Help? Contessa 32, Sadler, centurion??

One of the main justifications for buying a Co32 seems to be the residual value, as they are so sought after. But I wonder how their value will hold up as the AWBs drop closer and closer to them. As Daydream says, you can get a 15yr old Hanse for maybe £30k, with better accomodation and performance, whilst a 40yr old Co32 is maybe £20k.
Will older boats continue to be the cheapest option, or at some point will AWBs overtake them?
 
Kelpie said:
One of the main justifications for buying a Co32 seems to be the residual value, as they are so sought after. But I wonder how their value will hold up as the AWBs drop closer and closer to them. As Daydream says, you can get a 15yr old Hanse for maybe £30k, with better accomodation and performance, whilst a 40yr old Co32 is maybe £20k.
Will older boats continue to be the cheapest option, or at some point will AWBs overtake them?
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As the money made available by the OP, and the post above, demonstrates some newer boats are already the cheaper option. There are lots available and some are not standing up too well. There are remarkable sub 15k examples of AWBoats if you are willing to shop in the Med area. However it is probably just as expensive to drag back a 20year old white boat as something with a more established pedigree.

It's clear that the OP has made his decision on general type but we have come to expect that folk with other requirements will wring their hands and say, why oh why does he not want one like mine?
Puerile, yup but I guess we are stuck with it
 
doug748 said:
It's clear that the OP has made his decision on general type but we have come to expect that folk with other requirements will wring their hands and say, why oh why does he not want one like mine?
Puerile, yup but I guess we are stuck with it
Click to expand...

That, of course works both ways! Only natural when one has made a rational choice to find it difficult to understand why others would want anything different. But of course rational has different meanings to different people, particularly where boats are concerned.
 
I can recommend the Rival 32 and 34, far better value for money and they sail better as well, very similar look to the Contessa 32 but without the premium that the Contessa has on price.

Okay, your choice, but in addition to the premium, having just come out of a refit of a 40 year old boat, Rival 41C, which was a quality build in its day, I assure you that it is an expensive business. My point, why pay a premium for an old boat and then pay the refit costs above it? A question I often ask myself these days, however, I can afford it, I have the money spare, so it's my choice.

Really think hard about this, it will cost you far more than you may think. If you are lucky you will get a good example that will still need TLC. If you are unlock you will get what looks like a good example until you delve deeper and realise that you have paid a premium for the class, paid a premium for a good example and now have to pay for the refit. Surveyors are okay, but on old boats I am not so sure they get it correct all the time because a lot of the stuff is well hidden and beyond the visual inspection capability.
 
Kelpie said:
One of the main justifications for buying a Co32 seems to be the residual value
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Sorry but that just isn't the case IMO. Yes, Co32's often have a price premium over other similar aged boats and that premium is held when sold but that is in no way a justification I have every heard expressed for buying one.

Owners buy them because they speak to the heart, look and sail beautifully, can go anywhere and with the original manufacturer still in business can get hold of any parts needed. Oh and there is the Class association for racing and cruising activities and technical support.

Residual values has nothing to do with it.

I'm not saying they are perfect, far from it, they are a compromise live every boat but if you want one, nothing else will do.
 
Concerto said:
To add another very good boat that has similar characteristics to the Co32, then look at the Westerly Fulmar. I am biased as I own one and can say they are a delight to sail singlehanded and have slightly more accomodation than the Co32 or Sadler 32, but in he same length.

This is my nearly fully renovated example, which is not for sale as I am planning to keep her for at least another 10 years.
View attachment 64090 Click on the image to enlarge.

View attachment 64091

This is how she looked 3 years ago. The hull was cream and dull, and generally looking in need of a lot of TLC.

View attachment 64092
Click to expand...

Nice boat and great job on the refurb but you can't really compare to a Contessa visually, the row-away factor is an important consideration for many owners.

Westerly yachts have never really been head-turners, some better than others, but they are very good, solid, practical cruising boats . I am happy to say that as I own both a Westerly and a Contessa, best of both worlds really :-)

Currently having to deal with Westerly's crumbling head-linings - a well trodden path!
 
A 15 year old AWB is just reaching the point when things begin to need replacing e.g. sails, electronics, possibly engine if neglected, etc. Same for a 40 year old boat MAB, but probably for the second time. Unless 2 to 3 years old boats just cost; simple as that. Choose what attracts and go for it.
 
Concerto said:
To add another very good boat that has similar characteristics to the Co32, then look at the Westerly Fulmar. I am biased as I own one and can say they are a delight to sail singlehanded and have slightly more accomodation than the Co32 or Sadler 32, but in he same length.
.
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I looked at westerly's but they just don't have the same aesthetic lines (for me anyway), on paper sure they're a good buy, and a boat with a good following for spares and such!

Daydream believer said:
Seems odd spending that money on an old boat. For that money you could buy a very nice looking boat in the 31 ft range 15 years old years old with considerably better accommodation, better performance & go sailing. You could still get classic lines from what people regard as AWB's. People often remark on how my own boat ( Hanse 312) has a classic look to it & it is 14 years old. ( No I am not flogging it)
It certainly has better accommodation than a Contessa & sails better for what the average sailor needs.
Some are advertised for £30-40K but one has to haggle.
Click to expand...

you're going to have to explain AWB's and what it is, I deal with acronyms all day at work and my brains pickled, I have seen some "modern" boats for sale at roughly 40k and maybe even 30k, but as I mentioned I wouldn't spend more than 30k on the boat itself, the rest is a maintenance fund, you never know when you need sails or a motor!

I have seen the odd feeling 32, or Bavaria, or Beneteau oceanis 321 for example, but they're tired inside and need some love, as they're already at the top end of the budget I wouldn't be prepared to take them on, if there was one cheap enough I would consider it, but not the price they are currently fetching.


doug748 said:
As the money made available by the OP, and the post above, demonstrates some newer boats are already the cheaper option. There are lots available and some are not standing up too well. There are remarkable sub 15k examples of AWBoats if you are willing to shop in the Med area. However it is probably just as expensive to drag back a 20year old white boat as something with a more established pedigree.

It's clear that the OP has made his decision on general type but we have come to expect that folk with other requirements will wring their hands and say, why oh why does he not want one like mine?
Puerile, yup but I guess we are stuck with it
Click to expand...

AWB's im non the wiser still, but I am avoiding the med, a boat can look amazing on paper and in photos and be a dog when you arrive I don't want to go through that heartache, some of the newer boats look like they need the same works as a contessa, yet they are only 15 years young!

Kurrawong_Kid said:
A 15 year old AWB is just reaching the point when things begin to need replacing e.g. sails, electronics, possibly engine if neglected, etc. Same for a 40 year old boat MAB, but probably for the second time. Unless 2 to 3 years old boats just cost; simple as that. Choose what attracts and go for it.
Click to expand...

can i also add MAB to the list of acronyms i don't understand
 
As a CO32 owner I can only agree with the OP's choice. I have sailed on many boats - bigger, smaller, newer, older - and none have managed to engender the same pleasure and connection that I get from mine. Other boats are faster, more spacious, more complex, newer, more luxurious, more etc., and their owners will expound their virtues.
For the OP AWB = average white boat, usually with a fin keel (hopefully) held on to a soap-dish hull with bolts; MAB = manky auld boat, usually with a wineglass shape and a keel that won't fall off.
 
awol said:
As a CO32 owner I can only agree with the OP's choice. I have sailed on many boats - bigger, smaller, newer, older - and none have managed to engender the same pleasure and connection that I get from mine. Other boats are faster, more spacious, more complex, newer, more luxurious, more etc., and their owners will expound their virtues.
For the OP AWB = average white boat, usually with a fin keel (hopefully) held on to a soap-dish hull with bolts; MAB = manky auld boat, usually with a wineglass shape and a keel that won't fall off.
Click to expand...

ah yes, thank you - it all makes sense now, the same reason character homes are in demand as opposed to plasterboard boxes which often have more "rooms" in a similar sq foot print
 
Kenneth McGrew said:
ah yes, thank you - it all makes sense now, the same reason character homes are in demand as opposed to plasterboard boxes which often have more "rooms" in a similar sq foot print
Click to expand...

Neat analogy!

BTW, the ballast on the fin of a Centurion 32 is just under two tonnes... of lead. (Higher density than the cheaper cast iron, therefore more compact for the same weight).
 
I have done a fair few miles on a Contessa 32 and it is genuinely a very nice boat to sail as well as being very seaworthy and quite pretty. As a result they get bought by people who sail a lot, often in conditions that will stop other boats going out. The better a boat sails, the more hard work it tends to get, especially if raced as well. As a result many (probably most) Contessa 32s are pretty tired by now, except for a very few pampered examples and some late-built non-Rogers boats, or originals that have been back to Rogers for an expensive rebuild/refurb.

This http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/boats/c53916/c53916.htm is a nice one ..... but probably more than your budget.
 
so.. I thought I wanted a contessa, well that's just a silly idea (I conceded after a few viewings) I went to see a few and yes they're dog rough, the one which was nice (it was average to be honest im just being polite) but was quite expensive and that little voice in my head was telling me I was a moron.

anyway long story short I came away from that boat and the broker convinced me to look at some other boats, ( I think he could tell from my expression of disappointment looking through the grime and mentioning the smell of stale oil and diesel in the contessa's not to mention the mouldy bunch of bananas in the bilge pump.. who keeps bananas in the bilge pump? anyway I digress)

I think the realisation was when my son (although as enthusiastic about boats as me) said " Dad I bet you hit your head on that door every time you go to the toilet"
and you know what my 8 yr old son was right unless your 2ft 10 its just not practical, sure they're nice to look at and they're pretty boats but £ for £ what the broker showed me I could get for the same money (you could argue that's his job but at least he opened my eyes and could tell I wasn't "contessa material")

so I did look at some other boats, and whatever I said about AWB before hand I retract, so back to the drawing board which is mainly coming up with jeanneau Sun Odyssy 32's and the odd beneteau or baravia

have I completely lost the plot ? or has my brain and common sense finally kicked in? is there something I am missing from these boats as on paper and looking round them last weekend I could see myself happily sailing either of them with preference towards Jeanneau - so much so I nearly jumping in with an offer, but thought nono, lets think about this a bit more...
 
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I missed this thread the first time so I didn't get the chance to say what I always say when people ask about Co 32s and that is have a look at Albin Ballads, very similar but without the premium, beautiful looking boats IMHO. Your budget will get a very nice one with a lot of change for upgrades and a bit left over.

I know AWBs have their benefits with space, better storage etc but the way an IOR boat cuts through water just brings a smile to my face. If I had 30k to buy a boat I'm sure I would be tempted on something newer, but I would be tempted in refitting mine/finding a nicer example and make the ultimate ballad.

I suppose it's all down to the sailing you want to do and with who.
 
"have I completely lost the plot ?"


Possibly, but it is your plot to lose.

As rotrax has said, it is better to draw breath and think things over. You will not get much sailing in this season anyway, unless you rush matters or have a long delivery to make - both are to be avoided.

If your ideas are evolving around the idea of more accommodation, I would look closely at these:

http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/bavaria-32/bavaria-32.htm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHwUcw4mtDY
http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/sailboat/bavaria-32/104987

Relatively easy to buy and sell, lots available around your budget and good value. No raceboat but there we are.
 
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