Helpful ColRegs advice

[Sgeir]

One of our dear friends on the Mobo forum has been posting some more advice on the Collision Regulations. It's a very complicated scenario, but it becomes clear at the end; <ul type="square"> The IRPCS do indeed apply in a marina and as the boat reversing has no where to manoeuvre with out inflicting damage to other boats then the boat in the main fairway should give way to boats on his starboard side.

In fact that boat had already breached col regs in that he was on the port side of his fairway, had he been on the starboard side there would not have been a conflict in the first place.

It has to be said where this is the technically correct response the others where proven equally correct with their course of actions as this poll proves the majority of owners haven't got a clue about the regulations and how to behave causing a real dilemma.

5 blasts could also have been a correct response although would not really have helped the offending boat become more aware of the danger he was entering into by being on the wrong side of the fairway. [/list]The "offending" vessel is a yacht.

 

[ebbtide]

"The majority of owners haven't got a clue about the Regulations and how to behave, causing a real dilemma."

My regular Collison Avoidance scenario is a small speedboat coming round a blind corner too fast, sees me - and turns to his left. Yesterday it wasn't a speedboat but the yard launch! And it has happened with canoeists too.

Why don't these screwballs know to drive on the right???

 

[snooks]

It would have been a lot easier with a diagram /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[bbg]

DAKA is known for having his own unique interpretation of colregs. Or he is a colregs troll. Or both.

 

[snooks]

[ QUOTE ]

Why don't these screwballs know to drive on the right???

[/ QUOTE ]

May be because they are not those European types, that drive their car on the right, which is wrong. Where as we drive on the left which is right /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

But the rule for cars isn't the same as boats, but because they are sitting behind a wheel they get a little confuzzeled maybe?

Or maybe they just haven't read the rules, Or maybe they were on the left because they needed room to turn right, may be they were overtaking someone who was on the right....to be honest I don't know /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[gandy]

[ QUOTE ]
In fact that boat had already breached col regs in that he was on the port side of his fairway, had he been on the starboard side there would not have been a conflict in the first place.

[/ QUOTE ]I didn't pick that up from the scenario which didn't specify which side of the fairway the offending yacht was occupying. I think I need a diagram.

For what its worth, surely common sense says that you should allow the boat in the fairway to pass before reversing out of a berth, whether you're to his port or starboard sides.

 

[Cornishman]

[ QUOTE ]
he was on the port side of his fairway,

[/ QUOTE ]

After some 30 or more years teaching the Rules to yachties and MN cadets this is the first time I have heard of a fairway having a port side. As I have always understood it's only vessels that have port and starboard sides.
The only other place to have a port side is in Egypt, but that is spelled Port Said!

 

[Chrusty1]

Tee-Hee! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[bilbobaggins]

This one's specifically for 'Sgeir', who would never knowingly be found wandering the leafy bourgeois avenues of 'Kelvin-Said'....

Obscure, or wot?

Ok, OK! It's the silly season, now...

/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[NealB]

Thanks for the link.

It's always good to get clarification from such a widely respected, and well informed, master of the colregs.

 

[Richard10002]

If I am leaving a minor channel to join a major channel I give way. I cant remember if that is the rule as I tend to apply them instinctively but, given my training, it's what my instincts tell me. I dont think it's a crossing situation, so port and starboard dont apply.

If I am on a major channel, and I see a vessel which is looking to join from a minor channel, I think I have right of way, but I prepare myself for not being given it.

If I am on a major channel with minor channels off, and I cant see, I prepare myself for vessels joining without giving way.

In each instance, I think it boils down to the fundamental rule of proceeding at a speed commensurate with the prevailing circumstances and conditions. In most cases, at the right speed, some eye contact and hand signalling sorts things out.

I could be wrong /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Thistle]

This sounds like a good description of what, on the roads, would be described as "defensive driving": dealing positively with a situation according to the rules but being in a position to respond to somebody whose interpretation of the situation is different from your own (for whatever reason: genuine difference, ignorance, inebriation, ... .) I strongly suspect that this is what most of us do most of the time. It's also, in essence, what the colregs require of us.

 

[wotayottie]

Totally imaginary situation! A mobo leaving his berth in an F7 /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif He'd be wildly out of control the moment he dropped his lines.

 

[ShipsWoofy]

[ QUOTE ]
DAKA is known for having his own unique interpretation of colregs. Or he is a colregs troll. Or both.

[/ QUOTE ]I guessed it was him.

 

[MarkG]

Richard
Nice to know I'm not the only one who thinks like this...

 

[Refueler]

The answer given by Pete is IMHO hogwash ! You cannot apply IRPCS so plainly to this. a) He should have waited for other boat to clear and pass so he had then open area to reverse into, b) it's a raggie vs mobo wind-up.

 

[cliffordpope]

[ QUOTE ]
[ it's only vessels that have port and starboard sides.


[/ QUOTE ]

If a vessel going astern meets a vessel going forwards, which side should they pass?
Surely the sides of the reversing vessel swap over, like the navigation lights on a big ferry?

 

[Refueler]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ it's only vessels that have port and starboard sides.


[/ QUOTE ]

If a vessel going astern meets a vessel going forwards, which side should they pass?
Surely the sides of the reversing vessel swap over, like the navigation lights on a big ferry?

[/ QUOTE ]

Most vessels going astern would be RAM and fly a suitable signal or the Flag S - anyone expecting them to manouevre well is very optimistic. I certainly would not assume to reverse the port / stbd of the vessel because of her going astern - except that of a purpose designed Ferry ...

 

[jonjo]

I think Daka's authoritative /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif conclusion is very suspect and designed to support his personal delusion that he was not in the wrong.

The yacht on the "wrong" side of the marina channel might well have been committed to a final maneuver for entering his berth. Common sense dictates that ColRegs should find against another vessel that voluntarily reverses into a narrow channel and thereby precipitates a situation where one of the vessels must execute urgent collision avoidance action.

Common sense aside I hope some obscure catch-all rule in the ColRegs covers this situation and would put Daka in the wrong. I suggest this would be a good what-if scenario for a printed YM edition since unlike most other concocted what next skipper scenarios this is a situation we are all likely to face.

 

[DAKA]

[ QUOTE ]
Daka's authoritative /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif conclusion

[/ QUOTE ]

I am pleased you added a smiley face /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

It was a real life situation.

good cross current
Gusting F7 on chimet as I checked what we were going into !

I didnt know the answer thats why I posted the question .

I really would be interested to learn the correct outcome but consider the correct answer to be irrelevant in any event.

I best explain that hadnt I

The fact that the poll and this thread can not show a conclusion means that the chances are the person you meat in this scenario is going to act in a way other than expected.

Right or wrong just doesnt matter as it will leave a hole in your boat and wreck a valuable sail.

What I intended to achieve from my post was two fold

1) an interest as to what the correct procedure was, not that it could have influenced my actions on that day.

2 ) far more importantly to get across the message that as you(meaning all water born craft ) are proceeding down a fairway you should be on the look out for boats including work boats towing and trying to enter the fairway on your starboard side in tricky situations.

I always give way to boats on my starboard side where possible to do so, that could be wrong but thats what I do.

Not sure why this turned into a raggie / stinker thing , who ever sails out their berth !

I said I saw a tall mast without a sail, could have been a tall VHF mast on a 50ft Sealine !