Going up the mast (solo) and what to expect at the top...

[Graham_Wright]

The proprietary climbers get you to the top of the mast but not in a condition to perform two handed work safely. And they are expensive.

You need a length of climbing rope which you attach to the main halyard and haul to the top, then secure the halyard with clamp and knots. Take two ascenders (climbing gear) - the top one carries the bosun's chair and is clipped on to the climbing rope. The bottom one has a short length of timber attached with stout rope to act as a push bar for the feet. No bits of rope and prussic knots, swinging all over the place and unstable.

You sashay up the climbing rope pushing the ascenders ahead alternately, advancing your weight.
At the top you deploy a lanyard round your body (I use a galley strop) and the mast to steady yourself, whilst standing upright on the bar - this is stable and safe.

Usually best to assemble all work gear in a stout bag at the foot of the mast, trail an attached line up with you, and haul it up when in position..

Descent is the opposite of the above. You can also use a figure of 8 abseiler on a separate thick rope (12-14mm) hauled up at the same time as the climbing rope; stand on the wooden bar, transfer the bosums chair to the figure of 8 using a secure carabiner, step off the bar slowly placing your weight smoothly onto the abseiler and descend gracefully.

There is a warning, of course. It is not that the halyard or climbing rope will part, or the bosums chair disintegrate. No need to have a second carrying line - it gets in the way and endangers the ascent. The danger is from inversion in the bosums seat; so progress has to be steady.

I have used this arrangement for nearly 30 years and still do. When it's your life at stake you use only the best gear and check it all every time as if you were Chris Bonnington.

PWG

There's rather a lot of nonsense in your post which most will recognise.

I have a problem with not promoting our product but, suffice to say, that, even in my eightieth year, I can make the masthead in a little over two minutes. I have worked on the masthead several times in the last couple of months and I have never had a problem with "not in a condition to perform two handed work safely".

You should not use climbing rope. It is too elastic. (It is a cost you have ignored)

Nothing wrong with ascenders, I have a right hander and a left hander. Current price is around £50 (but you ignored that also). I continue to fear for my lines though, due to the (intentionally) sharp teeth. Although advised to the contrary, I cannot believe they don't cause damage. I use one ascender attached to my separate harness and move it as I climb. (Recently, I have changed to the Port West fall arrestor which I believe is better.)

"Descent is the opposite of the above".

This is practically impossible. Even experienced climbers and cavers have described it so. It depends on unhitching the ascenders (which they prefer not to do) repeatedly and alternately on the way down.

I am sometimes asked if our kit can be used for a single handed sailor. The answer is yes as the footrests can be supported by an ascender (as you have described). The only way I have found to safely descend is to abseil as do you. But the transition is very scary. I tie a separate line to the attachment between the halyard and the static line which are hoisted together and transfer to that using an Anka (aka figure of eight but better).

Inversion in a climbing harness is much more likely than in a proper bosun's chair. Mine has shoulder straps and a chest strap. The climbing harness I bought recently (#53 of this post refers), is deadly without the top part.

Your biggest mistake lies in the last paragraph;- I have used this arrangement for nearly 30 years and still do. When it's your life at stake you use only the best gear and check it all every time as if you were Chris Bonnington.

You do not mention any safety backup. The fact you have used it for 30 years and are still around to tell the tale must be down to sheer luck.

If you can think of something which may make your ascent safer, you should do it. Bit late as an afterthought as you plummet deckwards.

 

[Poey50]

The proprietary climbers get you to the top of the mast but not in a condition to perform two handed work safely. And they are expensive.

You need a length of climbing rope which you attach to the main halyard and haul to the top, then secure the halyard with clamp and knots. Take two ascenders (climbing gear) - the top one carries the bosun's chair and is clipped on to the climbing rope. The bottom one has a short length of timber attached with stout rope to act as a push bar for the feet. No bits of rope and prussic knots, swinging all over the place and unstable.

You sashay up the climbing rope pushing the ascenders ahead alternately, advancing your weight.
At the top you deploy a lanyard round your body (I use a galley strop) and the mast to steady yourself, whilst standing upright on the bar - this is stable and safe.

Usually best to assemble all work gear in a stout bag at the foot of the mast, trail an attached line up with you, and haul it up when in position..

Descent is the opposite of the above. You can also use a figure of 8 abseiler on a separate thick rope (12-14mm) hauled up at the same time as the climbing rope; stand on the wooden bar, transfer the bosums chair to the figure of 8 using a secure carabiner, step off the bar slowly placing your weight smoothly onto the abseiler and descend gracefully.

There is a warning, of course. It is not that the halyard or climbing rope will part, or the bosums chair disintegrate. No need to have a second carrying line - it gets in the way and endangers the ascent. The danger is from inversion in the bosums seat; so progress has to be steady.

I have used this arrangement for nearly 30 years and still do. When it's your life at stake you use only the best gear and check it all every time as if you were Chris Bonnington.

PWG

These are the issues, as I see them, with your system in roughly increasing order of concern.

1. As already said, climbing rope is dynamic. It stretches and bounces making it hard to steady yourself against the mast and with the potential for chafe. Static rope is better. Also tying a knot means that you cannot get high enough without standing adding to risk since your top jammer is necessarily lower.

2. You are aware that your seat does not secure you against risk of inversion - it isn't a safety harness. You can fall out if things go wrong and there is nothing to hold you.

3. One jammer is attached to the seat, the second jammer holds the step. You don't appear to have a connecting line between the second jammer and your seat. So you rely all the time on the seat jammer to hold you. There is no backup.

4. Even if you were to put a safety line on the foot step jammer you have it positioned below the seat jammer so you would take up to a 2:1 fall onto that safety line. The foot jammer should be positioned above the seat jammer and a safety line adjusted such that at maximum extension the line becomes tight to the safety harness (which you also don't have) giving at most a 1:1 fall on failure of the seat jammer.

5. As others have said you don't have a second line to hold you. This is less essential if you have a proper 'frog' setup as I described above as each jammer act as a back-up to the other. But as you don't have this the lack of a second line is problematic.

6. This is now the first of the things that gave me a tightness across the chest when I read your post this morning. At the top of the mast you stand up on the step and then rig a strop around the mast. This is a risky manoeuvre since I assume the seat is now looser on you than at any other point. If you fumble with the strop and fall at that point an inversion and then a drop of the full length of the mast with no backup is possible.

7. At this point my hands are sweating. When you transfer to the figure of 8 on a separate rope you stand taking your weight on the step jammer (which has no safety back-up line to secure you) and then you unclip from your seat jammer and attach with a carabiner to the figure of 8. If you fail to clip, and lose your balance at that point there is again nothing to stop you.

8. Finally, you seem proud of your system and believe it to be safe. It isn't and failure to see and acknowledge risk is the most dangerous aspect of rope work.

 

[Poey50]

Nothing wrong with ascenders, I have a right hander and a left hander. Current price is around £50 (but you ignored that also). I continue to fear for my lines though, due to the (intentionally) sharp teeth. Although advised to the contrary, I cannot believe they don't cause damage.

Petzl ascenders were designed for use on wet and muddy caving ropes. The spikes prevent slippage as the load just begins to be applied. After that the weight is entirely taken by the camming. i've never come across dry static rope being damaged by them.

[Descent by reversing the ascenders] is practically impossible. Even experienced climbers and cavers have described it so. It depends on unhitching the ascenders (which they prefer not to do) repeatedly and alternately on the way down.

It certainly isn't impossible - I do it quite a lot - but it is hard work and potentially more risky as it is possible when manually releasing the cam to accidentally remove the jammer from the rope (this can't happen on ascent). I have made a small modification to the Croll chest jammer so it won't lock open and hence less likely to be accidentally removed from the rope when reversing down but I would still want a backup line when descending in this way.

 

[Poey50]

This is the system I use ... note the method of changing over from ascending to descending on the same rope and the mention of descending by reversing the jammers. Practice a few feet off the ground and, if needs be, get supervision at a climbing wall or caving club. I don't take up cows-tails with me as there are no bolts to cross. I also use a wide legstrap big wall climbing harness rather than a thin strapped caving one. (The latter are small as they usually have to be folded away for other parts of the cave and can be very uncomfortable if hanging around bolting a pitch.)

http://caves.org/section/vertical/nh/46/srt.html

 

[Graham_Wright]

This is the system I use ... note the method of changing over from ascending to descending on the same rope and the mention of descending by reversing the jammers. Practice a few feet off the ground and, if needs be, get supervision at a climbing wall or caving club. I don't take up cows-tails with me as there are no bolts to cross. I also use a wide leg strap big wall climbing harness rather than a thin strapped caving one. (The latter are small as they usually have to be folded away small for other parts of the cave and can be very unfordable if hanging around bolting a pitch.)

http://caves.org/section/vertical/nh/46/srt.html

Ahem! So where is your safety back up?

 

[Poey50]

As explained previously.

 

[Graham_Wright]

As explained previously.

Found it ;-- I would still want a backup line when descending in this way.


But, to be fair, you are referencing caving which is somewhat different.

I use my MastaClimba on a static line fully tensioned. I wear a fall arrest harness (over the top I know but I already had it) with a short tether to an ascender which is secured on the static line and moved up as I climb. This is under my control and depends on no one else.

The halyard to the chair/sit harness is passed through a mast mounted clutch and round a self tailed winch tended by the crew.

All the climbing effort is provided by my legs.

At the top, my weight is shared between my feet and my backside. I have spent three hours at (or rather above) the masthead without suffering cramp or other discomfort.

What can possibly go wrong?

We have examined this in great depth due to H&S considerations at demonstrations. Worst case is a heart attack at the masthead disabling the climber. Recovery is to lower the static line and the chair line together. I still cannot solve the case where the climber is secured to the mast with a strop and welcome suggestions.

A less serious situation occurs when descending and the climber ends up strung up by the safety line when he has forgotten to lower the ascender. As ascenders cannot be released under load, it might be necessary for the winch operator to raise the chair slightly.

 

[Poey50]

Found it ;-- I would still want a backup line when descending in this way.


But, to be fair, you are referencing caving which is somewhat different.

How is it different? Other than the much shorter height of masts than cave pitches, the fact that going down is usually followed by going up rather than the other way round, the absence of mud, waterfalls, bolts to cross, and the usual presence of daylight, it is a single static rope that is ascended and descended. Sailing has often failed to learn from expertise in other sports (the recent problem with tethers for example when more suitable via ferrata gear from mountaineering has been available) and it is simply the case that no group has developed safe gear and techniques for single fixed rope better than cavers.

 

[Graham_Wright]

How is it different? Other than the much shorter height of masts than cave pitches, the fact that going down is usually followed by going up rather than the other way round, the absence of mud, waterfalls, bolts to cross, and the usual presence of daylight, it is a single static rope that is ascended and descended. Sailing has often failed to learn from expertise in other sports (the recent problem with tethers for example when more suitable via ferrata gear from mountaineering has been available) and it is simply the case that no group has developed safe gear and techniques for single fixed rope better than cavers.

Would you agree that, if your single line broke, you would probably die?

 

[Poey50]

Would you agree that, if your single line broke, you would probably die?

Very likely. That's why I would a) inspect the rope, b} back up the anchor, c) only use a halyard which passes through the mast so that sheave failure is not terminal, and d) use a second line if my wife is with me (which is 90 percent of the time).

Bear in mind that a back-up rope is never used in caving which is a far more hostile environment for ropes than a mast.

 

[Graham_Wright]

Very likely. That's why I would a) inspect the rope, b} back up the anchor, c) only use a halyard which passes through the mast so that sheave failure is not terminal, and d) use a second line if my wife is with me (which is 90 percent of the time).

Bear in mind that a back-up rope is never used in caving which is a far more hostile environment for ropes than a mast.

I meant in caving.

 

[Poey50]

I meant in caving.

Ah OK. I can confirm that falling at height in a cave would mostly mean death. A single death from a rope parting is recorded in UK caving from the early 70s. This is before protecting rope from abrasion was better understood.

Back to mast climbing on a single rope. I think the biggest risk is from people working at the top of the mast cutting through their own rope while it is under tension. Drilling into a mast - with the drill then penetrating the hidden rope being one such risk. If using cutting and drilling equipment then a back-up line is indicated.

 

[RichardS]

I've done some limited caving in my youth and I do feel that there is a difference between caving/climbing where dedicated ropes are sized and used for that one activity and can be checked each time they are used and mast climbing where we are using lines which are actually meant for a totally different purpose and are permanently exposed to UV and weather and friction/stress in certain areas and are not taken down and checked before re-purposing.

Having said that, because I always use a safety line when mast climbing, I would probably feel the need to rig up a safety line under all circumstances as I'm not as fearless as I used to be.

Richard

 

[Poey50]

I've done some limited caving in my youth and I do feel that there is a difference between caving/climbing where dedicated ropes are sized and used for that one activity and can be checked each time they are used and mast climbing where we are using lines which are actually meant for a totally different purpose and are permanently exposed to UV and weather and friction/stress in certain areas and are not taken down and checked before re-purposing.

Having said that, because I always use a safety line when mast climbing, I would probably feel the need to rig up a safety line under all circumstances as I'm not as fearless as I used to be.

Richard

You'd certainly be foolish not to check the condition of a halyard before climbing it. And as it is very easy to use a second line on a boat (if you have a belayer) then that is good practice too. Apart from that suitable diameter static halyards are no less suitable for climbing than static caving rope. (Much more suitable, for example, than climbing rope.) But it doesn't work the other way round since caving ropes have extra abrasion resistance because of the frequently muddy and gritty environments and additional abrasion risks.

 

[RichardS]

You'd certainly be foolish not to check the condition of a halyard before climbing it. And as it is very easy to use a second line on a boat (if you have a belayer) then that is good practice too. Apart from that suitable diameter static halyards are no less suitable for climbing than static caving rope. (Much more suitable, for example, than climbing rope.) But it doesn't work the other way round since caving ropes have extra abrasion resistance because of the frequently muddy and gritty environments and additional abrasion risks.

It's impossible to check the halyard which is tied to the top of the mast until I'm actually up there and hence the safety line is essential on a boat as there are lines that cannot be properly checked until you are actually hanging on them. The same does not apply to caving and climbing.

Richard

 

[dom]

Very likely. That's why I would a) inspect the rope, b} back up the anchor, c) only use a halyard which passes through the mast so that sheave failure is not terminal, and d) use a second line if my wife is with me (which is 90 percent of the time).

Bear in mind that a back-up rope is never used in caving which is a far more hostile environment for ropes than a mast.

A misleading and possibly dangerous statement.

Caving and climbing ropes are inspected before use and are subject to a rigorous replacement regime depending upon both time and shock loads.

Halyards by comparison can be years old and may have been subjected to every manner of undocumented loads. Moreover, halyards which pass through the mast cannot by definition be fully inspected before use, a problem exacerbated by the fact that sustained chafe points may exist at sheaves in addition to other possible friction points for those run within the mast (Your preffered option). All of which can be exacerbated by frapping away for years in situ.

I'd 100% go with Graham'a advice here.

 

[Poey50]

It's impossible to check the halyard which is tied to the top of the mast until I'm actually up there and hence the safety line is essential on a boat as there are lines that cannot be properly checked until you are actually hanging on them. The same does not apply to caving and climbing.

Richard

I have longer halyards than needed which allows inspection. That and sensible replacement.

 

[RichardS]

I have longer halyards than needed which allows inspection. That and sensible replacement.

Errrrrr .... it doesn't matter how long my main 2:1 halyard is. Inspection of the top 10 metres is not possible until I'm hanging on it. :ambivalence:

Same issue with replacement.

Richard

 

[Graham_Wright]

A misleading and possibly dangerous statement.

Caving and climbing ropes are inspected before use and are subject to a rigorous replacement regime depending upon both time and shock loads.

Halyards by comparison can be years old and may have been subjected to every manner of undocumented loads. Moreover, halyards which pass through the mast cannot by definition be fully inspected before use, a problem exacerbated by the fact that sustained chafe points may exist at sheaves in addition to other possible friction points for those run within the mast (Your preffered option). All of which can be exacerbated by frapping away for years in situ.

I'd 100% go with Graham'a advice here.

I tie a separate static line (which us kept permanently threaded through my MastaClimba in a dry environment) to the halyard which has to be brought right down to the deck for that, and thus the sheave wear points are exposed and can be examined.

The problem with all this is the general paucity of available halyards. I have in mast furling which means the main cannot be used. However, I also have a substantial topping lift and a trysail halyard. Others with a string topping lift and no spare halyards abaft the mast can resort to halyards before the mast but only for safety lines.

You can climb the forrad side with the benefit of the rest points;- radar reflector, radar dome, steaming light et al

 

[Poey50]

Halyards by comparison can be years old and may have been subjected to every manner of undocumented loads. Moreover, halyards which pass through the mast cannot by definition be fully inspected before use, a problem exacerbated by the fact that sustained chafe points may exist at sheaves in addition to other possible friction points for those run within the mast (Your preffered option). All of which can be exacerbated by frapping away for years in situ.

On my boat I find that once I raise the sail the halyard inside the mast comes out at the bottom of the mast. Anyone wanting to use neglected old halyards is well advised not to use them without backup and preferably not at all.