euca
New member
Who could please tell me the difference of GRP and FRP?
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GRP
- Thread starter euca
- Start date
Wiggo
New member
Re: None, mostly
Glass Reinforced Plastic/Polyester vs Fibre Reinforced Plastic. FRP could also include kevlar/carbon fibres and other strange high tech stuff, I s'pose.
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Glass Reinforced Plastic/Polyester vs Fibre Reinforced Plastic. FRP could also include kevlar/carbon fibres and other strange high tech stuff, I s'pose.
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Kevin
New member
Re: None, mostly
So the difference between fibreglass and GRP is that fibreglass may contain other fibres other than polyester?
kevin
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So the difference between fibreglass and GRP is that fibreglass may contain other fibres other than polyester?
kevin
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Wiggo
New member
Re: None, mostly
No, fibreglas is GRP - the 'P' is the polyester resin that binds it all together - If we're going to be picky, I suppose fibrelass is Glassfibre Reinforced Polyester, though no doubt someone will point out that they also use vinylester and epoxy resins...
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No, fibreglas is GRP - the 'P' is the polyester resin that binds it all together - If we're going to be picky, I suppose fibrelass is Glassfibre Reinforced Polyester, though no doubt someone will point out that they also use vinylester and epoxy resins...
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Kevin
New member
Re: None, mostly
Its just that i read that against popular belief fibreglass does/can differ from GRP and that its a misconception that they are the same, never found out what the difference was supposed to be though. It went on to say that cars like TVR use fibreglass but in the boat world its GRP
apologies for butting into your post! just interested.
kevin
Its just that i read that against popular belief fibreglass does/can differ from GRP and that its a misconception that they are the same, never found out what the difference was supposed to be though. It went on to say that cars like TVR use fibreglass but in the boat world its GRP
apologies for butting into your post! just interested.
kevin
Wiggo
New member
Re: None, mostly
There are lots of different types, to be sure, just like all wood isn't the same. But in principle, all fibre reinforced plastics are a matrix of fibres embedded in a plastic/resin. The differences come from the material used for the fibres (e.g. glass, plastics, carbon, kevlar etc), the form of those fibres (e.g. woven rovings, chopped strand etc) and the resin (polyester, vinylester, epoxies etc).
They all work the same way, by providing a mass of paths for a crack to propagate, thereby dissipating energy through the matrix. That is why you can craze GRP/FRP panels through impact, but actually tearing the stuff apart is incredibly difficult - all the individual fibres have to be ripped from the matrix, and are tangled around each other.
update
Fiberglass or fibreglass is material made from extremely fine fibers of glass. It is widely used in the manufacture of insulation and textiles. It is also used as a reinforcing agent for many plastic products, the result being a composite material called glass-reinforced plastic or GRP.
Glassmakers throughout history had experimented with glass fibers, but innovations such as fiberglass were only made possible with the advent of finer machine-tooling. In 1893, Edward Drummond Libbey exhibited a dress at the World Columbian Exposition incorporating glass fibers with the diameter and texture of silk fibers.
What is commonly known as "fiberglass" today, however, was invented in 1938 by Russell Games Slayter of Owens-Corning as a material to be used as insulation. It is marketed under the trade name Fiberglas.
The term 'fiberglass' is often used, rather imprecisely, for glass-reinforced plastic (GRP)
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<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.fairlinetarga29.info>Buy my boat!</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Wiggo on 15/03/2004 14:25 (server time).</FONT></P>
There are lots of different types, to be sure, just like all wood isn't the same. But in principle, all fibre reinforced plastics are a matrix of fibres embedded in a plastic/resin. The differences come from the material used for the fibres (e.g. glass, plastics, carbon, kevlar etc), the form of those fibres (e.g. woven rovings, chopped strand etc) and the resin (polyester, vinylester, epoxies etc).
They all work the same way, by providing a mass of paths for a crack to propagate, thereby dissipating energy through the matrix. That is why you can craze GRP/FRP panels through impact, but actually tearing the stuff apart is incredibly difficult - all the individual fibres have to be ripped from the matrix, and are tangled around each other.
update
Fiberglass or fibreglass is material made from extremely fine fibers of glass. It is widely used in the manufacture of insulation and textiles. It is also used as a reinforcing agent for many plastic products, the result being a composite material called glass-reinforced plastic or GRP.
Glassmakers throughout history had experimented with glass fibers, but innovations such as fiberglass were only made possible with the advent of finer machine-tooling. In 1893, Edward Drummond Libbey exhibited a dress at the World Columbian Exposition incorporating glass fibers with the diameter and texture of silk fibers.
What is commonly known as "fiberglass" today, however, was invented in 1938 by Russell Games Slayter of Owens-Corning as a material to be used as insulation. It is marketed under the trade name Fiberglas.
The term 'fiberglass' is often used, rather imprecisely, for glass-reinforced plastic (GRP)
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<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.fairlinetarga29.info>Buy my boat!</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Wiggo on 15/03/2004 14:25 (server time).</FONT></P>
Kevin
New member
Re: None, mostly
Ok, I think i was confused as I believed that fibrelgass was a generic term for the construction process whilst GRP was a specific type of that construction.
In that case then without knowing the actual fibres and resins used in boat construction it is nigh on impossible to determine the actual quality or be able to compare hulls ( i appreciate there are minimum standards the manufacturers must use) when making a purchase other than by asking for the detail components used in the lay up along with knowing the actual design and construction of the hull.
just read your update so in a way they could differ possibly, but in a way it might only be the same as people calling all vacuum cleaners hoovers.
thanks for the info intersting to know.
kevin
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Kevin on 15/03/2004 14:38 (server time).</FONT></P>
Ok, I think i was confused as I believed that fibrelgass was a generic term for the construction process whilst GRP was a specific type of that construction.
In that case then without knowing the actual fibres and resins used in boat construction it is nigh on impossible to determine the actual quality or be able to compare hulls ( i appreciate there are minimum standards the manufacturers must use) when making a purchase other than by asking for the detail components used in the lay up along with knowing the actual design and construction of the hull.
just read your update so in a way they could differ possibly, but in a way it might only be the same as people calling all vacuum cleaners hoovers.
thanks for the info intersting to know.
kevin
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Kevin on 15/03/2004 14:38 (server time).</FONT></P>
Wiggo
New member
Re: None, mostly
It's more complex than that, I believe, Kevin. Even if you know the resins and fibres used, and the type of mat (woven vs chopped strand etc), you need to consider lay-up weight (kg/sq m), the ratio of resin to fibre, how well compacted it is (air trapped in the matrix severely compromises it), how accurately the resin was mixed (unused/unreacted chemicals in the resin are what cause osmosis - they react with water to release crystals that start to delaminate the material) etc etc.
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It's more complex than that, I believe, Kevin. Even if you know the resins and fibres used, and the type of mat (woven vs chopped strand etc), you need to consider lay-up weight (kg/sq m), the ratio of resin to fibre, how well compacted it is (air trapped in the matrix severely compromises it), how accurately the resin was mixed (unused/unreacted chemicals in the resin are what cause osmosis - they react with water to release crystals that start to delaminate the material) etc etc.
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Kevin
New member
Re: None, mostly
with finding all that out being very impractical its obv. to see why people stick to the tried and trusted brands, especially when manufacturers all have their own opinions and use differing brands of resins and fibres and each having their own ways of laying that up, it seems to be the only way to be safe in the long term.
they do say that fibreglass only has about 15 year life before it starts to weaken, due to the bondings resins properties but again not sure on the accuracy of that statement
kevin
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with finding all that out being very impractical its obv. to see why people stick to the tried and trusted brands, especially when manufacturers all have their own opinions and use differing brands of resins and fibres and each having their own ways of laying that up, it seems to be the only way to be safe in the long term.
they do say that fibreglass only has about 15 year life before it starts to weaken, due to the bondings resins properties but again not sure on the accuracy of that statement
kevin
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penfold
Well-known member
Re: None, mostly
'Fibreglass' is/was a tradename, much like sellotape, hoover and tannoy. It ended up being used interchangably with GRP; much, I would imagine, to the chagrin of the company that invented the name. I think they manufactured the stuff, cloth and CSM etc.
cheers,
david
<hr width=100% size=1>OMG, Schrodinger's cat is dead!
'Fibreglass' is/was a tradename, much like sellotape, hoover and tannoy. It ended up being used interchangably with GRP; much, I would imagine, to the chagrin of the company that invented the name. I think they manufactured the stuff, cloth and CSM etc.
cheers,
david
<hr width=100% size=1>OMG, Schrodinger's cat is dead!