Pulling twin KAD44 with DPE drives

[aerobat]

Hello gents !

I,m new here and first a hello to everybody !

Now my issue and questions to you , sorry for a long story :

I signed a contract on a 2000 gobbi375sc in winter with boat stored on land with a written declaration of the seller that should any hull or technical issues be found during the survey in spring it will be fixed on the sellers costs .

The survey found osmosis on the hull .

After first shock and thoughts to run - after extensive talks with a specialized yard on fixing osmosis - they convinced me not to panic . After a very detailed hull survey of this yard They say the entire underwater hull needs to be sanded and grinded up to the laminate , then dry out with warm forced air until acceptable moisture levels will be reached , the a special watertight epoxy - osmosis protection cover ,then several layers of primes and new antifouling .

They give 7 years warranty and swear the hull will be better than new . The costs are breaking the bank but since the seller signed a contract , tried to hide the osmosis its his call not mine and he agreed to pay .

Now , the seller close to cardiac arrest , the yard calls for removing the transom shields simce osmosis was also found close to the transoms.

this means to pull both engines .

The engines are KAD44 EDC

I made sure that this will be also done by A certified yard with warranty and of course also on his costs but i,m afraid we open a can of worms what surprizes will come anf if all will be done properly since its a major work .

Should we go this path - what to expect to be checked when the engines and transom shields go out ? The engines and drives were fully serviced last spring by a volvo penta dealer , new bellows , filters , oil , belts , valve clearance etc .

Steering pins ? Of course i will use the chance for cleaning the heat exchangers , aftercoolers , checking the turbos etc .

Any more ideas ? engine are verified 950 hours , first owner and verified freshwater sitting boat with occasional trips in salt .

thanks for any hints and thoughts .

Best regards !

 

[AllanG]

Sorry to hear this sad tale and, if it was me, I’d be asking for my money back, and I’d walk away, as I’m sure there are plenty of other boats for sale that don’t require this amount of work.

Anyway, good luck with whatever decision you take

 

[aerobat]

Sorry to hear this sad tale and, if it was me, I’d be asking for my money back, and I’d walk away, as I’m sure there are plenty of other boats for sale that don’t require this amount of work.

Anyway, good luck with whatever decision you take

Thanks for the comments !

Well , i have the option to walk away and get my money back but i,m asking myself if this is smart . The other path is to get a full hull restoration paid by the seller in a specialized yard in fiberglass osmosis repair with warranty and freshly rebedded transom shields done by a certified volvo penta dealer with warranty , also paid by the seller.

The boat is first hand and since it was a exhibitor on a boats show it is equipped with really nice things like generator , airconditioning , autopilot and more .

On the other hand i,m also a bit shy of such an massive work and of course i can forget current season of boating ... not sure what to do

 

[Jim@sea]

I would also walk away. I once viewed a 33ft motor sailor which was 9 years old. It was in the water. I asked the boat broker to recommend a boatyard for a survey, The boatyard did not find any Osmosis. But after taking ownership I dried it out and found Osmosis. I then had another survey with a proper "Qualified" Surveyor who said that he had found Osmosis when he did a survey 4 years before, (yes when the boat was 5 years old) Apparently the boat had since been repaired and obviously it was coming through again.

I would also suggest if you are that desperate to buy it, you change the deal.
1. First get an estimate from another boatyard.
2. OK if the present owner has agreed to pay for the repair, get the money off him, as if he pays the boatyard he is the customer with the 7 year guarantee, not you.
3. Like when having a house built I would want a Qualified Surveyor having a frequent look during the repair.
4. Make sure that while the boat is being worked on you are compensated for any marina storage costs whilst its going on.
5. Check on ENDOLE if the business which is giving you a 7 year guarantee is solvent and perhaps find out if they are in Rented Premises as their solvency would evaporate if served with a Notice to Quit.

(When I started boating 60 years ago I was very naïve)

 

[aerobat]

I would also suggest if you are that desperate to buy it, you change the deal.
1. First get an estimate from another boatyard.
2. OK if the present owner has agreed to pay for the repair, get the money off him, as if he pays the boatyard he is the customer with the 7 year guarantee, not you.
3. Like when having a house built I would want a Qualified Surveyor having a frequent look during the repair.
4. Make sure that while the boat is being worked on you are compensated for any marina storage costs whilst its going on.
5. Check on ENDOLE if the business which is giving you a 7 year guarantee is solvent and perhaps find out if they are in Rented Premises as their solvency would evaporate if served with a Notice to Quit.

(When I started boating 60 years ago I was very naïve)

Great inputs , thank you much !

In specific i have the following contract :

Signed the purchase and made a deposit of 10% purchase price and agreed in written form that full price will be paid after survey , seatrail and delivery of the boat . Should anything become visible during survey or seatrail it will be fixed by the seller or i can step back from the contract.

Survey / seatrail should be done last week .
After osmosis was found i cancelled the seatrail and did not accept takeover of the boat , so the boat is still on land . In any case i plan to nevertheless seatrail it to make a final decision because i never saw the engines running , have only the declaration of the yard making the maintanance .

1) i have the declaration of two yards who both tell me a professionally dried and repaired hull with a known problem is way superior to an untreated 25 year old hull without VISIBLE issues . But i know the yards want to earn money .

2) very interesting : is the warranty given to the person or the subject of the work (the boat ) ??

3) well , i would need to pay the surveyor . I will demand photos , documentation etc and will look by myself on the progress , but a qualified surveyor multiple times ... not easy

4) of course . Its all him , crane , dry storage etc . Thats why i asked here also for additional costs after engine pulling . Surely at least exhaust pipe gaskets , sealing etc . What else ?

5) that is of course always a risk i cannot exclude . You are fully correct.

I,m not obsessed with the boat but ask myself if a boat with a professionally repaired known issue is not better than a boat i only believe it has not issues . My budget does not allow for a brand new 37 footer , any boat i look for will be around 25 years old . I,m in the market for two years now and looked for several sealine , cranchi and gobbi and if you look very closely every boat of this vintage is a risk somehow and has here and there issues .

I did not made a final decision yet and so i very appreciate your and other thoughts .

 

[DavidJ]

Don’t expect a 25 year old boat to have osmosis. I sold my 23 year old Sealine S37 a year ago. 23 years in the water and no sign of osmosis and nothing special about Sealine hulls, I would expect all boats to be the same.
The seller hasn’t actually broken his contract as far as I can see. There are wiser folk than me on this forum but you may have a problem getting your 10% back.
I echo others who say walk away

 

[SC35]

Check for rusty oil pans, leaky trim rams, worn turbos, rusty or blocked exhaust elbows or pipes, leaks from exhaust pipes or intercoolers or water pumps, excessive play in steering.
Pulleys would ideally be not rusty and belts would be in good condition.
Tensioners would not squeak.
Fuel filters would not show signs of any fuel bug.
Coolant should be green and not rusty brown.
Oil in stern drives should be nice and clear, drives should engage with a healthy "clonk".

But none of the above is really the point - a new Bavaria SR38 will be around £450k
Even if you throw several thousands at the older boat, you'll be out there on the water having a very similar experience but having spent a lot less.

May The Force be With You.

 

[aerobat]

Thank you so far for all the valuble comments which help to make a ( hopefully )wise decision !

 

[jon and michie]

I think the main question you should be asking yourself firstly is do you want to go through all that hassle when there is 1000's of other boats in good condition and ready to go which haven't basically been ripped apart (without sounding dramatic).
If I was in your position I'd be running.

 

[DavidJ]

I think the main question you should be asking yourself firstly is do you want to go through all that hassle when there is 1000's of other boats in good condition and ready to go which haven't basically been ripped apart (without sounding dramatic).
If I was in your position I'd be running.

Agree and another angle is when you come to sell, you will need to declare that’s it’s been repaired (a surveyor will spot this if you don’t declare it).
The choice for the buyer is a repaired boat with a guarantee or a boat that hasn’t needed repair.

 

[jon and michie]

I dont know what your budget is but there is this one --- Solent Motor Yachts

 

[DavidJ]

I dont know what your budget is but there is this one --- Solent Motor Yachts

Good price! My S37 same year sold for £23k more than that.

 

[aerobat]

Thats a very good price for a gobbi 375sc !

I travelled europe and there are plenty of boats looking fantastic on pictures but in fact all i saw ( and there were many... ) had issues when you look very closely . It might be its not osmosis , but most of them lived in salt for +20 years and you see it , on the heat exchangers , aftercoolers , turbos , pulleys , thru hulls and electric connections .

Such things can also break the bank on a kad44 .

I made a decision : an extensive engine survey and seatrail will happen next days with a volvo mechanic who will inspect closely and hook both engines on diagnostic during seatrail .

If the engines and drives are good I will take delivery of the boat and let pay the hull repair by the seller . If the engines are also doubtful i will walk and cancel the contract .

 

[Seastoke]

But how long do you think all the work will take. The repairs sound like 30 to 40k cost if I was the seller ,I would give you your money back.

 

[aerobat]

But how long do you think all the work will take. The repairs sound like 30 to 40k cost if I was the seller ,I would give you your money back.

You are spot on with the costs on a cautions side . Since the seller signed a contract where he sold me a boat for 100k trying to intentionally hide osmosis and it was found before i even took delivery of it he is not in a position to give me money back and choose . I can demand delivery .

I,m in good moods with him , he tries all he can to solve the problem .

The costs for pulling both engines by a certified volvo penta yard , pulling both transoms , rebedding them and much more are crazy .

The same is true for a certified full osmosis hull repair

I also pay a price : i throw a season away while bought a 100k boat . The work will take until september . The hull drying alone takes weeks.

 

[crazy4557]

What happens when/if the seller fails to pay the repairer when the jobs finished due to no money or other excuses etc etc. who’s left with the invoice cost especially if the repair contract is in your name to take advantage of the warranty?

 

[Aardee]

For me, this has "walk away" written all over it. It's very much a buyers market right now so why make it complicated?

 

[DavidJ]

Dear oh dear!
Why are you so keen on this boat. After a year with my boat the buyer traded up and put mine back on the market at £89,950
Watch the video at the end to see what you get for this money
Sealine S37 Sports Cruiser 9609730 – Burton Waters Boat Sales

 

[jon and michie]

@aerobat - As @DavidJ has just mentioned why are you keen on this particular boat ?
Each to their own but a lot of work and hassle especially if things don't run smoothly which is more likely to happen.
in my case Which a few on this forum will tell you I have waited a few years for the right one to come along - where as in the link i posted earlier there is the same model and a year younger more than likely in better condition that doesnt need ripping apart - what are we missing ??

 

[aerobat]

Dear oh dear!
Why are you so keen on this boat. After a year with my boat the buyer traded up and put mine back on the market at £89,950
Watch the video at the end to see what you get for this money
Sealine S37 Sports Cruiser 9609730 – Burton Waters Boat Sales

Your boat looks very nice on the pics and the s37 is a fantastic boat .

But , why does the owner puts its on the market then after just a year ?

Generally i would love to purchase in uk but coming from germany this would mean i have to pay VAT and customs on top so it has to be taken into account

I,m not keen on this specific boat or brand, just thinking what the best overall option is . If somebody offers me a better deal i am ready to walk immediately .