Racism, Boatism, Big/littleEnders on this site

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I wonder if the boatism can be packed in?

Some people with sailboats seem to feel entirely free to abuse aand denigrate anyone who has, or uses or who has ever owned a motorboat. They refer to all such people in the same derogatory terms.
They attribute bad behaviour (even when criticsm is justified) of one member of a group to all members of that group: this is the very essence of racism. I am almost certain that they would take exception to derogatory remarks about natives of one country, people with disabilities, and other groups of people.

In the solent, where the history of sailboating and numbers of sailboats far exceeds that of powerboating, the problem is worst, with large numbers of sailboat users hurling abuse first, and being unhelpful or rude later. It would be awful if the same policy became as commonplace amongst motorboaters.

Do not confuse this with general banter about raggies, stinkiepotters, rag and stick brigade, smokiboats, nice exmaple around, enjoined and enjoyed by me hereabouts.

I refer to a minority, but an unhelpful one. There's not a trace of this in the Med, where I often go boating - except amongst Brits. As an example, we offered to help a Halberg Rassy 36 (sailboat) owner moor stern-to in St Tropez. There ws a torrent of scathing and sarcasm from the English flagged singlehander. We offered more firmly as got into diffuclties alongside our boat. One of our crew (Oceanmaster qualified, not me) and another (halbery Rassy 49 and Yachtmaster) hopped on board and helped him out, explaining how they knew what they were doing. He quietened down, not expecting useful help. I don't think we cured him though - we simply must be the exception.

"Some of them, you know, are really nice people, and really know their stuff". Some of whom, old chap? - black people? French people? Women? ....Oh, some motorboaters, haha sorry i wasn't quite sure which group of people you were denigrating when you mistakenly assumed that I have the same bias against others as you do, and find difficulty making friends amongst others unless at the expense of other people who don't have a white face, UK passport, male genitalia and a sailing boat, old boy!
 

ccscott49

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I agree with you, I thought we were all boaters or boat types or whatever, I wish all these people with the sailboats, who moan about motorboats, would throw their ignition keys away and then lets see who are the real sailors, sialing into their marina berths! I hear all kinds of utter b******t from guys standing at bars in yacht clubs with sailing boats that never leave the pontoons spoutiong about hteir sailing prowess and how all motor boat people are pillocks, hogwash, we are all boaters, using the same bits of water, why cant we respect each other. I hear people say to me Oh1 very nice boat, but as a motorsailer, she wont go to windward, will she, well no she wont , but niether will yours!, because its uncomfortable and slow going, so you too will put your engine on to get somewhere! its all b******t and about time it stopped! Remember when you shout mayday sailors, it isnt a sailing boat that comes for your bum!

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by nipper on Wed Nov 28 13:59:11 2001 (server time).</FONT></P>
 

stefan_r

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indeed!!!! saw an article in PBO this month about a chap who was involved with an accident with a powerboat in a marina, believing he wasn't to blame he didn't claim off his insurance and then lost the subsequent civil action...he appaluds GJW Direct for settling the claim and court fees (which they could have repudiated so well done GJW) but the point is why did this chap feel the need to say 'POWERBOAT' and seemingly assume that he wasn't at fault....can't help but think 'accident in marina' is sufficient....


Slightly different point I see that Cardiff Bay Marina are charging £4.25 for sailing craft and £6.81 for powered craft (for 8 metres)...do many marinas have a two tiered pricing strategy??

mailto: stefan@athito.com
 
G

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Re: motor/sail charges

Firstly, spose a commercial organsiation can do what it likes . But wasn't this all public money? Is it a private marina? if so, can say blue hulls only, or teak decks only. Understandable t'other way round cos more depth needed for saily boat, though not by much for 8m.
 

ChrisP

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Couldn't agree with you more. It always seem strange to me that we get on fine when on the pontoon but as soon as you get to sea or into the club house all previous friendships are cast off and the knives are drawn. Never could understand the disdain that sailboat owners have for powerboat owners. Does it stem from some sort of jelousy or is it the usual tale of ignorance breeding contempt.
Personally I've never sailed anything bigger than dingy's but I wouldn't mind having a go just to see what its like when the engine is stopped.
 
G

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I'm sure their must be some people like that... you get pillocks in all walks of life. I like boats. I have sailing boats, they have engines which I prefer to be off, but I like boats.

How rife is that kind of attitude? I'm very very grateful to the owners of large motor boats who provide committee vessels for big events and I'm sure they do it because they like watching the laundry going by.

Can't say I've ever experienced or observed anything but good humoured banter. Is it possible that it's confined to the South Coast; I note that you refer to an "English flagged single hander..." or is that being racist?!?!

KCA
 
G

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ah no. I like all sorts of boats and boating as on my earlir posting to which you kindly contributed. It's okay to call you ragger, and mebbe you being a crisp and sailing racer you never see us lot and...

...oh, penny dropped, right, single hander ah, no. I'll avoid that in future!...
 

iangrant

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I wouldn\'t mind having a go

And so you will and can - only on the basis I get to play on yours as well (goes both ways ye' know) The offer is a day sail in a Jeanneau 37 - Chichester harbour and out round the Nab -

Ian
 

iangrant

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Re: I wouldn\'t mind having a go

I can do most days - we need a lunchtime HW - (big draft low water over Chi Bar don't mix). Private Email to arrange?
 
G

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Sadly much of this boatism is purpetuated by the press. YM has recently been vociferous in its condemnation of all motorboaters, accusing us of driving insurance premiums up, driving too fast and too close, etc etc. If this twaddled is presented as fact to the raggies, small wonder they go out of their way to be rude and unhelpful to us untermench stinkpotters.

My own experiences are similar to yours. Have rescued two raggies in the last 18 months, at considerable inconvenience (and cost in time and fuel), but recieved just a curt nod from one and no thanks at all from the other. Am tempted to leave them to drown, but will not lower myself to their small-minded level.

There seems little we can do about other people's attitudes other than lead by example and display exemplary manners and seamanship in the face of their biggotry.
 

BarryH

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Ummm interesting, altough i know what you mean about some sailors saying motorboaters not being very seaman like. All i can say is that the raggie that i pulled off a mud bank in the Wareham Channel was,nt as seaman like as me because he went aground and i did,nt. Still he could have at least thanked me for stopping and helping, but he did,nt. You never know one day I might need him and that would be thanks enough.
 

adarcy

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Totally agree with all that's been said.

I've only ever had a problem with the part of the sticks n handkies brigade who had a chip on their shoulders about motorboaters. I actualyy think that the proportion of wallies is about the same in both camps.

On can't deny the basis of the classic yottie claim that it needs less skill to drive a motorboat from A to B (you just need a big chequebook) as opposed to knowing enough about wind sails etc. But most motorboaters I know seem v knowledgeable, as all the regular correspondents here, and take care over boat handling, nav and safety.

We all know how some sailing boats get into the most frightful muddle but - there but for the grace of God.......

I wonder if the main problem is in the busy areas esp the Solent as there is often nowhere to go to totally avoid your wake affecting some other boat and let's be frank THERE ARE some inconsiderate motorboaters who do power through and bounce everyone around.

I have found the best way is to ask some yotties out and ask them to helm and then show them their wake (esp sterndrive boat slowly in a river) not to humiliate them but they have all (so far) admitted that there is more to driving a powerboat than they had thought. I regret to say, I did not personally enjoy the return offers of a nice sail so I'm cutting down on it.

Anthony
 

Bergman

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I really think this must be a South Coast thing.

I,ve never come across anything like the things you describe (perhaps I've led a sheltered life) here in the frozen North.

In truth it is uncommon to see motor boats out of the marina. They do appear to be fairly static around here.

I once got fed up of waiting behind one who was filling up with diesel, after about 3 hours (well 20 minutes) I decided I had enough on board and went out sailing. Another passed me and a couple of other boats in a shallow channel doing about 20 kts - I didn't care for him much but that was in N Wales so perhaps doesn't count. Apart from that in 20 years sailing I have had no other problems with motor boats

I've never had a tow from one though.

Maybe I'll look lost and helpless next time I have a head wind and hope someone will give us a tow - probably won't work theres never one there when you want one.

PS

Is this some fiendish politician at work - divide and rule - get raggie votes for taxing motor boats and viky verky

No they're not that devious
 

ToMo

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We don't seem to have much of this down here in the most west bit. - and if we did we'd only have to threaten any offender with a big hairy ar..d Cornish fisherman in a nice heavy quick metal fishing boat with a superb wash! and the difficulty seems to evaporate.
Fishermen make very good enforcers if handled right!
 
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