest rules have addressed this and evidence is required of ownership which was previously self declaration and residence more tightly defined. The rules now allow the boat to be based anywhere whereas the original rules were silent on this. They are silent on who may use the boat, but everything written assumes that the owner(s) is also the user. All owners must be eligible.

Somewhere buried in my old lecture notes I have a transcript of the Hansard entry covering the original introduction in parliament which clearly describes that the register was being introduced to give any easier mechanism for UK boat owners to meet flag state registration requirements when visiting other states, in particular France where it was a legal requirement, quite apart from a requirement under maritime law.

All water under the bridge and the OP can do as he suggests provided it is clear that only he owns the boat. MapisM suggests that there will be no problems from the Italian side and I only raised this because that was not the case in some other states where the SSR was used by some to avoid the far more stringent local state requirements.

 

[MapisM]

MapisM suggests that there will be no problems from the Italian side

For sake of clarity, fiscally residents in Italy must include in their fiscal declaration any boats registered abroad (and their value) either owned, or of which they are just beneficial owners.
So, arguably that's something the OP father should do in this case, as beneficial owner.
BTW, this is just an informative obligation that doesn't generate any taxable basis, so he might as well do it, if he's CYA minded.

My previous suggestion which you summarized as "no problems" was just based on the consideration that in practice, in the event of a check, the OP father can simply say that he's helping his son with a boat transfer, maintenance, whatever - hence not as a somewhat permanent beneficial owner.
I can't imagine any local authority arguing with that, as long as he has an Italian license and a valid T.P. insurance.

Then again, if the OP father goes out with the boat full of booze and fishing gear every other day, passing in front of a Guardia di Finanza office, and eventually is notified for a missing declaration of the boat as beneficial owner, I will not contribute to refund him any possible penalties he might be charged with!

 

[tchierici]

For sake of clarity, fiscally residents in Italy must include in their fiscal declaration any boats registered abroad (and their value) either owned, or of which they are just beneficial owners.
So, arguably that's something the OP father should do in this case, as beneficial owner.
BTW, this is just an informative obligation that doesn't generate any taxable basis, so he might as well do it, if he's CYA minded.

My previous suggestion which you summarized as "no problems" was just based on the consideration that in practice, in the event of a check, the OP father can simply say that he's helping his son with a boat transfer, maintenance, whatever - hence not as a somewhat permanent beneficial owner.
I can't imagine any local authority arguing with that, as long as he has an Italian license and a valid T.P. insurance.

Then again, if the OP father goes out with the boat full of booze and fishing gear every other day, passing in front of a Guardia di Finanza office, and eventually is notified for a missing declaration of the boat as beneficial owner, I will not contribute to refund him any possible penalties he might be charged with!

So in short I understand having the boat registered under my sole name and dad making use of it won’t cause a problem providing he can prove his my dad. He is in possession of a valid Italian sailing license as well.

 

[billskip]

So in short I understand having the boat registered under my sole name and dad making use of it won’t cause a problem providing he can prove his my dad. He is in possession of a valid Italian sailing license as well.

Yes, also he is qualified with declaration of interest. My understanding is that it's the same, very similar, here in Spain.

 

[MapisM]

So in short I understand having the boat registered under my sole name and dad making use of it won’t cause a problem providing he can prove his my dad.

Yes and no. What I said is that boat papers showing that the owner is his son...
"is likely to be seen as a sound justification [of the fact that he's using the boat], even if not supported by any letter of the law".

The actual letter of the law is that anyone fiscally resident in Italy who owns or is the beneficial owner (regardless of how/why) of a boat registered abroad must declare it in his fiscal declaration (in the so-called "quadro RW" section, to be precise).
BUT, I'm not aware of any formal criteria meant to draw the line between a "beneficial owner" and someone using the boat for whatever occasional/spot reason.

In other words, for your dad, I think the fact that the boat is owned by his son can be seen as a sort of informal justification that he's using her without being a regular beneficial owner and having declared her accordingly.
Then again, if he would be found repeatedly enjoying the boat, possibly together with other friends of his who have nothing to see with the boat owner, I wouldn't be surprised if someone would argue that he's actually a full flagged beneficial owner, following the substance over form principle.
Rather unlikely imho, but... You pays your money, etc.

 

[Hooligan]

My experience of Italy - as a traveller there frequently and having owned a SSR registered boat (I am English living in U.K.) based in Italy - is that it could not have been more relaxed in almost every aspect. Now I was based in Southern Italy where cash is the main currency of any transaction, no matter how formal. I was stopped once, outside Syracuse. The coast guard spoke only Italian. I gave him an English document that he couldn’t read and note no relation to what I suspect he was asking for. We had a conversation that neither of us understood until we got onto Football. He was a Napoli fan. We then shook hands and he left. I have no idea why I was stopped. Ergo - do not stress. Italy is a wonderfully pragmatic country at least in my view. If only every place was like this. But perhaps I got lucky and of course southern Italy is very different to N Italy.