Hammerite on keels of the "dead Centaur"

dylanwinter

dylanwinter

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Joined
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Buckingham
www.keepturningleft.co.uk
Just working out some costs

it seems that one way or another the keels on whatever I buy will need the loose rust removing - my weapon of choice is a rotary wire brush on a drill

I then need to cover them with something that will hold the rust up for a year

Hammerite?

or something else

it has got to be quick and simple - no faring, sanding, fairing, sanding etc


update on the Centaur seeking

Boat 1 in the film was a Pageant

Boat 2 has been re-engined

Boat 3 -the owner has my phone number but has not called

Spindrift - the bloke would rather let it die in the yard and end up in a skip

there are a couple of others I am persuing remotely - one in North Norfolk the other in Essex

Dinorwic is still on the hard, full of water and rotting as well

I have until the end of March before making a new plan

I confess that I had not quite appreciated how keen some owners are on letting old boats rot

does anyone want to "borrow" Katie L for 12 months?

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/scuttlebutt/first-trawl-of-the-solent/

 
Last edited:
dylanwinter said:
Just working out some costs

it seems that one way or another the keels on whatever I buy will need the loose rust removing - my weapon of choice is a rotary wire brush on a drill

I then need to cover them with something that will hold the rust up for a year

Hammerite?

or something else

it has got to be quick and simple - no faring, sanding, fairing, sanding etc

D
Click to expand...
I think a needle gun is better than a wire brush. Hammerite used to be a lot better in the old days, maybe something like an epoxy coal tar paint (I think Hempels do one), but as with all these things cost is going to be a factor I'm sure.
 
srp said:
I think a needle gun is better than a wire brush. Hammerite used to be a lot better in the old days, maybe something like an epoxy coal tar paint (I think Hempels do one), but as with all these things cost is going to be a factor I'm sure.
Click to expand...

do you think they have changed the formulation?

the Sonata keel was hammerite...

and... I already have an old drill and some rotary wire brushes so I shall start with those and see how I get on

d
 
dylanwinter said:
it seems that one way or another the keels on whatever I buy will need the loose rust removing - my weapon of choice is a rotary wire brush on a drill

I then need to cover them with something that will hold the rust up for a year
Click to expand...

Are you sure you want to do that? The problem with rusty flaky surfaces is that the very expensive antifouling you put on them falls off with the next flake. But if you're not going to antifoul (are you?), why bother?

FWIW, I'd use a sanding disk in a cheap angle grinder and then primocon. Is hammerite really much less expensive?
 
James_Calvert said:
Are you sure you want to do that? The problem with rusty flaky surfaces is that the very expensive antifouling you put on them falls off with the next flake. But if you're not going to antifoul (are you?), why bother?

FWIW, I'd use a sanding disk in a cheap angle grinder and then primocon. Is hammerite really much less expensive?
Click to expand...

will a wire brush not work

I confess that I have never had keels as bad as boat 1 - and the old rotray wire brush worked fine

hamerite is available at screwfix

and you are correct about the anti-foul - I have not used any for the past five years - but in this case I was thinking of giving it a coat - as much for cosmentics as anything else. I am not sure that the centaur will be ashore as much as Katie L or the slug. Not as many shingle beaches and hards

might be wrong of course

D
 
I'd think a wire brush would work, to some extent. But bits of rusty scale would be left behind, which would chip off in time and take your cosmetic treatment with it. Depends how bad it is. The other thing is that wire brushing (or anything) using an ordinary electric drill can be quite slow, whereas you can comparatively whizz along with something like an angle grinder, because of its higher rpm. So worth begging or borrowing one if you don't want to spend the £20-£30 on a cheapo from B&Q/ Wilko or wherever.

Eye protection etc even more important at the higher speeds of course.
 
I find wire brushes on power tools tend to just polish the rust. Which stops the rust converter working and is a poor key for the paint.

You can get angle grinder flap disks that seem to work better. Still a horrible job. Got a cheap angle grinder for £20. Better than a drill because you can brace your arms against the surface.

I used a rust converter followed by epoxy primer. Cost was eye watering! But then hammerite is even more expensive. And has weird recoating rules.

Next time I'm getting is blasted!
 
Wire brush will be a waste of time & effort. I hired a needle gun for a day for mine. Still hard work, but worth the hire charge (under 50 quid I think). I then filled a couple of casting voids that were revealed & gave it a coat of primocon followed by red lead & antifoul. Still OK 3 years on. A reasonable finish will help improve the resale value.
 
dylanwinter said:
Just working out some costs

it seems that one way or another the keels on whatever I buy will need the loose rust removing - my weapon of choice is a rotary wire brush on a drill

I then need to cover them with something that will hold the rust up for a year

Hammerite?

or something else

it has got to be quick and simple - no faring, sanding, fairing, sanding etc


update on the Centaur seeking

Boat 1 in the film was a Pageant

Boat 2 has been re-engined

Boat 3 -the owner has my phone number but has not called

Spindrift - the bloke would rather let it die in the yard and end up in a skip

there are a couple of others I am persuing remotely - one in North Norfolk the other in Essex

Dinorwic is still on the hard, full of water and rotting as well

I have until the end of March before making a new plan

I confess that I had not quite appreciated how keen some owners are on letting old boats rot

does anyone want to "borrow" Katie L for 12 months?

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/scuttlebutt/first-trawl-of-the-solent/

Click to expand...
Peeps get bent out of shape over rust on a keel! It aint going to make it sink! It aint going to rust through!
On my first Bene there was what looked like gel coat on the keel, rust was making it bubble. I got a cheap grinder, ground the worst of roughly, slapped some red lead paint on it, then some hammerite and then anti fouled. Every year it got less and less!
IT wasnt a prob!
Stop fixating on percieved probs, buy the bleddy thing!
Stu
 
James_Calvert said:
I'd use a sanding disk in a cheap angle grinder and then primocon.
Click to expand...

+ 1 for this solution. I did the keels this way on my previous bilge keel boat and it was fairly easy although very dusty. You can get good abrasive discs which are much better than sanding discs for not much money. Deals often come up in Aldi/Lidl although Screwfix is also not too bad. Something like this on a backing pad:

http://www.screwfix.com/p/norton-fibre-disc-115-x-1-5-x-22mm-36-grit-pack-of-10/23237

Secret is to get the primacon on as soon as the keels have been abraded back to bare metal and don't let any rust form. I actually borrowed an angle grinder from the boatyard and just paid for the discs I used.
 
skipper_stu said:
Peeps get bent out of shape over rust on a keel! It aint going to make it sink! It aint going to rust through!
On my first Bene there was what looked like gel coat on the keel, rust was making it bubble. I got a cheap grinder, ground the worst of roughly, slapped some red lead paint on it, then some hammerite and then anti fouled. Every year it got less and less!
IT wasnt a prob!
Stop fixating on percieved probs, buy the bleddy thing!
Stu
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. You have nothing to fear but fear itself Dylan.
 
On my old westerly (now with a new owner) that had a very rusty keep I used a wire brush on a drill (but agree than an angle-grinder would be easier to manage and a needle gun would give better results), followed by a rust converter (cheap one, "Krust" or similar), then lots of coats of blakes (may be international?) "Keel Prime" undercoat then AF.

Overall it worked well, each year there were a few spots of rust that came back that were spot-treated as above.

Without spending a lot of time and effort (or money) there is no permanent fix, the above was good enough for me as I would rather be sailing.

Hammerite used to be good - but since it's change in formulation is no better than average.
 
skipper_stu said:
Peeps get bent out of shape over rust on a keel! It aint going to make it sink! It aint going to rust through!
On my first Bene there was what looked like gel coat on the keel, rust was making it bubble. I got a cheap grinder, ground the worst of roughly, slapped some red lead paint on it, then some hammerite and then anti fouled. Every year it got less and less!
IT wasnt a prob!
Stop fixating on percieved probs, buy the bleddy thing!
Stu
Click to expand...

first I have to find it

and now that I am getting my eye in I need to know what has to be fixed and what can wait

believe me I will avoid any work that does not need doing

but if I end up buying someting with keels like boat 1 in my list then I would feel the need to do something with them

but the others looked as though they were pretty much ready to roll.

if you stumble across a candidate boat I would be very grateful to hear about it

dylan.winter@virgin.net
 
Georgio said:
On my old westerly (now with a new owner) that had a very rusty keep I used a wire brush on a drill (but agree than an angle-grinder would be easier to manage and a needle gun would give better results), followed by a rust converter (cheap one, "Krust" or similar), then lots of coats of blakes (may be international?) "Keel Prime" undercoat then AF.

Overall it worked well, each year there were a few spots of rust that came back that were spot-treated as above.

Without spending a lot of time and effort (or money) there is no permanent fix, the above was good enough for me as I would rather be sailing.

Hammerite used to be good - but since it's change in formulation is no better than average.
Click to expand...


bumma about it changing....

it was always my paint of choice for trailers, centre plates and keels

D
 
When Chiron went to Kip there was some scary rust on the keels:



I started with an angle grinder with a coarse flappy wheel on and that worked OK. It did tend to clog a bit with anti fouling paint though.

I also used another angle grinder with a grinding disc on for some of the worst bits.

The really bad bits I hit with a hammer and the rust flakes pinged off along with the antifoul, I then ground those back to metal with the grinding disc.

I put rust eater "Kurust" on, IIRC it has some primer properties, or I may have had to prime it before Anti Foul, my memory is a bit hazy now.
 
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