Now this bugs me...

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I wonder if any of the boatbuilders ever look at this forum? If they do, do they take any notice? If they did, what is there about your boat that you wish they'd done differently?

I have a small, but growing list of really stupidly designed things, that would have cost little or nothing to do right, but really p*** me off:

Fairline Targa 29

1) No bilge pump in the forward bilge - now how dumb is that?

2) Midships cabin is a crawl-in, but the light switch is at head height. You can get in bed without braining yourself, or you can bet in bed with the lights off, but not both.

3) No 12 or 240V sockets outside of the galley area. So where do I plug the TV in, then?

What hacks you lot off?
 

jfm

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Re: fairline bugs...

1. Phantom (1999) patio doors slam lock shut. Not good when the keys are inside downstairs and you're driving from upstairs and a long way from land.

2. We want blue hulls. Don't care if more complex, more expensive bla bla whingebag excuses from the manufacturing dept. We just WANT them. Sunseeker can do it, as have f'line for last 5 years, so it can't be that hard.
 

Dave_Snelson

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Boy, I really hate the lack of use of stainless steel on boats. You see it all the time, fixtures and fittings that are made partly of SS and partly mild steel. What the hell is the point of that?? Mercury Marine are the worst for it and they annoy the hell out of me. Aluminium fittings that are chrome plated last two nano-seconds in salt water.

All that they manage to save is a few quid. Spoil the ship for a ha'porth of tar springs to mind - OK, I'm off my soap box now!
 
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Re: Erm, nuffin really, \'cept....

Now you can't really blame Riva for that, now can you? Unless he was a factory fitted option, of course...
 
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Re: think they look...

I hear from sideways conversations with dealers etc that this or that was mentioned "on the internet" when it must have been this BB.

Sorry, but not a chance of fixing/sorting all or any fline things.



What a lovely boat sir.

yes but this is shit and that and that and this and this and no bilge pump.

Ah but the 34 has three bilge pumps sir, and you must feel very very lucky to own such a marvellous craft when I as eng mgr have to make do with a hillman avenger. And that has no bilge pumps at all, though I do often wear trainers to drive it.

Well wot abt the blue hulls eh?

Well we do want all our customers to be happy and your point is very interesting which I will bring up at a meeting of people who have blazers. To tell u the perfect honest answer most hulls are white, a fresher colour, and since they have it praps baaa baaa ring in the changes, who are we to argue, change is as good as a rest, the new md come from a non-boat background but brings Fresh Ideas, to go with the Fresh Ideas of the designers who have similarly never been on a boat except for that picture in MBY I don't suppose you had anything to do with that? In any case you must feel very very lucky indeed to own such a marvellous craft and etc etc.
 
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Re: think they look...

I know. Maybe the design schools could read this, and in a generation or so, people might design boats with useful features...

As for F'line, yes, I understand. I am of course extremely grateful to Mr Fairline for permitting me, a mere pleb, to own such a glorious piece of marine art. I just wish I could go to bed without either braining myself or leaving the light on all night
 

jfm

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Re: mercury marine and mild steel...

I've had zillions of merc o/b over the years Dave and I know what you mean. You find a few nuts and the odd bit or bracketry here and there is mild steel. Very annoying. But often you find the part is stocked as a spare in s/s, and the background here is that merc seemed to have crappy JIT parts inventory and quite often a batch of stainless bits wasn't available so they used mild steel to keep the line going. On the latest models (I have a 2001 125hp and couple of 1999 egg whisks) this has not been a prob, so maybe they've fixed it now, but it was an irritating problem for 15yrs (in my experience) before that.

I haven't come across chrome plated ali tho.....
 

adarcy

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We had a 1990 Fairline Targa 27, not a bad boat BUT

a) Obviously no-one had ever driven one before making them. If you came off the plane without holding it at 6-8 knots for 20 secs or so, the wake came up onto the bathing platform and sprayed/fountained into the engine compartment breather!
Afetr the first year they modded ours by blocking off the lower 2/3rd and putting high breathers in.

b) Windscreen wipers poked through the windscreen, not a prob, nice bronze nut but a mild steel washer. Looked like stainless but rusted solid within 18/12.

c) Ends of canopy hoops had aluminium bits crimped by stainless steel tubes, bit of electrolysis/corrosion, hopeless. Similar age Princess 286 and 36 ?Rapallo had plastic plug with eye which pushed in. We transferred to using the and no probs.

Do designers not use boats near sea water?

Anthony D'Arcy
 
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nowhere near sea, and the case of f'line,almost as far from seawater as is possible. They are going to open up some facility in Ipswich. So they say. But probably salesblather, meaning that instead of plonking down M3, they will simply staty on a14 and tip large boats into sea at ipswich.
 

Scubadoo

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Don't start me on this subject, well for the engine - I wonder when Volvo will realise that their engines are meant for boats in a damp environment, that way they could design it not to Rust!

As for Sealine:
1. Don't use Aluminium for windowscreen.
2. Don't use self tapping screws.
3. Design the engine bay area for easy access, instead of removing half the seating.
4. Finish off S/Steel so you don't get rust bleed.
5. Put the fuel filler in a more practical place.
6. Repalce the Sealine sales staff and with a cabbage - just as effective.

RM.
 
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After reading all of this post I could not agree more, also the MDL bit too, as I was with them 2 years ago, but the only question I bet none of us would want to answer is, WHY DO WE KEEP PAYING FOR ALL THIS CRAP.

Dont bother answering, it might break the record!.
 

Dave_Snelson

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Re: mercury marine and mild steel...

Hi jfm,

In fairness, I recently decided to change out my '88 Merc 90 which had given me good service and provided loads of "grunt" in its time. I wasn't teed off by the motor per se, but whenever I worked on it, the mild steel fittings / bolts / levers etc. hampered my every move.

I was offered a brand new Suzuki 100, knocked down from £7k to £4k and couldn't resist it..... and what's more, my fetish for stainless was satisfied!!

The Ali with Chrome plate relates to small cleat fittings on the transom of my Shakespear (but I'll get over it!)

Cheers
DAVE
 

jfm

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Re: cheap outboards

I know what you mean. Let us know how the Suz works out. IMHO (based on a 115 1994 model) the engine is good but the gearbox soft, as in gearteeth likely to part company with hub. Need to treat more gently than merc.

I wd be careful of alleged cheap deals. I mean they're all cheap. In May this year I bort a new Merc 125hp 2 Stroke for £4700. It was a UK Sowester supplied motor, not grey import. It's fantastic, and I have discovered no mild steel yet. Cheers
 

Dave_Snelson

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Re: cheap outboards

I kinda hope that the gear teeth stay attached to the hub!! Anyway, its under 2 year warrenty. The motor is legit, bought from MGA watersports in Rochdale, the reason for the price reduction is that it was the last big Suzi two-stroke in the UK - end of line, so to speak. I e-mailed all the dealers on the Suzuki.com web-site to see what they had and only MGA could supply, the rest were all gone and only the new 4-stroke models available.

Anyway, about the gearbox, it doesnt deliver the usual grinding clunk, if you don't engage it sharpish. What they've done (clever little japs) is have the drive dog hydraulically operated so that even if you are slow on the lever, the gear engages with an almost soundless click and it is a beaut to use.

Going back to the 2-Stroke / 4-Stroke thing. I reckon we could start a thread based on this alone. Personally, I don't like the 4-Stroke outboards because they are too bulky (new Merc 90 is twice the size of my Suzi), they don't have the right power characteristics and they are too expensive. People say they are cheaper to run, which I accept, but the extra £3k spent on the unit could buy one hell of a lot of petrol, more than over a five year period.

Anyway, here's me spouting off about Suzuki. I have only had it since the beginning of August, we'll have to have this conversation again in 5 years!!

Cheers
DAVE
 

tico

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Interesting. My F'line is 1987 and has plakky ends to canopy hoop. Needs some araldite to hold them tho. Also has bed level light switch in mid cabin..... something about negative evolution!!!
BUT, worst bit is having to lift rear sunpad and seat support to open engine hatch more than 2".
 
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Re: Oh, don\'t get me started...

Opening the engine hatch requires the following:

1) remove cushion on rear facing seat
2) remove cushion on side facing seat
3) remove cushion on forward facing transom seat
4) lift lid on aft port locker
5) stow table top in locker and remove table leg
6) stand on fuel tank lid and lift hatch

To close, lower hatch to level of forward seats, squat down and rest hatch on knee while lifting base of forward seats to clear engine bay cover, repeat operations 1-5 in reverse order.
 
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Re: Oh, don\'t get me started...

I hope you are going to remove all this before I come to service the engines next year, otherwise I can see it taking me longer to remove that lot, than to do the actual service, no problem though Graham...... really !.

Paul js
 

petem

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Fairline Targa 30

1) Couldn't find forward bilge! There is a small bilge area under cabin sole with shower pump (kind of a bilge pump?).

2) Midships cabin still a crawl-in. Light switch still at at head height.

3) Still no 12 or 240V sockets outside of the galley area (although brochure promised them at helm).
 
G

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seems not, the shower pump isn't a bilge pump, and you have to rely on GW's method of filling the bilge, the saloon, and some of the wc so the water starts to go down the shower hole, by which time boat will be under water...
 
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