Has the PC finally come of age? – a review of OpenCPN

[AHoy2]

One of the Chart Nav Pro features I use a lot is the multi-window option with different zoom factors. Seems as if Open CPN can handle this by running multiple instances assuming enough resource on the PC. Not tested with live data yet but example below:

Not tried to get the same route showing on both instances yet.

Edit: test route added

 

[Hurricane]

Memory Map has multiple screens as well.
In fact they synchronise so that as you "pan" in one the other moves as well.
However, not a feature that I've ever needed.
I suppose because I have multiple systems running, there isnt a need for a second window in the same software.

I hadnt thought of multiple instances of OpenCPN.

BTW in order to run multiple instances or even several programs off one GPS/NMEA feed/channel, you need to install some software to share the PC's port. For Windows computers, OpenCPN suggests using VSPE which I found to be a really great utility. In the past, I've had to have a separate channel for each application that I run in the PC - with VSPE you can have as many as you like all running off a single GPS. VSPE works with legacy RS232 or USB1/2 serial devices.

 

[a_g_simpson]

Just to say thank you for an excellent posting - and if possible, would you mind letting me have a copy of the QCT to BSB utility?

Best wishes,
George

 

[franksingleton]

Is iPad an option?

I hope that a yachtie can enter this very interesting debate even though my perspective may differ from yours. We have a Hallberg Rassy 34 and go at speeds rather slower than a Princess. Like many, I am a traditional chart person with basic GPS equipment – a Garmin 152.

My personal problem is one of myopic macular desecration. I have been using OpenCPN for passage planning for a couple of years and find it excellent for that purpose. I can read off the Garmin, check bearing and distance to waypoints, extract positions but have some problems, particularly at night with my paper charts.

I have also used OpenCPN on passage with a GPS dongle, a Prolific ND-100. It worked well with my last computer running under XP. It does not like my new Windows 7, 64 bit machine and crashes are frequent, invariably at the most awkward time. I will have to get another GPS dongle.

Having a yacht with an open cockpit I can be dripping water with the additional hazard in a big sea of a wave crashing over us. Rare, I know, but possible although I try to avoid such conditions. It’s, the weather, you know ............. I discovered some years ago that water on a laptop keyboard can mean death. Another problem on a yacht, especially at night is the power supply needed to top up a laptop battery.

One solution that I am considering is to use an iPad for use en route. This can have an external GPS aerial. It can be in a zip lock plastic bag. It can give a clear reasonably large display that can be shown to the person on the helm. Its power requirements are much less than a laptop.

I would keep the laptop for planning purposes and for easier typing of emails , writing on forums, working on my website and so on. I would keep the Garmin and thus have three independent GPS systems.

Unless I have missed it, I have not seen such an option mentioned. Any views? I guess that I would have to get Navionics charts and software, at least on the basis of advice from others. Currently I use C-Map charts downloaded free from a rather dubious Russian site but always have up to date almanacs (Reeds, CA and le bloc). I have NAVTEX and can keep an eye on NAV warnings.

 

[oceanfroggie]

I use the Garmin for nav plotting, iPad for weather, tides, email, web, etc, and Garmin HomePort for planning. IMHO, we are entering a post PC era for personal use. Android and iOS are the future and now already.

 

[John100156]

......One solution that I am considering is to use an iPad for use en route. This can have an external GPS aerial. It can be in a zip lock plastic bag. It can give a clear reasonably large display that can be shown to the person on the helm. Its power requirements are much less than a laptop.

I would keep the laptop for planning purposes and for easier typing of emails , writing on forums, working on my website and so on. I would keep the Garmin and thus have three independent GPS systems......

Well the iPad was referred to in th OP. It worked well from Gib to SCM and I used it again a week or so ago on a trip from Puerto Las Fuentes to Sant Carles. It has it's own built in GPS that works well. It can also be plugged in to a 12VDC supply, which is convenient.

I use the Navionics Gold chart which is what I used on my C80, so excellent detail/info.

At the touch of a button, you can overlay Google or Bing. Downside 1) It cannot yet send NMEA WP or other info to Chartplotter/Autopilot. 2) The screen is difficult to see in bright sunlight, but very useful as a second aid.

For those unfamiliar with this set-up here are some images:-

Navionics Version

Track Info

Track to SCM

Google Overlay

I think the days of very expensive navigation equipment may soon be numbered, but we are not quite there just yet IMHO!

 

[elton]

I think the days of very expensive navigation equipment may soon be numbered, but we are not quite there just yet IMHO!

I'm quite confident you'll pay vastly more for a daylight readable, waterproof iPad, than for dedicated nav equipment.

 

[Elessar]

I'm quite confident you'll pay vastly more for a daylight readable, waterproof iPad, than for dedicated nav equipment.

what is it with you and iPads?

 

[oceanfroggie]

Having used an iPad 3G/Wifi extensively on board this year I would offer the following personal feedback.

1. Primary role - Marine info apps: Weather, Tides, harbour info, trip advisor
2. Secodary role - Web, eMail
3. Tertiary role - Basic backup plotter - NavionicsHD

For me it has effectively replaced the laptop. It's so portable and light. At times, we do a lot of long passages, often leaving the boat and getting train or plane home, so lightness of tablet has proved great travelling to boat. The new version of NavionicsHD is great, BUT a) it can't store more than ONE route, b) tablet neither water proof nor as shock proof as marine plotter. BUT I would never give up having a proper integrated marine plotter (ie DSC, Radar, AP, instruments, etc).

Btw, the iPad seems to pickup a 3G signal much better than many smart phones. Regularly 10+ miles offshore we had perfect 3G signal.

In summary, Garmin marine plotter for navigation, tablet for information.

 

[franksingleton]

Well the iPad was referred to in th OP. It worked well from Gib to SCM and I used it again a week or so ago on a trip from Puerto Las Fuentes to Sant Carles. It has it's own built in GPS that works well. It can also be plugged in to a 12VDC supply, which is convenient.............

Thanks. I came in to this late and browsed the discussion but missed the iPad reference.

 

[elton]

what is it with you and iPads?

Sorry to keep raining on your parade Mr Jobs (or is that Mr Cook?)

 

[John100156]

I'm quite confident you'll pay vastly more for a daylight readable, waterproof iPad, than for dedicated nav equipment.

Yes, but if you already have an iPad for email/Internet, AutoCAD, Music, Weather and numerous other applications, it costs very little for the Navionics HD App and you have an excelent portable additional navigation aid that weighs very little!

It takes very little effort to waterproof it, in fact we hit some heavy seas en-route from Duq to SCM in Feb/Mar this year, it worked fine with no waterproof protection at all. As I said, the screen is not really bright enough but if the skipper is, he can work out an easy fix in this regard......!

Although I must say Hurric's setup using MMap and OpenCPN is excellent.

My reference to these systems becoming cheaper is wishful thinking, I need to upgrade my RL70+'s next year! Anyone got a couple of cheap C80's or wide series in their cupboard....

 

[Forty_Two]

I use PC Maritimes Navmaster Pro interfaced to my AP8 GPS & a NASA AIS Engine. Charts are Admiralty ARCS with a dongle. Although dongles are a pain it does mean you can load the software on as many other PC's as you like as the software won't run without the dongle.

I started using this in 2005 & just would not do it any other way. I installed a dedicated 12v PC which runs Xp Pro & don't update this unless the Navmaster software needs it. This has only happened once, last year when I took it up to SP3. The only other software loaded is Adobe reader. The whole system boots fast & has never crashed since I installed it. No Antivus as it never connects to the net. Any transfers of routes etc I do via a dedicated memory stick.

I use a Samsung Syncmaster 15" screen on an arm at the helm & a repeater behind a perspex screen in the fly bridge locker. Being a Trawler style boat, brightness is not an issue even in the Med.

For backup I have a laptop with cables to pickup power & GPS which I can rig in a few minutes, but never needed it - yet!

I also have the software loaded on my normal PC in the aft cabin & at home.

I pay about £76 to update my 90 or so ARCS charts once a year & about the same for annually updated software which includes phone/email support. I accept the ARCS charts are not cheap but I don't need to buy many these days, just the odd new ones that appear useful.

I have never had a dedicated chartplotter & wouldn't do so. It does help if you are computer literate otherwise I think you could easily make the wrong decisions on kit.

 

[Hurricane]

Thanks. I came in to this late and browsed the discussion but missed the iPad reference.

Thanks for your comments, Frank.
I think John answered your questions.

However, in the last few months I think I have discovered a big flaw in the use of these new tablets/phones.

I've recently been playing with Android and the GPS receivers on these phone based systems are prety useless.
A conventional GPS receiver "downloads" its georeferencing data from the satellites. The mobile phone industry have discovered that their receovers are so bad that they are using the 3G networks to download the referencing data. There are options to get this data directly from the satellites but most systems seem to be set up to use the terestrial mobile phone network. This then takes the "load" off the phone so the inbuilt GPS only needs to get its position info thus aquiring its position much quicker.

So, IMO, these phone devices (and I include the Pads) seem to have very poor GPS receivers in comparason to (say) a dedicated marine GPS.
This coule be very dangerous, especially if people start to use the "phone/Pad" technology in anger.

I've also noticed that the phone systems are also very inaccurate - the GPS position is nothing like as good as any maring GPS system.

In comparason, the cheap GPS dongle that I bought from Amazon and plugged into my Windows PC is very accurate and doesnt seem to suffer in the same way as the phone GPS systems.

John, Its interesting that your iPad was close to a terestrial signal all the time - I wonder what it will be like away from the coast.

Treat this new technology with care.

 

[franksingleton]

Thanks for your comments, Frank.
I think John answered your questions.

However, in the last few months I think I have discovered a big flaw in the use of these new tablets/phones.

I've recently been playing with Android and the GPS receivers on these phone based systems are prety useless.................

It was those considerations that made me think ( and from talking to others) that I would need a separate GPS aerial plugged into the iPad.

My idea is simply to put the iPad in a zip lock bag when it may get wet. Being rather paranoid about back-up, I do like the idea of keeping my tried and trusted Garmin 152, having an iPad with a its own aerial and the laptop ditto. It seems to me that you need to spend a lot of money bto get a dedicated chart plotter with the screen size as large as the iPad.

I am still in the thinking stage and am intereseted in all the various views put forward.

 

[Hurricane]

It was those considerations that made me think ( and from talking to others) that I would need a separate GPS aerial plugged into the iPad.

My idea is simply to put the iPad in a zip lock bag when it may get wet. Being rather paranoid about back-up, I do like the idea of keeping my tried and trusted Garmin 152, having an iPad with a its own aerial and the laptop ditto. It seems to me that you need to spend a lot of money bto get a dedicated chart plotter with the screen size as large as the iPad.

I am still in the thinking stage and am intereseted in all the various views put forward.

An alternative to the iPad that will be "hitting the market" is the new Android tablets.
Like iPad, Navionics apps are available for the Android but there is another really good option. An Android app called MMTracker runs on the Android. It uses all the Memory Map (PC) QCT raster charts and is great for planning. I have a set of Admiralty charts for our part of the Med and they transfer between the Android and PC seemlessly. Not used it on an Android Tablet yet but I'll be asking SWMBO for one for XMAS - just to play with.

As far as my boat systems are concerned, I will continue to have a Windows PC connected to all the Raymarine plotters. This gives me two entirtely different systems that integrate betweem themselves. The Raymarine plotters provide the reliability and the PC provides flexibility and planning (and a whole load of other things) like weather and your very helpful website!!!

 

[sarabande]

Hurricane - a quick question on the integration, and SPOFs if I may.

I am all in favour of systems redundancy, so does the 'integration' mean that the current data on Sys A is automatically ported to SysB and overlaid, and then back again ? Is this a potential point of failure in Sys B, if Sys A decides to go loopy and send erroneous info ?

I'm aware of the independence of the original chart data (which can't be overwritten ?), but concerned that your current geolocation may shuttled back and forth in a terminal loop. (I know from previous posts that you religiously keep the paper ones updated, so have little fear of JW going round in ever-decreasing circles).

Can the systems be run independently using separately sourced GPS data data if the other one fails ?



TIA

 

[John100156]

....I've also noticed that the phone systems are also very inaccurate - the GPS position is nothing like as good as any maring GPS system....

.....John, Its interesting that your iPad was close to a terestrial signal all the time - I wonder what it will be like away from the coast.....
Treat this new technology with care.

I checked the GPS position several times on my iPad against my boat GPS during my last trip 'pootling' back from Las Fuentes, it was spot on, also when passing the deep water Chanel markers into SCM. I was in close though, I would not be so confident using it to say cross over to Mallorca. But as I say, a very useful and entirely separate, light and portable second aid that if you already own an ipad for other reasons, is cheap to set up Navionics on. I wonder, if like all the other Apps, if the charts are upgraded regularly?

I only have an iPad-1, I am not aware of any external GPS(?) that can be connected to it. I had an external GPS connected to my old laptop, but that's a different story, the HDD failed last time out, I suppose I should have installed a vibration proof one.....

I must say that Mike's setup works well. He has put in a lot of time setting it up and obtaining and converting charts and his willingness to share all this info is much appreciated.

For me, my intention is to upgrade my old Raymarine kit next year (OK, I admit it, I am also going to look at Garmin at SIBS) which will give me more time to assess the iPad on longer journeys, purely as a secondary backup.....

 

[vas]

thanks to all the info posted I now have a backup system setup using my vaio netbook and opencpn.

One comment though on the arguments against phone gps receivers:
I've put an awful lot of km in land on my mobile as a navigator using a range of different s/w and OSes. Android is by far the best, doesn't call to get the newest ref points and still is acurate.
I know street nav s/w have a keep on the road option which I always unselect. I very rarely find myself 10-15m off the spot and it has to be a narrow set of streets with 6-7storey bldgs to reach 20m off target.

I'd have thought that in the sea that will be closer to 10m and I accept that dedicated systems with external gps antennas may be accurate down to 1m or less, but do we REALLY need that? I mean you wont get the autopilot to bring the boat to it's berth, nor will you plan a route 10m of a shallow or dangerous point. So is it really an issue (considering that no matter what, you have always an eye on the sea...)

For me the ability to recycle one of my old netbooks sitting doing nothing, the low cost of scanning paper charts of which I have a few of the areas I'm interested and the ability to use my mouse to plot, wheel mouse to zoom and check all sorts of other things is an all win situation.
Then I can also setup my mobile to take georef. photos off the side helm window on set intervals and have a visual slideshow type of trip reference...

cheers

V.

 

[franksingleton]

...............

I only have an iPad-1, I am not aware of any external GPS(?) that can be connected to it. I had an external GPS connected to my old laptop, but that's a different story, the HDD failed last time out, I suppose I should have installed a vibration proof one...................

I am told that the BadElf GPS aerial will work with correct plug for the iPad.