steve yates
Well-Known Member
For me its the hull I’ll be sanding, but there may be a boat next to me and dont want to cover him in dust!
Random orbital sander with dust extraction. - what’s the best?
- Thread starter Minerva
- Start date
fredrussell
Well-Known Member
This is a very timely warning - I was planning to remove old varnish from my heads door this weekend using a very powerful Metabo orbital sander (as mentioned above by Poignard - I bought it from him). I shall refrain from using the P40 Abranet discs left over from stripping antifoul prior to copper coating a few months back.
Minerva
Well-Known Member
In the end I found using a carbide scraper worked admirably. Managed to get round the saloon over a few wet days on anchor in the summer.
The saloon is now looking great!
mjcp
Well-Known Member
Late to the party, but my setup for bottom sanding (and occasional MDF / wood etc at home) is
Mafell 150mm sander
Orbital Disk Sander EVA 150 E / 5 in T-MAX - GB | Orbital Disk Sander EVA 150 E / 5 in T-MAX - GB | 917741
Extracted to a cheap Titan wet/dry vac. Clearly not a great destination; not class L or M, so the dust will still be an issue!
So I then wear a higher end half face mask from 3M. *
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/p/d/v101711008/
*PROVIDES A2P3 RESPIRATORY PROTECTION - A2 protection against certain organic gases and vapours such as solvent based paint, adhesive and cleaning detergents, and P3 protection with 99% particulate filtration at medium levels of fine dust and mist
I don't do indoor sanding, only out door and only ad-hoc, so the "weak link" of the dust extraction is something I an at peace with ...
The Mafell is silky smooth - no vibration issues with my hands, Its light enough for a days use under the boat and its not overly noisy (I wear ear protection).
M
Mafell 150mm sander
Orbital Disk Sander EVA 150 E / 5 in T-MAX - GB | Orbital Disk Sander EVA 150 E / 5 in T-MAX - GB | 917741
Extracted to a cheap Titan wet/dry vac. Clearly not a great destination; not class L or M, so the dust will still be an issue!
So I then wear a higher end half face mask from 3M. *
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/p/d/v101711008/
*PROVIDES A2P3 RESPIRATORY PROTECTION - A2 protection against certain organic gases and vapours such as solvent based paint, adhesive and cleaning detergents, and P3 protection with 99% particulate filtration at medium levels of fine dust and mist
I don't do indoor sanding, only out door and only ad-hoc, so the "weak link" of the dust extraction is something I an at peace with ...
The Mafell is silky smooth - no vibration issues with my hands, Its light enough for a days use under the boat and its not overly noisy (I wear ear protection).
M
xyachtdave
Well-Known Member
Sounds great for you, my concern would be for your neighbour in the boatyard that’s not togged up for dry sanding anti foul.
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
Best, and best value are probably different - and the form factor also comes into it. I have not used one but understand that Mirka/3M are the best - the reason I don't have one is the price.
I have two Bosch GEX turbo - 150 & 125mm. Both are great for dust extraction. I also have a Dewalt 125mm as it's a smaller machine. It's noiser and not as smooth or comfortable as the Bosch, but the dust extraction is good, it's smaller, and at around £100 is a fair price.
It is important to have good dust extraction, L class is best if you are using it inddor, but I have an M class Vacmaster and use HEPA bags which does great. Being 30ltr and having good suction it is a beast and has been well worth it in our refit.
I have two Bosch GEX turbo - 150 & 125mm. Both are great for dust extraction. I also have a Dewalt 125mm as it's a smaller machine. It's noiser and not as smooth or comfortable as the Bosch, but the dust extraction is good, it's smaller, and at around £100 is a fair price.
It is important to have good dust extraction, L class is best if you are using it inddor, but I have an M class Vacmaster and use HEPA bags which does great. Being 30ltr and having good suction it is a beast and has been well worth it in our refit.
geem
Well-Known Member
....
The price is hard to swallow, but if I ever had to sand the bottom again, I would buy the Makita equivalent of the Mirka. Both professional machines but some twin filters on the Makita with autochange over and an alarm to tell you are good features. I also like Makita stuff.
If you are sanding the underside of a boat, the importance of lightness and quality of dust extraction increase tenfold. I think the Mirka kit we borrowed is circa £600. The lightness of the sander is dramatically better than our Bosch GEX250. The length of the extraction hose on the Mirka made everything so much easier.
The price is hard to swallow, but if I ever had to sand the bottom again, I would buy the Makita equivalent of the Mirka. Both professional machines but some twin filters on the Makita with autochange over and an alarm to tell you are good features. I also like Makita stuff.
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
I didn't think Makita had a sander like the Mirka, I thought theirs was in the Bosch style. I like the 'turbo' sanders, especially for material removal, but I also have a smaller, lighter sander for the reasosns you mention. I have a number of sanders, they tend to keep growing in my collection!
BTW, Rutlands does a nice hose kit, mine is 5mtr. The standard one was fine, but I wanted one that didn't snag. We are doing a lot of work as we are refitting, so the details that I would ignore with one or two jobs starts to matter.
ashtead
Well-Known Member
You might look at DSG engineering website - my recollection is our decorators use Mirka but as said I recall they were pricey but for internal walls etc he thought best and I suspect he has sanded more walls etc than I ever will.
steve yates
Well-Known Member
So it looks like for sanding a hull with dust extracted to a vac you need to be spending £400 or up for a decent sander?
I was expecting it would be closer to the £100-£150 mark, but then the two orbitals I have were about £35-£40 from amazon.
I was expecting it would be closer to the £100-£150 mark, but then the two orbitals I have were about £35-£40 from amazon.
Blueboatman
Well-Known Member
Fear not, it CAN be done with a £25 Lidl special and a set of earplugs.
And then theres the sensible way as suggested above..
Years and years ago in a boatyard there was a Black and Decker hand electric planer that became the equivalent of the village bike and simply refused to die. Though it sounded like murder was being committed.
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
There is a huge and very noticable difefrence between good & bad when it comes to sanding, and it's fairly linear with price (excluding Festool).
If doing a lot of work, or it's your profession, then having a good sander will save time & money in the long run, and thereore the intial price get's somewhat offset - and you definitely can't put a price on your lungs, so go good on the dust extraction.
I have a Ryobi sander and it's fine for the occasional job, but in reality I just don't use it anymore. The others I have are faster, quieter, better balanced and have less vibration, so I grab those first.
Another important aspect is the abrasive. It took me a while to get this, at first I baulked at the price of abrasives and bought the cheap packs from Amazon. Eventually, after much frustration with changing pads far too often I bought some good ones (Abranet and 3M), and it was a transformation due to how long they last. I am currently trying the mesh ceramic from Rutlands and am pleased with the price point & perfromance, so will likely stay with those for a while.
mjcp
Well-Known Member
Fair point, In my defence, its a small yard and there are not often others in proximity at the same time.
Looking online, there are class M extractors £120-£160, might be time to fire up the blackfriday card!
M
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
Yes, plenty of deals to be had. I picked up a V-Tuf M class 20 ltr as a little 'boat vac' to save lugging the big one around. On eBay, ex-display £100. It almost didn't make it to the boat as the other half got hold of it and loved the extendable hose, so it nearly became the house vac!
xyachtdave
Well-Known Member
To be fair too, my Festool setup is used at work and was purchased through my business.
A different proposition laying out a £1k of your own money for it of course!
thinwater
Well-Known Member
For bottoms, the local yard uses Bosch GET65 and GET55. Monsters for removing layers of bottom paint.
For insides, I bought a Makita BO5041, based on the recommendation of a local boat building school. Very nice. Very ergonomic. Fast removal with coarse paper. Quite good with a bag, better with a vacuum.
For insides, I bought a Makita BO5041, based on the recommendation of a local boat building school. Very nice. Very ergonomic. Fast removal with coarse paper. Quite good with a bag, better with a vacuum.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
I have a Bosch which decided to slo0w down and now hardly works ! I nipped out to check Lidl just in case they had something ... and I was lucky ...
My orbital now is that Lidl machine ... as another says - its noisy, vibrates a lot so your hand tends to buzz for a while after prolonged use ... but it works.
To stop sanding pads slipping on the velcro ... a neat trick :
Take a Hot Glue gun and put dollops at each corner on the sander ... press the sanding pad on .. let it cool a few secs ... you will find pad now stays in place. But you can still easily remove ... you can peel the Hot Glue off and make new for next pad etc.
My orbital now is that Lidl machine ... as another says - its noisy, vibrates a lot so your hand tends to buzz for a while after prolonged use ... but it works.
To stop sanding pads slipping on the velcro ... a neat trick :
Take a Hot Glue gun and put dollops at each corner on the sander ... press the sanding pad on .. let it cool a few secs ... you will find pad now stays in place. But you can still easily remove ... you can peel the Hot Glue off and make new for next pad etc.
fredrussell
Well-Known Member
Just to add to the discussion, when I sanded bottom paint of my boat a few months back I purchased on of these:
ONCCI Professional Filter... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07HGW7DTJ?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
It attaches to any collection tub or barrel and none of the removed paint ends up in the hoover bag. Very effective if you’re using a domestic vacuum cleaner for dust extraction.
ONCCI Professional Filter... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07HGW7DTJ?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
It attaches to any collection tub or barrel and none of the removed paint ends up in the hoover bag. Very effective if you’re using a domestic vacuum cleaner for dust extraction.
Mister E
Well-Known Member
I have found that for the best dust extraction that the holes in the disc and the backing pad need to be positioned correctly.
Even a few miles out makes a difference.
If you are pressing realy hard or not using it flat then you are using the wrong disc type.
Even a few miles out makes a difference.
If you are pressing realy hard or not using it flat then you are using the wrong disc type.
Fr J Hackett
Well-Known Member
The reason discs don't stay on the pad is because you have destroyed the velcro either through age or pressing too hard. The pads tend to be expensive to replace so people ( those that are aware) use pad savers which are effectively sacrificial pads that are used in-between the disc and pad and are much cheaper than pads.