Is there more wind at sea?

[Rivers & creeks]

I've heard it said that the wind is one force stronger at sea than in the marina. Is this true, why should it be stronger 'out there' than in an unsheltered marina? Does the wind get slowed down by travelling over or hitting the land?

 

[Sans Bateau]

Does the wind get slowed down by travelling over or hitting the land?

Yes.

 

[sarabande]

Yes, it's known as orographic influences. The interface of wind and land/water produces a drag influence on the wind. Trees and houses slow the wind down a bit. These tend to be absent at sea.

Now, turbulence.....

 

[Rivers & creeks]

Does that mean that a forecast for a place like Walton or Harwich (as per windguru or metcheck) needs a force adding for the sea area "Thames"?

 

[Wansworth]

In some areas the terrain can accelerate the wind so it is windier inshore than at sea.I was out at sea off the Spanish coast under all plain sail by the time I reached the harbour I was down to strom jib and two reefs....

 

[snowleopard]

Have a look at Passageweather. Select North Atlantic then English Channel and scroll through the charts using Next. You will see that whenever there is a bit of wind in the channel there is more in the middle than along the coasts.

 

[Sans Bateau]

In some areas the terrain can accelerate the wind so it is windier inshore than at sea.I was out at sea off the Spanish coast under all plain sail by the time I reached the harbour I was down to strom jib and two reefs....

That may well be the effect of the sun warming the land quicker than the sea, the air rises over the land and the space created is filled with cooler air from over the sea, sea breeze, this could add a significant number of knts to the gradient wind but will not effect the wind speed so much further off shore.

 

[fisherman]

Then there's catabatic wind. Routinely heading close along the west side of the Lizard peninsula in easterly wind my crew would be looking quizzically at me as the loose equipment on deck got blown about, then as we cleared the point it became flat calm. There is often a northerly, almost a gale, in high pressure conditions close inshore off Porthleven in the north east of Mount's bay. All useful for the average sailor if you're aware.

YM met lesson taught us that the wind is one force less on the land, and veers by one compass point, if my memory is correct.

 

[grumpy_o_g]

The other significant factor is diurnal variation. Over land hot spots kick off thermals which tend mix the higher velocity clear air at height with the air near the ground. As the thermals die away at night so the wind drops.

Over the sea there is little of this effect.

 

[Plomong]

Last Sunday, stuck my nose out into the outer harbour -- wind 7-ish knots, North with a pinch of West in it -- N by NNW.

One mile further on: 22-27 knots, NNE. Classic Wind Acceleration Zone around Punto Galea and Cabo Villano on a summers day, in these parts.

SWMBO said: chuck it in or I'll ch..... it all up (had just had lunch, you see).

So we went back in.

In similar weather, I have soldiered on seaward to find the wind offshore (2-3 miles off Punta Galea) was considerably calmer.

So, wind at sea vs wind in marina -- depends on many factors, not least of which is local topography.

 

[Lady Campanula]

I've heard it said that the wind is one force stronger at sea than in the marina.

I've only too frequently found the wind offshore considerably stronger than that in the marina, and certainly several Beaufort Forces stronger than the forecast.

Hence all the grey hair and the nightmares....

 

[Pitterpatter]

down wind at 180 deg

A couple of years ago in Brittany on my brothers boat heading east to Morlaix, we were on a dead run in light winds. Wind f2 from the east. About a mile ahead was another boat heading straight towards us with a spinnaker up. As it closed, it became clear it was making better headway than we were (and no, we weren't going backwards!). As skipper was busy being hungover and fishing, I elected to turn north and head out (away from the rocks) on a reach as the boat got to about 200m. We headed out - slowly, then suddenly, blam, boom swung over to the other side, genny is now backed and needs to be tacked. Once done, we are making 5k, completely in the wrong direction, but at least away from the rocks. Journey then turned into a beat up to Morlaix

Stringe what happens at sea! Never did understand that one though! Any suggestions (other than the wind changed direction ;-))

 

[Lakesailor]

Topography.
That's why lakesailing is so unpredictable. This is the view from where I work towards where I live (behind the tree on the right). Belle Isle is straddling the lake. There are many places where the wind is stronger as a rule, but everything is up for grabs as a result of the topography and general wind direction, time of day and time of year.
I would imagine that although wind strengths may be higher at sea, they will be more constant and less prone to shifts. Any opinions on that?

(The wind in 2 directions at once is a common feature here)

 

[bbg]

Simon Keeling is the one to answer this, but as others have said, the answer is probably "it depends".
If we are talking about a gradient wind - a wind driven by differences in barometric pressure - the surface wind will probably be weaker close to land than at sea due to friction effects noted above. So the wind in the marina will be slower than the wind a little bit offshore. Unless there are topographical features that accelarate the wind near shore, or the gradient wind is reinforced by a thermal wind.
If we are talking about a thermal wind, it is likely to be stronger closer to shore than it is a few miles offshore - but the friction effect will still probably slow it down as it arrives at shore i.e. in the marina.

 

[glashen]

It definitely increases by at least another wind force when the story is recounted in the bar.

 

[glashen]

I still remember a forecast many years ago, Force 4 to 5 W but less in sheltered bays and harbours.

Well Duhhhhh

 

[MoodySabre]

A good example of this here. If winds are very light then that usually covers a wider area.

Looks OK for this weekends hop across the North Sea

 

[aquaplane]

Topography.
I would imagine that although wind strengths may be higher at sea, they will be more constant and less prone to shifts. Any opinions on that?

(The wind in 2 directions at once is a common feature here)

I'll second that.

I might qualify it by saying "wind strengths may be higher in the open sea". Sailing on the enclosed areas of the Clyde is a bit similar to Windermere in that the land affects the wind significantly. Winds tend to blow up or down the Lochs and funel down valleys.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Topography.
That's why lakesailing is so unpredictable. This is the view from where I work towards where I live (behind the tree on the right). Belle Isle is straddling the lake. There are many places where the wind is stronger as a rule, but everything is up for grabs as a result of the topography and general wind direction, time of day and time of year.
I would imagine that although wind strengths may be higher at sea, they will be more constant and less prone to shifts. Any opinions on that?

(The wind in 2 directions at once is a common feature here)

I've seen the smoke from two factories on the Humber, less than a mile apart, blowing towards each other!

 

[Alcyone]

I've seen the smoke from two factories on the Humber, less than a mile apart, blowing towards each other!

Curry house near one of them?