oldgit
Well-Known Member
Re:rise
Ashore shoppling at bl..........y bluewater spending my muny
Ashore shoppling at bl..........y bluewater spending my muny
G
Guest
Guest
Re: genoa (front sail)
ooh. So in a five+, upwind (I always like upwind cos it feels faster...) the cars should go a long way back, yes? Your text doesn't indicate if flat as board good or bad. I got thing thing very flat creak creak (short person is loose head prop so can do the first bit, Mrs S used to drive a sierra 2.3 diesel with no power steering so does next bit, then I finish it off) and was indeed flat as a board but not very fast - praps the wind was not strong enuf? So, if it isn't strong enuf wind , set the 45 degrees thing at leading edge, yes? But if 5+ then cars aft, and creaky tighten it all in on winch, yes ?
ooh. So in a five+, upwind (I always like upwind cos it feels faster...) the cars should go a long way back, yes? Your text doesn't indicate if flat as board good or bad. I got thing thing very flat creak creak (short person is loose head prop so can do the first bit, Mrs S used to drive a sierra 2.3 diesel with no power steering so does next bit, then I finish it off) and was indeed flat as a board but not very fast - praps the wind was not strong enuf? So, if it isn't strong enuf wind , set the 45 degrees thing at leading edge, yes? But if 5+ then cars aft, and creaky tighten it all in on winch, yes ?
G
Guest
Guest
Re:rise
I know exaclty what you mean..my crew is usually insidde having a strop becaus ei asked her to do something..like put the fenders out...but it's a great way to learn how to single hand
I know exaclty what you mean..my crew is usually insidde having a strop becaus ei asked her to do something..like put the fenders out...but it's a great way to learn how to single hand
Boatman
Well-Known Member
Re:rise
I am confused I always thought that the cars towed the travellers -)
I am confused I always thought that the cars towed the travellers -)
G
Guest
Guest
Shame Mike!!
You appear to have a South Coast attitude towards other water users...maybe you should lighten up a bit!! Whilst some of 'em piss me off...I would add there are one or two raggies that also piss me off! Don't tar 'em all with the same brush.
One day you may need 'em!
You appear to have a South Coast attitude towards other water users...maybe you should lighten up a bit!! Whilst some of 'em piss me off...I would add there are one or two raggies that also piss me off! Don't tar 'em all with the same brush.
One day you may need 'em!
G
Guest
Guest
Re:rise
no no..the travellers are often found around stonehenge in the summer...you can tell them buy the number of dogs they have as well...and the smell.
The are only moved by large numbers of police in riot kit along with lots of violence.
Does this help at all..?
no no..the travellers are often found around stonehenge in the summer...you can tell them buy the number of dogs they have as well...and the smell.
The are only moved by large numbers of police in riot kit along with lots of violence.
Does this help at all..?
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Shame Mike!!
I hold my hands up..
For every power boater i can find you 2 yotties that are worse..i am aware of the problem...it's on a little banter to get me through the day befoer ei get made redundant next week...!!!!
I hold my hands up..
For every power boater i can find you 2 yotties that are worse..i am aware of the problem...it's on a little banter to get me through the day befoer ei get made redundant next week...!!!!
zefender
Well-Known Member
In this new spirit of co-operation between windy people and farty people, perhaps I might ask a couple of questions about motor boating.
1, What purpose does a flying bridge serve - is it practical or aesthetic?
2, If caught in a gale/big sea, is it better to slow down or speed up?
2, Given that most water is repelled sideways when underway, can I keep my fenders attached when en-route?
3, When MBs have patio doors, do they always have a patio outside of them?
Yours, puzzled
1, What purpose does a flying bridge serve - is it practical or aesthetic?
2, If caught in a gale/big sea, is it better to slow down or speed up?
2, Given that most water is repelled sideways when underway, can I keep my fenders attached when en-route?
3, When MBs have patio doors, do they always have a patio outside of them?
Yours, puzzled
G
Guest
Guest
well since my qs were taken seriously best take these seriosuly too
1. Flybridge. Practical mostly: better view from up top, and gives full walk-in headroom in saloon from rear deck. Bit aesthetic re gawping at people from higher while harbour, tho risk of others gawping from even higher height on another boat (qv st tropez, so best to sit on verandah of hotel Sube).
2. deopends how fast you were going. You shouldn't be "caught out" cos greater speed allows you to have got to port regardless of direction beforehand, or set off earlier eg in med get most powerboating done befoe lunch as onshore wind kicks in pm: in UK, better forecasts. If wind arrives v fast (eg med) then going downwind is easier. Note that sailing, it's an achievement to reach destination, whereas powerboating really, if you don't get there (assuming boat works) then it's bit blimmin hopeless.
3. yes you can keep them attached, but they should not dangle and bounce around the side as they look a right mess and eventually fallin esp if only clove hitched. Hookem up and over onto side decks. Puttem away on helm side (which should be starboard for give way viz) praps for access fwd, and awy both side for reasonable sea trip.
4. Yes, but it isn't called a patio. Aft deck. Keep these doors shut at sea else fumes get sucked in make all nice carpets grubby, and spoil all nice cool airconditioning.
1. Flybridge. Practical mostly: better view from up top, and gives full walk-in headroom in saloon from rear deck. Bit aesthetic re gawping at people from higher while harbour, tho risk of others gawping from even higher height on another boat (qv st tropez, so best to sit on verandah of hotel Sube).
2. deopends how fast you were going. You shouldn't be "caught out" cos greater speed allows you to have got to port regardless of direction beforehand, or set off earlier eg in med get most powerboating done befoe lunch as onshore wind kicks in pm: in UK, better forecasts. If wind arrives v fast (eg med) then going downwind is easier. Note that sailing, it's an achievement to reach destination, whereas powerboating really, if you don't get there (assuming boat works) then it's bit blimmin hopeless.
3. yes you can keep them attached, but they should not dangle and bounce around the side as they look a right mess and eventually fallin esp if only clove hitched. Hookem up and over onto side decks. Puttem away on helm side (which should be starboard for give way viz) praps for access fwd, and awy both side for reasonable sea trip.
4. Yes, but it isn't called a patio. Aft deck. Keep these doors shut at sea else fumes get sucked in make all nice carpets grubby, and spoil all nice cool airconditioning.
G
Guest
Guest
Re:yots n stuff
My boat does have the floor at 45 degrees - it's wonderful when the boat's tipped over
My boat does have the floor at 45 degrees - it's wonderful when the boat's tipped over
G
Guest
Guest
Re: genoa (front sail)
Yup, genoa = front sail, sometimes!!
In F5+ nice flat sails for upwind. When you tighten in the sail the curve reduces which presents a nice flatty sort of aerofoil thingy to the wind. Less sideways push.... you get to keep lots of laundry up when the rest are rolling in and slabbing down.
KCA
apparently gentlemen never go to windward so we must be part of the hooligan element that do..
Yup, genoa = front sail, sometimes!!
In F5+ nice flat sails for upwind. When you tighten in the sail the curve reduces which presents a nice flatty sort of aerofoil thingy to the wind. Less sideways push.... you get to keep lots of laundry up when the rest are rolling in and slabbing down.
KCA
apparently gentlemen never go to windward so we must be part of the hooligan element that do..
G
Guest
Guest
Re: cheers (nm)
.
.
bryantee
Well-Known Member
Re: cheers (nm)
Yachting monthly put out a small booklet some years ago about getting more from your sails.maybe still around . ask Kim.In the med new yoghurt pots go stern t
lder long keelers bows to.Its to stop the spreaders clashing.Thats my excuse anyway.
Yachting monthly put out a small booklet some years ago about getting more from your sails.maybe still around . ask Kim.In the med new yoghurt pots go stern t
lder long keelers bows to.Its to stop the spreaders clashing.Thats my excuse anyway.
Col
Well-Known Member
Re:rise
You really don't like moty boaty's do you! ;-)
You really don't like moty boaty's do you! ;-)
G
Guest
Guest
Re:rise
he does sneakily, it seems. praps we oughta swap for a weekend?
he does sneakily, it seems. praps we oughta swap for a weekend?
Dave_Snelson
Well-Known Member
Oh no...Uuuurghhh
I have just laid up my smokie for the winter (btw, whats the difference between a stinkpot and a smokie?) and decided to clean up the hull. I used some Y10 and it worked great but it highlighted the difference in the "white bits" and the brown colour that the hull had become.
Now I thought this brown discolouration was due to the fact that I used the boat in estuary water.......
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Dave_Snelson on Thu Nov 15 08:54:32 2001 (server time).</FONT></P>
I have just laid up my smokie for the winter (btw, whats the difference between a stinkpot and a smokie?) and decided to clean up the hull. I used some Y10 and it worked great but it highlighted the difference in the "white bits" and the brown colour that the hull had become.
Now I thought this brown discolouration was due to the fact that I used the boat in estuary water.......
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Dave_Snelson on Thu Nov 15 08:54:32 2001 (server time).</FONT></P>
jfm
Well-Known Member
Re: pwrboaters sailing methods
Cor blimey I went away 1/2 day and come back to 60-post threads on rag stick. Have not read all replies, but disagree with some, so here's engineering response:
1. Traveller. When sailing you should resolve the mainsheet tension into a downward component (pulls boom down, flattens sail, so de-powering it) and a horizontal component (arcs the boom left right). Traveller simply lets you control the components separately. Eg if you want very close hauled in light air, you want the boom on centreline but a curved sail. If you had no traveller that means very tight (near vertical) mainsheet, which flattens sail and takes power out. But if you let the sheet out and take the traveller right to windward you can have a non-vertical mainsheet, so allowing the boom to lift and put curve in the sail, yet still keep the boom on centreline. You can do opposite in heavy wind, keep mainsheet tight to flatten the sail and adjust boom using traveller. Etc Etc. Curve in the sail is critical - on a 40 footer in a force 4 you can move the bhp in the rig from praps 30 to 40hp just by sail shape
2. Cars. There was much bolx talked here, especially the 45 degree stuff which is wrong. The car position simply alters the vertical/horizontal components of the sheet tension. In other words it alters relative tension in the leach and the foot. If the car is too forward, when you want to haul the sail in to go upwind you will put massive tension in the leach and get the wrong sail shape. Or if the car is too aft you will never get enuf tension in the leach without mega tightening the sheet, so getting the wrong trim angle. With a medium genoa the foot is quite a bit shorter than the leach so to stop the leach curving too much in middle-of-road sailing you want the car MORE FOWARD than 45 degrees. As the genoa gets bigger you mve the car back towards or beyond 45 degrees
3. Cant think of good book or website, will look. Dinghy books are best for sailshape tips
4. Leaning over loads isn't necess a way to go fast. You lose vertical component of keel area for a start. On cruiser boats you also get massive drag from rudder bent at 30% to stop weather helm. Often better to reef, which takes sailcloth off the leach of the main, which is usually the crappiest bit because you cant control its shape that well anyway. Reefed roller genoas are a pain because the shape gets really crappy when part of it is rolled up, so I like to keep as much genoa out as poss also it overcomes the weather helm a bit, so reducing rudder drag
Cor blimey I went away 1/2 day and come back to 60-post threads on rag stick. Have not read all replies, but disagree with some, so here's engineering response:
1. Traveller. When sailing you should resolve the mainsheet tension into a downward component (pulls boom down, flattens sail, so de-powering it) and a horizontal component (arcs the boom left right). Traveller simply lets you control the components separately. Eg if you want very close hauled in light air, you want the boom on centreline but a curved sail. If you had no traveller that means very tight (near vertical) mainsheet, which flattens sail and takes power out. But if you let the sheet out and take the traveller right to windward you can have a non-vertical mainsheet, so allowing the boom to lift and put curve in the sail, yet still keep the boom on centreline. You can do opposite in heavy wind, keep mainsheet tight to flatten the sail and adjust boom using traveller. Etc Etc. Curve in the sail is critical - on a 40 footer in a force 4 you can move the bhp in the rig from praps 30 to 40hp just by sail shape
2. Cars. There was much bolx talked here, especially the 45 degree stuff which is wrong. The car position simply alters the vertical/horizontal components of the sheet tension. In other words it alters relative tension in the leach and the foot. If the car is too forward, when you want to haul the sail in to go upwind you will put massive tension in the leach and get the wrong sail shape. Or if the car is too aft you will never get enuf tension in the leach without mega tightening the sheet, so getting the wrong trim angle. With a medium genoa the foot is quite a bit shorter than the leach so to stop the leach curving too much in middle-of-road sailing you want the car MORE FOWARD than 45 degrees. As the genoa gets bigger you mve the car back towards or beyond 45 degrees
3. Cant think of good book or website, will look. Dinghy books are best for sailshape tips
4. Leaning over loads isn't necess a way to go fast. You lose vertical component of keel area for a start. On cruiser boats you also get massive drag from rudder bent at 30% to stop weather helm. Often better to reef, which takes sailcloth off the leach of the main, which is usually the crappiest bit because you cant control its shape that well anyway. Reefed roller genoas are a pain because the shape gets really crappy when part of it is rolled up, so I like to keep as much genoa out as poss also it overcomes the weather helm a bit, so reducing rudder drag
paulineb
Well-Known Member
Re: pwrboaters sailing methods
Don't you spill your G&T while you're buggering about with all the strings and things? Powerboats are much more relaxing. Push lever forward to go forward and pull back to reverse - easy peasy and drink's in tact ;-)
Pauline B
Don't you spill your G&T while you're buggering about with all the strings and things? Powerboats are much more relaxing. Push lever forward to go forward and pull back to reverse - easy peasy and drink's in tact ;-)
Pauline B
G
Guest
Guest
Re: cor saily/power
well wow most impressed jfm re resolution of forces. I was forlornly hoping for a do this when that happens, do that when this happens.
In carribee we had a race with another boat which we found out were Dad ex-racer, 2x kids near national class sailyracers plus mum who does dinghy sailing instead of coffee mornings all living in poole. Antyway we thrashedem first time unofficial race due to erm taking massive tack over there engine on and hehe didn/t we do well, But second time with proper observer so plan A not really permitted were slightly thrashed into 2nd place and much annoyance from short people who were playing gameboys downstairs throughout that I threw away a 200 yd intial lead won by using fullpower engine right to the line as permitted and then nipping between two rocks with 3m under and 1m either side followed by screaming at following fleet ooer no water and they all turned away. Anyway then the clever gang in other boat slowly overtook whikle we were saying wot are they doing now, them in 36 and we in 40 and binoculors ooh look he's done that lets us do that.
Pauline have you sailed a bit? quite fun and some (not all) sailyboats have little holes to put drinks in amnd its not too bash bash bash.
Think the correct solution in long term is to buy a self-tacking Wally with pushbuttom everything and (shortly to be invented) optimise/hunt chess-style puter which continuously buggers about with ropes for max speed have predetermined input like max lean and closenes to other boats simultaneously adjusts music volume to compensate for wind noise with auto-sugest lunch stop and dedicated lager/g+t dispensers piped all around boat, with Mike E praps downstairs thrashing away at the bog handle for the extra half a knot. Unfortunately only Slingshot (wally.com) will fit the blimmin berth widthwise max 5.4 realy +fenders and not too hightech.
Cheers anyway
well wow most impressed jfm re resolution of forces. I was forlornly hoping for a do this when that happens, do that when this happens.
In carribee we had a race with another boat which we found out were Dad ex-racer, 2x kids near national class sailyracers plus mum who does dinghy sailing instead of coffee mornings all living in poole. Antyway we thrashedem first time unofficial race due to erm taking massive tack over there engine on and hehe didn/t we do well, But second time with proper observer so plan A not really permitted were slightly thrashed into 2nd place and much annoyance from short people who were playing gameboys downstairs throughout that I threw away a 200 yd intial lead won by using fullpower engine right to the line as permitted and then nipping between two rocks with 3m under and 1m either side followed by screaming at following fleet ooer no water and they all turned away. Anyway then the clever gang in other boat slowly overtook whikle we were saying wot are they doing now, them in 36 and we in 40 and binoculors ooh look he's done that lets us do that.
Pauline have you sailed a bit? quite fun and some (not all) sailyboats have little holes to put drinks in amnd its not too bash bash bash.
Think the correct solution in long term is to buy a self-tacking Wally with pushbuttom everything and (shortly to be invented) optimise/hunt chess-style puter which continuously buggers about with ropes for max speed have predetermined input like max lean and closenes to other boats simultaneously adjusts music volume to compensate for wind noise with auto-sugest lunch stop and dedicated lager/g+t dispensers piped all around boat, with Mike E praps downstairs thrashing away at the bog handle for the extra half a knot. Unfortunately only Slingshot (wally.com) will fit the blimmin berth widthwise max 5.4 realy +fenders and not too hightech.
Cheers anyway
paulineb
Well-Known Member
Re: cor saily/power
Yes I've been on a sailing yacht. She's lovely. A 50' wooden yacht called Gladys, she's nearly 100 years old and very beautiful. We went sailing out of Brighton and once the sails were up and the engine off, it was very, very peaceful. A gorgeous day - Mr B was lying in the netting under the bowsprit with a lager in his hand and his feet dangling in the water as we gently sailed along. We were out for about 5 hours (and still in sight of the marina!! so no good if you're in a hurry).
Pauline B
Yes I've been on a sailing yacht. She's lovely. A 50' wooden yacht called Gladys, she's nearly 100 years old and very beautiful. We went sailing out of Brighton and once the sails were up and the engine off, it was very, very peaceful. A gorgeous day - Mr B was lying in the netting under the bowsprit with a lager in his hand and his feet dangling in the water as we gently sailed along. We were out for about 5 hours (and still in sight of the marina!! so no good if you're in a hurry).
Pauline B
