How useful is the RYA online VHF Short Range Certificate (SRC) course?!

[prv]

Because the one essential thing the RYA don't teach - the one thing that is important before all others, is Voice Procedure. ie correct verbal use of the damn radio in the first place! All they do is teach a few essential pro-words and then obsess on teaching button-pushing.

This is true - but note that the minimum course content isn’t decided by the RYA but by the ITU. The RYA could (and arguably should) add more time on basic voice procedure, but they can’t take out any of the other things to make room for it.

Pete

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Perhaps because so many people speak badly

Good diction is regrettably rare. I don't mean "Standard English" pronunciation; that's less important. I mean things like separating words, giving phonemes their full value and (on radio) using exaggerated pronunciation for some words (e.g. "fife" instead of "five"). I do a fair bit of public speaking in church, where the acoustic is often difficult (you're projecting your voice at a vertical glass or stone wall at the other end of the building, so there's an echo effect), and most of the tricks to make yourself heard clearly in that situation work for radio. But most people speak too fast and without clear separation of words, which are the key things. Male speakers can often help things by slightly raising the pitch of their voice as well.

 

[Gwylan]

Perhaps because so many people speak badly

Rodger that good buddy.
Over and our!
That's a big 10-4

 

[Gwylan]

My classic. Passage from Rye to Plymouth, off Eddystone we pick up on a Pan pan to coastguard.

Coastguard went through the problem etc Bit of a struggle but got to the position

Coastguard What is your position?
Caller I'm a director of an agricultural engineering company.

Crew and I had to switch off before it got worse. Too far to render any assistance at our 5 knots.

Assumed the call was about the ice maker breaking down

 

[Black Sheep]

The book will help you without doubt. But dont forget you will need to complete the on line course. You will take a knowledge check and passing will give you a certificate with a code.
Your assessor needs this code to proceed with the oral.
Dont shoot the messenger.

You're not the first in the thread to make that assertion. For most of us, this is right, but as the OP knows well, it ain't necessarily so.
From RYA Marine Radio SRC Exam Payments

To be eligible for the exam, on the day of the exam all candidates must:
1. be 16 years old or older, and
2. present one of the following eligibility documents:
- evidence of completing an RYA SRC training course through an RYA Recognised Training Centre*, or
- an RYA Restricted VHF certificate, or
- a suitable aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate.
......
If you are not required to complete the SRC course and intend to present either an RYA Restricted VHF certificate or a suitable aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate as evidence of eligibility, you should discuss the availability of direct assessments with a local RYA Recognised Training Centre. In addition to the exam fee a charge may be made by the training centre to cover the cost of facilitating a direct exam.

 

[prv]

Is an “aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate” the one that a typical private or airline pilot would have, rather than say a SAR or oilfield pilot? I can’t see any reason for most pilots to have anything to do with the GMDSS.

Pete

 

[Bru]

Because the one essential thing the RYA don't teach - the one thing that is important before all others, is Voice Procedure. ie correct verbal use of the damn radio in the first place! All they do is teach a few essential pro-words and then obsess on teaching button-pushing.

That was not my experience, far from it

Having been trained in radio ops in the ROC i fully expected the marine VHF course to be a boring waste of time

To my surprise, it was anything but. I thoroughly enjoyed it! And as well as brushing up skills and knowledge i hadn't used for twenty odd years, i learnt a few things as well (mainly procedural)

Now that was a classroom course and given the option (which I'm aware is thin on the ground at the moment) I'd go classroom rather than online (having started the online yachtmaster theory course a few years ago and giving up part way through due to terminal boredom - the classroom environment at least includes interaction with others etc to keep it fun)

I personally suspect that a lot of the poor, sometimes diabolical, VHF procedure we hear afloat is perpetrated by people who haven't actually done the course or got the certificate. Given that there's virtually no enforcement i wonder just how many people have actually done the course?

 

[boomerangben]

Is an “aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate” the one that a typical private or airline pilot would have, rather than say a SAR or oilfield pilot? I can’t see any reason for most pilots to have anything to do with the GMDSS.

Pete

There’s only one test, one set of procedures whichever type of civilian pilot you are. There’s a key CAA document for Radio Telephony Procedures and it covers everything.
GMDSS is a marine thing so nothing to do with aviation although the SAR aircraft can home to DSC and EPIRB/PLB signals. I did my (had to; no exemption) SRC DSC years ago despite using VHF AM (marine band) every day at work.

 

[prv]

There’s only one test, one set of procedures whichever type of civilian pilot you are. There’s a key CAA document for Radio Telephony Procedures and it covers everything.
GMDSS is a marine thing so nothing to do with aviation

So when the RYA say that you can present an "aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate" in lieu of doing the course, that's equivalent to them asking for a genuine unicorn horn or Boris Johnson's conscience?

Pete

 

[Graeme Smart]

I completed and passed my RYA VHF MARINE RADIO (SRC) at the Edinburgh Marine Academy and also the test at the end being new to sailing I reckoned it was the responsible thing to do it was a long day but really interesting they say it is the gold standard well worth doing.

 

[Sandy]

Perhaps because so many people speak badly

While the nation's fishing community from Penzance to Peterhead do make interesting listening, I was thinking more about the simple structure of a message. As a west coast Scot I struggle with the Peterhead dialect.

I spent an interesting few hours in a French Semaphore chatting over RT and mayday calls. It's simple sir the message has a structure that we follow from that we can get things rolling. If we have problems with the language we call Falmouth and play them the tape.

 

[Mark-1]

I was taught 'radio procedure' in a totally different context and found moving to marine RT 'interesting' and often slip into the other mode.

There's a lock keeper at a nearby marina who periodically lapses into aviation voice protocols. I love it, it's an improvement. I don't recognize it, just Google when I get home but the meaning is always clear from the context at the time.

 

[Mark-1]

So when the RYA say that you can present an "aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate" in lieu of doing the course, that's equivalent to them asking for a genuine unicorn horn or Boris Johnson's conscience?

Seemingly not:

GMDSS Course - Free Online Prep & Exam | Aircraft Maintainer

I'm mightily confused. (And I have my marine VHF qual.)

 

[dankilb]

I had assumed they meant a 'flight radio telephony operator licence' (FRTOL). That is the only license of its type in the UK. AFAIK, the UK is quite unusual in requiring such a (separate) license. Radio comms is otherwise examined as part of the theory requirement for licenses, from PPL right up to commercial/ATPL, anyway. There isn't any GMDSS content that I can remember and I studied up to ATPL (before giving up on the dream of going commercial - perhaps for the best, these days?!).

I'm planning to do the exam at Seavoice in Southport so I'll give them a ring on Monday and ask. I don't mind doing the course. It's just so rare to be eligible to avoid a boat-related cost, it'd be remiss not to give it a go!

I think it is a fair concession, myself (even without GMDSS), although of course I am biased! UK aviation licensing requirement involves a theory course and exam (the 'communications' module of the CAA/EASA PPL) and the addition of a practical exam (mine was an hour, as I said) for the FRTOL.

It's also fair to consider that even 'general' aviation, in busy controlled airspace such as around much of the UK , involves a lot more frequent radio than you'd ever expect at sea (or indeed want - it can be downright intrusive and incessant!). Among lots of routine comms, from unmanned 'traffic' frequencies at small airfields, to mixing it with the 'big boys' on the international airports' approach frequencies. I've been unfortunate enough to make a pan while speaking to Farnborough (what sounded just like detonation, but turned out to be an engine cowling bracket that suddenly sheared letting it bang like a gunshot as it fluttered - so loud that, when I said 'engine trouble', the ATC replied "I can hear it"!) and managed to hold my radio together then - much to my relief, as there are always people you know in your local airspace who'll be listening to how you do under pressure! I was also fortune to fly in a few other countries (only privately) and, transiting GIB's airspace, even managed to speak to Spanish, British and Moroccan controllers in the one flight (not bad when armed only with a 1970s C172!).

Anyway, I digress, but I'll report back when I hear from Seavoice. I'd be happy to do some 'conversion' training, so I might even ask whether I could pay for an hour's 1-2-1 tuition before the exam.

Seemingly not:

GMDSS Course - Free Online Prep & Exam | Aircraft Maintainer

I'm mightily confused. (And I have my marine VHF qual.)

That is a new one on me. Maybe it is specifically for SAR, oil/gas, superyacht, (etc.) operations, as someone suggested above?

 

[Clancy Moped]

We did our course with a chap in Richmond, which consisted of a laminated card and a non-active set for us to play around with, whilst he buggered off into his front room to watch the cricket.

 

[prv]

I had assumed they meant a 'flight radio telephony operator licence' (FRTOL).

I expect they probably did, and are just incompetent ?

It‘s not what they wrote, though.

Pete

 

[boomerangben]

So when the RYA say that you can present an "aviation GMDSS radio operator's certificate" in lieu of doing the course, that's equivalent to them asking for a genuine unicorn horn or Boris Johnson's conscience?

Pete

As far as I can gather, you’d be better off hunting for a unicorn horn than a pilot with an aviation GMDSS qualification. I didn’t have one when I flew SAR and that was in current technology. As for the political reference, take anyone’s choice of politician and that would satisfy me ??

 

[boomerangben]

Seemingly not:

GMDSS Course - Free Online Prep & Exam | Aircraft Maintainer

I'm mightily confused. (And I have my marine VHF qual.)

I think that qualification is the US(?) equivalent to the RYA DSCSRC. I’m guessing it’s aimed at aircraft maintainers working on super yachts with helidecks who might find a GMDSS ticket adds to their bow strings (and I don’t mean painter in this instance??)

 

[Blue Sunray]

Good diction is regrettably rare. I don't mean "Standard English" pronunciation; that's less important. I mean things like separating words, giving phonemes their full value and (on radio) using exaggerated pronunciation for some words (e.g. "fife" instead of "five"). I do a fair bit of public speaking in church, where the acoustic is often difficult (you're projecting your voice at a vertical glass or stone wall at the other end of the building, so there's an echo effect), and most of the tricks to make yourself heard clearly in that situation work for radio. But most people speak too fast and without clear separation of words, which are the key things. Male speakers can often help things by slightly raising the pitch of their voice as well.

The mnemonic RSPV was a useful guide when I started on the wireless telephone This was, as near as I can recall:

R RHYTHM Natural rhythm of speech with pauses.
S SPEED Slower than usual conversation.
V VOLUME As for normal conversation
P PITCH The voice should be pitched slightly higher than for normal conversation.

 

[Mark-1]

I think that qualification is the US(?) equivalent to the RYA DSCSRC. I’m guessing it’s aimed at aircraft maintainers working on super yachts with helidecks who might find a GMDSS ticket adds to their bow strings (and I don’t mean painter in this instance??)

So, it's not something I'm supposed to know, thank Christ for that. ?