Had this dream since childhood - considering making it a reality

forestboy said:
How much roughly would having something like a full yacht master license effect insurance, or at least a coastal yacht master license.
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"License" is not quite the right word, as it means official permission to do something you're otherwise not allowed to. And as a British person in a British-registered vessel you already have a perfect right to operate any boat under 24 metres for your own private purposes.

That said, if you have no sailing experience then a training course is a very good idea. The RYA do a graded series of courses -

Competent Crew
Day Skipper
Coastal Skipper / Yachtmaster Coastal (they rebranded and messed about with this one a bit, I'm not quite certain of the details)
Yachtmaster Offshore
Yachtmaster Ocean

The ones with Yachtmaster in the name involve a practical exam, the others you're assessed over the course and passed unless you prove a complete numpty.

How much difference do they make to insurance? I don't know, to be honest, as I've never compared. But my gut feeling is that if you can't point to years of prior experience then a Day Skipper ticket might well make a useful difference.

forestboy said:
And if you were somewhere unfamiliar how do you know your boat is totally safe when moored when you are on shore?
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How do you know your car is totally safe when you park it on the street in a strange city? The answer is that you don't. That's what insurance is for. But I don't think that theft of or from boats on a cruise is a big problem, it's not something we hear much about. Theft from boats left long-term on isolated moorings (or even less-secure marinas) can sometimes be a problem. I've only known of one boat itself being stolen, they're not very easy to move or to hide.

Pete
 
forestboy said:
Couple of questions someone might be kind enough to have a go at answering.

....

And if you were somewhere unfamiliar how do you know your boat is totally safe when moored when you are on shore?

Cheers
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there is at least one remote monitoring and burglar alarm system on the market. It is a box of tricks that hooks up to several sensors and takes a mobile phone sim card - it can be programmed to call you if anything goes wrong and you can send it a text message to ask for a status report.
 
OK cheers Pete. Wasn't expecting that answer as I just figured it's a big world and with something as geographically versatile as a big boat, it might be desirable to pinch to go far away on and live, if not sell, which I would have thought would be more difficult.

Re the courses. Yeah I've looked into them and I'm very interested in doing some courses prior to doing this. I'm generally a bit of a winger in things, which hasn't served me badly, but this time I really want to do things properly. Also, the more and more I think about it, the more I want to really travel the world. Not even bother with the med, just go straight past, down the coast of Africa and then cross over the Atlantic to the carribean and south America and such. perhaps even go all the way round. I've always been fascinated with South America and parts of Africa. I'm going to begin courses with this mission in mind.

Part of the reason I like that 38ft cat is cos from what I'm reading it's very sailable single handed, and though designed as a coaster can handle blue water. I'm not bothered about proving myself as an arduous sailer, I'd like some comfort and don't care for proving my manhood by having things too taxing. At the same time, of course I love a challenge. I'm still looking at all sorts, including mono's but really really leaning towards cats. It's just the cost factor that might change my mind and end up with a mono. I don't want to be still talking about this in 5 years as something I'm still planning to do if you know what I mean.

Thanks
 
maby said:
there is at least one remote monitoring and burglar alarm system on the market. It is a box of tricks that hooks up to several sensors and takes a mobile phone sim card - it can be programmed to call you if anything goes wrong and you can send it a text message to ask for a status report.
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OK thanks Maby. I figured there must be. It depends how bullet proof they are. If I could find something that couldn't be bypassed quickly then as long as I wasn't hours away from the boat and unable to call the coastguard I'd probably be safe I guess! I'm more concerned about this because it would be so gutting to invest nearly everything into a boat, make it your home, go off travelling and someone steel every thing you own in one fell swoop!
 
forestboy said:
OK thanks Maby. I figured there must be. It depends how bullet proof they are. If I could find something that couldn't be bypassed quickly then as long as I wasn't hours away from the boat and unable to call the coastguard I'd probably be safe I guess! I'm more concerned about this because it would be so gutting to invest nearly everything into a boat, make it your home, go off travelling and someone steel every thing you own in one fell swoop!
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Practical Boat Owner reviewed one in their new products pages a few months ago. It was interesting, but we wanted more functionality, so we are in the process of designing and building our own - when we are finished, we may try to market it provided nobody else has established a big lead in the market.

It's also worth looking at some of the ideas that have been bounced around by the YAPP team - it's the sort of thing they may have had a go at. See http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?356361-YAPP-production-line-view-from-the-factory-floor
 
maby said:
Practical Boat Owner reviewed one in their new products pages a few months ago. It was interesting, but we wanted more functionality, so we are in the process of designing and building our own - when we are finished, we may try to market it provided nobody else has established a big lead in the market.

It's also worth looking at some of the ideas that have been bounced around by the YAPP team - it's the sort of thing they may have had a go at. See http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?356361-YAPP-production-line-view-from-the-factory-floor
Click to expand...


OK thanks. I'll take a look when I get home.

I was thinking that surely there must be a way of embedding a gps thingy into the hull itself or somewhere on the boat that would be effect structural integrity to remove so it just cannot be removed without pulling the boat out of the water and doing extensive work. I can't believe that nothing along those lines has been produced. At least that way even if pro's took it you would have several hours to find it or even less it signalled to you it was on the move as well. It would be impossible to steal if you were in range surely.
 
forestboy said:
OK thanks. I'll take a look when I get home.

I was thinking that surely there must be a way of embedding a gps thingy into the hull itself or somewhere on the boat that would be effect structural integrity to remove so it just cannot be removed without pulling the boat out of the water and doing extensive work. I can't believe that nothing along those lines has been produced. At least that way even if pro's took it you would have several hours to find it or even less it signalled to you it was on the move as well. It would be impossible to steal if you were in range surely.
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Most boats have plenty of hiding places for a small device. If all you are looking for is tracking, then there are off-the-shelf solutions like Loc8tor (http://www.loc8tor.com/uk/loc8tor-gps-tracker.html?___store=ukview) that will do it at pretty low cost - provided your boat stays within range of the cellphone network. If it is stolen and taken more than a few miles off-shore, then you would need far more expensive satellite technology to communicate with it.
 
My motorhome has a fairly sophisticated alarm system that does tracking, I can interrogate it with a mobile phone anywhere in the world that there is a signal. I can also immobilise it by mobile phone and use a wide range of alarms, e.g. anyone trying to get in while we are asleep and therefore potentially moving inside, or when we are absent.
 
forestboy said:
Hmmm yes, I'm seeing what you are meaning!
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I don't often venture into this forum but, after 19 years as a live aboard, I feel that I must add my two penneth.
1. Either this is a fun wind up or you are not ready to go to sea or live on a boat.
2. Commercial vessels pay commercial rates to tie to quays not to visit marinas.
3. Commercial vessels pay commercial rates to be slipped in commercial shipyards. They would never be welcome in any yacht harbour or marina.
4. You need years of experience to obtain commercial captain's tickets. Not to mention commercial insurance.
5. If you say that you intend to have a family. They might want some social life. This you will get little of in a commercial port.
6. You will never go to sea. IMHO. As you will seldom have a port of destination which will accept you.
7. Super yacht ports. The size of ship you are talking about, will not accept you because you are not a super yacht, you do not look like a super yacht andyou would not pay the (estimated) thousands per day to berth. porto Cervo at last look was charging about €500 per night for 60 ft.
8. You may be successful but you have no idea of the running costs of a ship of this size. You buy tonnes of fuel. Your paint will cost thousands to buy and you will then have to apply it. You need also to be a qualified engineer to keep the systems going. Probably an insurance condition as well.
9. Why do you and your prospective family need a commercial ship to live on/in. This might be an impediment to finding a partner unless she is very naive and then she will soon wake up to the realities.
10.If you really want to go to sea, which, I must say, i sincerely doubt. Choose something in the 40/50 ft range and find out if you can afford to or are capable of coping with the life.

Please go back to sleep and dream on. Reality is very different.
 
Just try and bear in mind maintenance and running costs. I lived on a 37' mobo. Twin engines. Cost me about £40k.
My boatyard charged me £4000 per year as a liveaboard. £330 EACH WAY for craning. Antifoul. Diodes. Calor gas for cooking and shore power came to another £4-500 per year. Insurance £400ish. Engines serviced £50 PER HOUR not including parts. Batteries at £95 each, I had 5. They only last a few years.
Then there's things like sails. Apparently they like to rip and cost a lot to replace.
I thought that living aboard would be affordable when I was earning about £18k per year. That's £300 per week take home. Not a chance. By the time you run a (£400) banger, have a phone and eat, it gets really hard. Worse, it gets really depressing as the list of things you should do, but can't afford grows. You soon find that you can't afford the annual maintenance, then comes something that needs doing every 3 or 5 years that costs a LOT of money and you really are stuck.
I managed for 7 years.
Maybe I just had bad luck.
But I have to admit I loved it, and if I could afford to do it again in comfort, or choose a different kind of boat and location then I probably would.
 
OTOH, I run my boat for <£1000 a year. Admittedly not liveaboard, but there are a wide range of cost options.
I think you'd be unlucky for a boat to cost more than a house...
 
maby said:
Most boats have plenty of hiding places for a small device. If all you are looking for is tracking, then there are off-the-shelf solutions like Loc8tor (http://www.loc8tor.com/uk/loc8tor-gps-tracker.html?___store=ukview) that will do it at pretty low cost - provided your boat stays within range of the cellphone network. If it is stolen and taken more than a few miles off-shore, then you would need far more expensive satellite technology to communicate with it.
Click to expand...

But what I am wondering is if this devices can be located with some kind of tracking device so hiding it away is not full proof. I would want more than a device hidden away in my sock drawer.
 
Frankie-H said:
I don't often venture into this forum but, after 19 years as a live aboard, I feel that I must add my two penneth.
1. Either this is a fun wind up or you are not ready to go to sea or live on a boat.
2. Commercial vessels pay commercial rates to tie to quays not to visit marinas.
3. Commercial vessels pay commercial rates to be slipped in commercial shipyards. They would never be welcome in any yacht harbour or marina.
4. You need years of experience to obtain commercial captain's tickets. Not to mention commercial insurance.
5. If you say that you intend to have a family. They might want some social life. This you will get little of in a commercial port.
6. You will never go to sea. IMHO. As you will seldom have a port of destination which will accept you.
7. Super yacht ports. The size of ship you are talking about, will not accept you because you are not a super yacht, you do not look like a super yacht andyou would not pay the (estimated) thousands per day to berth. porto Cervo at last look was charging about €500 per night for 60 ft.
8. You may be successful but you have no idea of the running costs of a ship of this size. You buy tonnes of fuel. Your paint will cost thousands to buy and you will then have to apply it. You need also to be a qualified engineer to keep the systems going. Probably an insurance condition as well.
9. Why do you and your prospective family need a commercial ship to live on/in. This might be an impediment to finding a partner unless she is very naive and then she will soon wake up to the realities.
10.If you really want to go to sea, which, I must say, i sincerely doubt. Choose something in the 40/50 ft range and find out if you can afford to or are capable of coping with the life.

Please go back to sleep and dream on. Reality is very different.
Click to expand...

Yeah OK I was ignorant on the matter. I figured some people have 100 ft barges, why not a 100 ft ship. Not realising due to a wide variety of impracticable reasons, finances aside, the project would be untenable.

However, regarding living aboard or going to sea; unless you are the love child of Sherlock Holmes and Sigmand Freud and have somehow deduced from a mere few hundred words my entire character, do not assume what I am or am not capable of doing. You don't know me!
 
simon barefoot said:
Just try and bear in mind maintenance and running costs. I lived on a 37' mobo. Twin engines. Cost me about £40k.
My boatyard charged me £4000 per year as a liveaboard. £330 EACH WAY for craning. Antifoul. Diodes. Calor gas for cooking and shore power came to another £4-500 per year. Insurance £400ish. Engines serviced £50 PER HOUR not including parts. Batteries at £95 each, I had 5. They only last a few years.
Then there's things like sails. Apparently they like to rip and cost a lot to replace.
I thought that living aboard would be affordable when I was earning about £18k per year. That's £300 per week take home. Not a chance. By the time you run a (£400) banger, have a phone and eat, it gets really hard. Worse, it gets really depressing as the list of things you should do, but can't afford grows. You soon find that you can't afford the annual maintenance, then comes something that needs doing every 3 or 5 years that costs a LOT of money and you really are stuck.
I managed for 7 years.
Maybe I just had bad luck.
But I have to admit I loved it, and if I could afford to do it again in comfort, or choose a different kind of boat and location then I probably would.
Click to expand...

Thank you Simon. I am coming to terms with the costs involved. And I also don't really get lucky, more to the point, if I ever, ever, don't cross all my t's and dot my eyes, they bite me every time. However, I do earn a good wage because I do multiple things. I think, if I tweaked my business for another year or so I could effectively gross 20k for 6 months work yearly, which would also bring my tax right down too. With a bit of luck find spatterings of work while travelling here and there.
 
I'll admit I haven't read the entire thread, but thought I'd chuck in a couple of pennies worth from my own (reasonably limited) experience.

'er indoors and I are currently living on our 35ft Southerly. A relatively small sailing boat built in 1979. We've taken a couple of years out to travel down to the Med, sail around a bit and then head back to the UK. We spent this last season travelling from the Solent to Greece. Technically, we are liveaboards, although this is only for a few years.

I'll start off with the bad: It's always more expensive than you'd think! Once you're aware of that, it's not that bad. We bought our boat needing quite a lot of work. More than I'd realised. But I've learnt a lot about the various bits and pieces.

The ship you originally listed, as you're aware, is completely unsuitable, unless you have a spare few million lying around and fancy a classic project.
We travelled through the French canals to get to the Med. We saw a lot of very nice dutch barges along the way. I'm not sure how seaworthy they are, but if you're travelling through the waterway system in inland Europe, they're great. Absolutely tons of space, and are affordable (judging by the number of people who have them!). Not so good in the UK due to the very limited and small canals.

Anyway, back to being more general. Living aboard isn't a massively cheap way to live, but probably no more expensive than living in a flat/house in certain areas. If you have a nice boat, it can be lovely.
 
Last edited:
Hello forestboy.

I would echo the last thoughts. I have owned 4 boats, all yachts up to 33 ft. The last two I owned jointly so the cost was shared and halved.

Think carefully about what you take on. The major cost is not buying the boat but maintaining it!!

We bought a 33 ft boat for £30K which had been neglected to two years but we spent about £24K on it over 6 seasons. This included mooring insurance, maintenance, food and hols on it.

Also take into account fuel cost. I sailing boat with a motor has two forms of propulsion!! Sailing takes no fuel but often you have to motor sail to get to a destination.

It depends whether you want to go places or just stay put and live aboard I guess.

Best of luck in your search.

Peter
 
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