portable generator

[RichardS]

It's the most common way of annoying people in anchorages and also of killing your family with carbon monoxide poisoning.

I suspect not on all counts. :ambivalence:

The most common way of annoying people in anchorages is probably PWCs and I doubt whether many, if any, people have ever been killed with a portable generator whilst at anchor. The most common way of "killing your family" in overall terms will be faults with boilers or gas heaters on land. On a boat I'll bet that it will be on boats moored alongside a quay or pontoon.

Richard

 

[ashtead]

Pete7 many thanks for advice on 10i and mat solution . Weight of unit was my main worry in terms of lifting from stern lazarette locker . In terms of a solar panel back up what are views on the suitcase variety ? I saw one recently and was tempted but I just wondered if they delivered anything meaningful ? Has anyone any experience of topping up with one?

 

[GrahamM376]

.....Whenever I need 220V and/or want to charge the ship's batteries, I get the generator out while under sail, plug the generator's outlet into the shorepower inlet, and fire up the generator.
Is this feasible or am I missing something? Erik

The Honda 20i has an oil level sensor which cuts the motor if not reasonably level so not much use when sailing, have tried it. As others have said, solar is the way to go with the genny as a backup for power tools, microwave etc. and battery charging (not in evenings) via 240v charger after a few days with no sun.

 

[Kelpie]

I suspect not on all counts. :ambivalence:

The most common way of annoying people in anchorages is probably PWCs and I doubt whether many, if any, people have ever been killed with a portable generator whilst at anchor. The most common way of "killing your family" in overall terms will be faults with boilers or gas heaters on land. On a boat I'll bet that it will be on boats moored alongside a quay or pontoon.

Richard

A family in the lake district were killed by their genny a couple of years ago, exhaust fumes fed back into the boat. So it is not a mere theoretical risk.

 

[GrahamM376]

A family in the lake district were killed by their genny a couple of years ago, exhaust fumes fed back into the boat. So it is not a mere theoretical risk.

IIRC the fumes didn't feed back into the boat, the problem was that they never left it as the genny was built in down below with faulty exhaust.

 

[PaulRainbow]

In terms of a solar panel back up what are views on the suitcase variety ?

I think you have that backwards. Solar should be your primary power source, genny as backup.

 

[VicS]

IIRC the fumes didn't feed back into the boat, the problem was that they never left it as the genny was built in down below with faulty exhaust.

'S right https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/car...n-motor-cruiser-arniston-with-loss-of-2-lives

and two more recent cases, one on the Norfolk broads and one in Cardiff, were the result of running the main engine and fumes being blown under and trapped by the cockpit tent


CO alarm absolutely essential if you will be running an engine , esp a gasoline engine and even more importantaly a portable generator, for battery charging etc

 

[macd]

It's the most common way of annoying people in anchorages and also of killing your family with carbon monoxide poisoning.

The OP's proposing to run the genny whilst sailing, which sounds to me like a recipe for all sorts of trouble in addition to the possibilities of gassing him. Might be practicable, perhaps, on a cat.

 

[maxi77]

'S right https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/car...n-motor-cruiser-arniston-with-loss-of-2-lives

and two more recent cases, one on the Norfolk broads and one in Cardiff, were the result of running the main engine and fumes being blown under and trapped by the cockpit tent


CO alarm absolutely essential if you will be running an engine , esp a gasoline engine and even more importantaly a portable generator, for battery charging etc

I would say the CO alarm is essential under all circumstances unless you have no means of creating CO on board.

 

[Pete7]

Pete7 many thanks for advice on 10i and mat solution . Weight of unit was my main worry in terms of lifting from stern lazarette locker . In terms of a solar panel back up what are views on the suitcase variety ? I saw one recently and was tempted but I just wondered if they delivered anything meaningful ? Has anyone any experience of topping up with one?

I could lift the Honda Genny out of the cockpit locker as its 20kgs but it took a lot of space in there which has now been replaced with other junk. I have a 80w panel on the stern, a 30w panel in front of the sprayhood and a portable 60w suitcase panel that wanders around the deck to face the sun. Works well, just wish we had bought one of the bigger say 80w or 100w suitcase panels. Storage when at sea needs to be thought about, ours lives in the stern bunk when not in use. Together we have seen 10 amps mid summer in strong sunshine and spent a week at anchor in Alderney then left with full batteries. That's running fridge, lights, laptops and tv etc. However, a couple of days of rain will see us starting the engine particularly if its cold and we have been running the webasto heating. Longer term plans are to at least double to solar on the stern. If you are going down the solar route think big and add some form of battery monitor so you can see what's going on. No point in running a genny to put single figure amps into the battery, better to let the solar panels do that, quietly with the need for any monitoring.

Pete

 

[Richard10002]

How do you measure 100%? Are you using extremely high charging voltage? Or are you using something other than flooded lead acid batteries? I'd be interested in improving my setup.

I measure % with Smartgauge and temp. compensated SG. This pretty much agrees with estimated current in/out and totals from other instruments recorded daily over a few years.

I see you are also talking about a few hours. My point was for OP not to expect 100% after 1-2 hours.

Flooded Lead Acid batteries tend to be considered "full" when they are drawing less than 2% of capacity at 14.4V, (some prefer to be drawing 1%, but the principle is that the tail current is low).

I have a Smartguage but find that it is not as accurate as the makers and many users would have us believe. The manual tells us that it is not accurate when charging, and I also think it is not particularly accurate when it reads above 80% - apparently the guy who designed it responded to this assertion with "so what?". During charging, my Smartguage gets to 100% when the batteries are still drawing 30A or more, (which is a couple of hours before they reach a tail current of the 4A or so that I look for).

Ialso have a NASA BM2 which gives me instantaneous Amps in or out, along with cumulative Amp hours, (not forgetting that some energy will be dissipated as heat when charging). I usually find that charging requires a surplus of 15Ah to 20Ah, before the tail current is low.

I dont read specific gravity as my batteries are hard to get at. If your specific Gravities are correct, your batteries should be full.

I agree that 100% is not acheiveable in a couple of hours with any form of charging.

 

[Richard10002]

I agree that solar is the ideal for topping up the batteries and keeping them there. I'm considering adding to my 100w of solar, but wonder if it's truly worth it in "Sunny Stretford", compared to the heat of the Med or the Carribbean

 

[RichardS]

A family in the lake district were killed by their genny a couple of years ago, exhaust fumes fed back into the boat. So it is not a mere theoretical risk.

'S right https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/car...n-motor-cruiser-arniston-with-loss-of-2-lives

and two more recent cases, one on the Norfolk broads and one in Cardiff, were the result of running the main engine and fumes being blown under and trapped by the cockpit tent

What I said was "I doubt whether many, if any, people have ever been killed with a portable generator whilst at anchor."

See if you can find an example. I haven't looked but I don't need to because, having frequently used a portable gennie at anchor, I doubt whether there will be many, if any.

Richard

 

[pcatterall]

Regarding solar pete7 makes a good point. There is only so much space on board most yachts for permanently mounted panels but perhaps space can be found for folding panels to be brought out at anchor/mooring.

 

[VicS]

What I said was "I doubt whether many, if any, people have ever been killed with a portable generator whilst at anchor."

See if you can find an example. I haven't looked but I don't need to because, having frequently used a portable gennie at anchor, I doubt whether there will be many, if any.

Richard

"..... because I am always right!"

I spilt some gasoline while topping up the outboard tank last year while the boat was on the mooring. I was surprised how the fumes were blown back into the cabin rather than being blown safely away by the breeze.
The same could happen with the exhaust from a generator

A boat at anchor , although initially OK, could swing with the tide so that a gentle breeze now coming over the stern would bring the exhaust fumes back into the accommodation. A short after lunch nap might become somewhat extened.

I'd not advise others to be so complacent.

 

[RichardS]

"..... because I am always right!"

I spilt some gasoline while topping up the outboard tank last year while the boat was on the mooring. I was surprised how the fumes were blown back into the cabin rather than being blown safely away by the breeze.
The same could happen with the exhaust from a generator

A boat at anchor , although initially OK, could swing with the tide so that a gentle breeze now coming over the stern would bring the exhaust fumes back into the accommodation. A short after lunch nap might become somewhat extened.

I'd not advise others to be so complacent.

Ah .... so you couldn't find an example. Thought not. :encouragement:

And it would be a bit of a stretch to call me complacent as I always have my CO detector on when the gennie is running.

As for "always right" .... well, you said it Vic, not me.

Richard

 

[Iminei]

Regarding solar pete7 makes a good point. There is only so much space on board most yachts for permanently mounted panels but perhaps space can be found for folding panels to be brought out at anchor/mooring.

I've worked out I need about 100W of solar, but can't for the life of me work out where to put a 4 x 2 panel on a 25ft boat. Some sort of radar arch would seem to be the answer but it would need to be uncomfortably high. Trouble is I'd really like it out on a long passage where the batteries would suffer.

 

[GHA]

"..... because I am always right!"

I spilt some gasoline while topping up the outboard tank last year while the boat was on the mooring. I was surprised how the fumes were blown back into the cabin rather than being blown safely away by the breeze.
The same could happen with the exhaust from a generator

A boat at anchor , although initially OK, could swing with the tide so that a gentle breeze now coming over the stern would bring the exhaust fumes back into the accommodation. A short after lunch nap might become somewhat extened.

I'd not advise others to be so complacent.

A quick Google didn't find any events with gennys on deck, petrol is dodgy though. Careful with those outboards!

http://www.pbo.co.uk/news/warning-about-dangers-of-portable-generators-onboard-24937

My gas alarm will read zero with the genny on until into absorbtion voltage when the batteries gassing a tiny bit will set it off.

 

[howard easton]

Ah .... so you couldn't find an example. Thought not. :encouragement:

And it would be a bit of a stretch to call me complacent as I always have my CO detector on when the gennie is running.

As for "always right" .... well, you said it Vic, not me.

Richard

FFS this is childish playground bickering. Grow up the pair of you.

 

[RichardS]

FFS this is childish playground bickering. Grow up the pair of you.

I don't know about Vic, but your opinion means a very great deal to me Howard.

Richard