Radio .......How would you have handled this incedent?

[Duster]

These days I do not often switch the VHF on, the coastguard stations seem remote, the inshore forecast is usually excessively pessimistic and get a bit bored with listening to boaters calling friends, usually to no effect and "Jimmy fishermen" cursing and swearing, so I am out of practice in using it.

On Tuesday I was out fishing with a friend in the Gulf of Corryvreckcan when we spotted a few items floating towards us. First was an inflated but empty life jacket, then a parcel of food followed by an empty but inverted canoe. We recovered them, moved the boat out of the rather extreme tidal conditions, switched on the VHF and I called the coastguard on 16. Got told by Belfast to stand by on 67 after 10+ minutes of no reply, assuming that it to be the usual west coast indolence, I called again to be told to standby as they were casualty working elsewhere, so I waited and we carried on fishing.

Eventually they came back to me, I explained what we had found, where and when etc. They had no reports of the items lost or anyone missing and decided to call a full Mayday and called out the Coastguard helicopter and the Islay lifeboat.

After half an hour or so of searching, they stood down the search and we got a report from them that the owner had been found and was safe. A young man phoned me the next morning to arrange to collect his things, apparently he was alone, had capsized near the shore, got very cold, struggled to swim in his life jacket so abandoned it, managed to get ashore on Jura (which is very sparsely populated) and had a long walk to find help.

It occurred to me later that had it been a true emergency, my patient approach might have cost critical time. Should I have called it in as a "Security" or just ignored the request to standby, talked over the top of them and relayed what I had found on 16?

What would you have done?.....me for future I've put the Coastguard phone number into my phone.

Regards mikej

 

[BrendanS]

Easy with hindsight, but when they came back and told you that they were casualty working, I'd have said this may possibly be a Mayday situation, and let them decide whether to obtain a short description of the incident. If I found an inverted canoe, lifejacket and other items, I'd be concerned enough to push a little to tell them the situation. It may have been nothing, but I'd rather tell someone earlier rather than later.

 

[Greg2]

Think I would have pressed the issue with the Coastguard......not very good that they effectively put you on hold.....they should be able to handle more than one thing at a time

 

[kashurst]

tricky to answer or criticise the coastguard but any apparent delay is bad, however I think you did exactly the right thing.

 

[Solitaire]

Mayday relay or else a Pan Pan, but if I had seen what you did then I would without hesitation done the former. That would have activated immediate response. Neither you or the CG could have known that the casualty had gt ashore.

 

[superheat6k]

Agreed - I would have called a Mayday - immediate danger to life. This clears the channel and grabs the necessary attention. It also alerts other nearby craft who could assist in a search.

 

[henryf]

Definitely report what you have found in the initial radio call if you don't want to issue a Mayday. As has been said already I think the situation warranted a Mayday relay (it wasn't actually you who was in danger). The coastguard clearly agreed as they swung into action straight away.

A lesson for us all.

Henry

 

[prv]

If I found an inverted canoe, lifejacket and other items, I'd be concerned enough to push a little to tell them the situation

Indeed - a collection of stuff like that floating past seems a pretty clear indication that a canoeist has fallen in. Like others, I think I'd have called it as a Mayday Relay. As a somewhat similar example, I believe sighting red flares is also to be reported as Mayday Relay.

This situation (call being sidelined by Coastguard thinking it's routine) is exactly why the prowords exist. Granted it's a lot easier to decide these things in hindsight when we know the full story.

Pete

 

[Elessar]

Mayday relay or else a Pan Pan, but if I had seen what you did then I would without hesitation done the former. That would have activated immediate response. Neither you or the CG could have known that the casualty had gt ashore.

+1 for mayday relay.

I would add though to the OP I would have turned my radio on sooner.

It is selfish not to monitor your VHF. We are all part of the listening and SAR service if someone is in a pickle.

 

[Firefly625]

It occurred to me later that had it been a true emergency,

finding a life jacket, an upturned canoe.... that is a true emergency. I would have issued a Mayday relay... but hindsight is a wonderful thing and also you have to fight against that strong urge that is built in most of us that does not want to cause a fuss.... Sometimes in life a fuss is exactly what is needed!


+1 for monitoring your VHF.... mine is always on and audible.

 

[Duster]

Thanks for the thoughts and comments.

My initial thoughts were that the items had been "lost" / washed away on a rising tide. The canoe had a scout logo and they normally adventure in groups, the life jacket was inflated, you would normally expect a canoeist to be wearing it whilst travelling.

I was a little surprised to be kept waiting so long by the Coastguard, but that part of the UK has no sense of urgency, so not classing the incident as an emergency, I waited politely before calling again. Once they woke up, the incident was handled well.

With hindsight, I should have ignored the request to move to 67 and just continued to relay my finds on the breaker channel. Radio coverage in the area is poor and often cluttered with junk chat so I tend not to switch it on. Phone coverage is good so if something happened again, I would probably phone it in.

Just pleased that it all ended well, mikej

 

[DAKA]

Thanks for the thoughts and comments.

My initial thoughts were that the items had been "lost" / washed away on a rising tide. The canoe had a scout logo and they normally adventure in groups, the life jacket was inflated, you would normally expect a canoeist to be wearing it whilst travelling.

I was a little surprised to be kept waiting so long by the Coastguard, but that part of the UK has no sense of urgency, so not classing the incident as an emergency, I waited politely before calling again. Once they woke up, the incident was handled well.

With hindsight, I should have ignored the request to move to 67 and just continued to relay my finds on the breaker channel. Radio coverage in the area is poor and often cluttered with junk chat so I tend not to switch it on. Phone coverage is good so if something happened again, I would probably phone it in.

Just pleased that it all ended well, mikej

In my opinion the coast guard was in the wrong and added the confusion.

They should have responded to your 16 call with

If it is routine traffic please stand by 67

You then just respond on 16 and carry on with your message ignoring any irrelevant mention of 67.

Easy when sat here at the keyboard though

 

[Duster]

Easy when sat here at the keyboard though

Most things are Daka and a "Degree in Hindsight" is the best qualification in the world!

I just thought that it was worth a mention to set others thinking about what to do in obscure incidents.

Regards mikej

 

[Solitaire]

This incident is gong to be added to my VHF scenario card list. Thanks for bring it to our attention. Remember that from next year the VHF course may well be 2 days. Brought about my European "partners".

 

[JSYmartini]

In these situations I'd be inclined to let CG decide whether to classify it as a mayday, pan pan or whatever, it's their job and what they're trained for.

To let them know your initial call is important and not just another TR or radio check I would've said something along the lines of "Belfast Coastguard this is ....., urgent message on C16, over"

 

[Duster]

I would be pleased if others could benefit from the incident, which with hindsight both myself and the coastguard could have handled it better.

I would find two day course to use the radio, which is only an upmarket CB, rather offputting.. Unless I needed it for my commercial endorsement, I'd probably either not bother with the course, or not switch the radio on.

 

[superheat6k]

In these situations I'd be inclined to let CG decide whether to classify it as a mayday, pan pan or whatever, it's their job and what they're trained for.

To let them know your initial call is important and not just another TR or radio check I would've said something along the lines of "Belfast Coastguard this is ....., urgent message on C16, over"

Errm, this why we have Securite, Pan Pan and Mayday in the radio vocabulary. One or two words explains this succinctly and all others listening should shut up unless they have a specific contribution to assist the situation.

I agree there is a reluctance to call a Mayday or Mayday relay, just as there is a reluctance to call in any emergency for fear of causing a fuss. Better to call it wrong and be a little embarrassed, than not call it and then learn of or be part of a tragedy.

 

[JSYmartini]

Errm, this why we have Securite, Pan Pan and Mayday in the radio vocabulary. One or two words explains this succinctly and all others listening should shut up unless they have a specific contribution to assist the situation.

I agree there is a reluctance to call a Mayday or Mayday relay, just as there is a reluctance to call in any emergency for fear of causing a fuss. Better to call it wrong and be a little embarrassed, than not call it and then learn of or be part of a tragedy.

I'm reminded of a situation where someone justifiably called a mayday when there was an mob during a rowing race. There was 60 guard boats in the vicinity as well as 2 RNLI boats and a race control boat with their own procedures and plans in place for these situations. By calling mayday they caused a fair amount of unnecessary stress and confusion with 3 different CG stations trying to coordinate etc when a lifeboat was yards away and listening to the race working channel.

Safety pro words have an important part to play but that doesn't mean every safety related message has to be preceded with one and in some cases it can cause more than just embarrassment. Just letting the CG know its important and not routine is all that's needed. Then let the pro's get on with what they do best.

In the case of the OP's situation, he doesn't usually turn his radio on as he finds it boring. CG may have been broadcasting regular all ships messages to the effect that debris is known to be in a certain area and that the owner was known to be safe and well. They may also request that any sightings should be reported to them etc. Switching the radio on and shouting mayday down it is going to set a whole load of wheels in motion unnecessarily.

Just my opinion of course, interested to hear chanelyacht's view on this, think I'm correct that he's a CG officer?

 

[oncewaswafu]

Sorry to disagree with Solitaire and others, but this was not a Mayday Relay situation. Worthy of CG immediate attention, but Relay is passing on a received transmission, not a basically unknown situation. Not a Mayday, agreed. PAN PAN perhaps, it falls between the lines really.

 

[Solitaire]

Sorry to disagree with Solitaire and others, but this was not a Mayday Relay situation. Worthy of CG immediate attention, but Relay is passing on a received transmission, not a basically unknown situation. Not a Mayday, agreed. PAN PAN perhaps, it falls between the lines really.

Sorry, but it is not for just passing on a received transmitted message. Mayday relay will apply in any situation requiring immediate assistance which is not related to your[\B] own situation. This would apply as much to seeng a red parachute flare or a vessel/ person who is unable to make such a transmission.

The fact that the person who had abandoned the canoe was ashore was irrelevant - nobody knew that - for all anybody knew the person involved could have slipped out of the LJ

The fact that the op did in fact chose not to have his VHF switched on was also in contravention of the IRPCS Rule 5 with regards keeping a look out by all means available. That includes having the VHF switched on!

It is correct in terms of putting control in the hands of the CG, but the OP failed to get across the situation effectively, and when this was (finally) achieved the CG turned it into a situation requiring immediate assistance.

A Mayday relay would have speedied the whole process up. What's more other vessels in the vacinity would have been put in alert.

There was a situation down here in the Solent where a guy had gone overboard from his yacht and was being dragged along behind the boat with his wife/partner left onboard and unable to recover him. She did not know how, or could not put out an emergency call and this was left to another vessel who just alerted the CG to to the situation, there then followed a discussion about where the event was taking place etc. The CG kept asking for the position the boat calling was making either not listening or did not fully understand the question and kept just mentioning a buoy rather than was being asked, the lat and long. If the other vessel had putout a Mayday relay and included the position within a full call then things would have been clearer.

I was actually in n the area at the time and listening to the events, and also was heading in that direction. Eventually the correct position was identified, but it took too long really. The ILB was on it's way, but just in a general direction until the CG eventually passed on the lat and long based on the CG finally identifying the buoy close to the situation. This was a special mark and not a main channel buoy or cardinal mark.

All was well,but it was messy!