Generator issues....again

[Meps1983]

So my genny has been playing silly bug*ers all season. Seemed to be fine for the few times it was required last year but now she's simply not playing ball! It will start quite easily but then surges and dies on me. It Will do this several times then sometimes it will run and others it won't start at all.
I posted about it last year but most if the suggestions I tried but made no difference so i gave up for the winter.
The biggest issues is access to all the bits you'd want access to (fuel pump/carb etc) so makes it more of a pain! My local marine engineer says they would want to remove it completely to fix the problem ££££££.
So do I just leave it to them and pay, or do I have a go at removing it myself and taking it to a regular mechanic?
If I got it out myself I'd fancy a go at fixing it but it's all a bit intimidating to me.
It's a 3.5kw westerbeke genny on a bayliner 285 I'll include a pic so you can see what's in the way...
Any ideas/encouragement welcome
Thanks.

 

[philipdawsonladds]

I had a similar issue with a 6KVA set. Specialists wanted to remove for access. Big £££. Local mechanic took a look, diagnosed blocked fuel pump, £12 service kit and 1hr later all up and running. I'd get a 2nd opinion at least.

 

[Seastoke]

Is it petrol

 

[markc]

It does looked a bit squished in! I'd have a go yourself as I suspect it's a fuel / carb problem and you'll certainly learn as you go. I would move the expansion tank out of the way to get a bit more room, and have a helper who can pass you all the correct tools

 

[Meps1983]

I've had the batteries out and the expansion tank off but it still tight to physically get in there as the engine is just out of shot in the pic. The carb and fuel pump are both around the back of the genny, virtually inaccessible for even the most agile of beings!
To remove I would need to do the above again along with my hydraulic reservoir and pump (I think that's what it is??) which is below the gennys expansion tank.
Then I guess it's a case of disconnecting the genny from exhaust and inlet plus the wiring that goes with it and out she comes said nobody!
I'm happy getting most of that out, but the hydraulic part I'm clueless about if I'm honest.
It's a petrol engine Seastoke which the genny shares its fuel with.

 

[markc]

I've had the batteries out and the expansion tank off but it still tight to physically get in there as the engine is just out of shot in the pic. The carb and fuel pump are both around the back of the genny, virtually inaccessible for even the most agile of beings!
To remove I would need to do the above again along with my hydraulic reservoir and pump (I think that's what it is??) which is below the gennys expansion tank.
Then I guess it's a case of disconnecting the genny from exhaust and inlet plus the wiring that goes with it and out she comes said nobody!
I'm happy getting most of that out, but the hydraulic part I'm clueless about if I'm honest.
It's a petrol engine Seastoke which the genny shares its fuel with.

Can't you remove the carb without pulling the genny out?

 

[Meps1983]

I'm not sure. It's around the back about halfway along with about 6 inches between that and the boats outer skin! I've had the fuel filter off, which was brand new and I also removed the fuel pump which is around the back but easy to get at by 'feel'. That was cleaned too but looks virtually new aswell. The carb however is buried a bit more which I can't really get at that easily, all of which I'm doing blind anyway.
I forgot to mention the genny is 12 years old with only 20hrs run time on it so essentially new and never used.

 

[Bouba]

The carb could be gummed up with old fuel….can you get a spray can of carb cleaner to it ?

 

[Bouba]

By the way make sure you and your assistant have some fire fighting equipment on hand…extinguishers, blankets

 

[markc]

You could temporarily supply fuel from a separate source, laced with carb cleaner? Perhaps adapt an outboard motor tank with bulb, that you can safely position outside of the engine room. That could clean out any muck. As Bouba said, be safe.... petrol vapours in an enclosed space is a potential bomb.

 

[Meps1983]

I'd wondered about using carb cleaner with it in situe. The fuel line to the generator from the tank is about 5 feet long so it easy to rig up a a tank outside of the engine bay. I've done it before with the genny to test the fuel pump. I used the fuel tank from a land genny I bought several years ago on the cheap. So maybe I could fill that with a fuel carb cleaner mixture and see what that does? What sort of ratio do we think or should I just run neat carb cleaner through?

 

[markc]

I'd use something like BG44K, mix a can with a a gallon of petrol, run the genny for 20 mins, then leave to stand overnight, then run the rest through it. That's my guesstimate rather than any kind of expert opinion!

​

 

[Portofino]

In my experience with the resuscitation of classic carb ,petrol motorbikes dragged from sheds is to remove the carb , strip it , buy a gasket set and dunk the thing in a ultra sonic bath of 50/50 acetone / fresh petrol , or if no bath leave it soak for 24 / 24 . Maybe using a very fine wire or and compressed air clean the jet .Be careful not to force anything through this .It’s dia is crucial.

Don’t do this on your boat obviously as the stuff being flammable. It’s has to be flammable to dissolve off the gum of the fuel .
It’s normally the jet if a carb and the float pin . I tend to do this in a green house at the bottom of the garden for obvious reasons - not wanting to explain away to the fire brigade why the house ( or your case boats gone up in flames );
Obviously replace the filter ( gummed up too ) that’s a given .

In future for in frequently used petrols wether a classic car , bike in winter lay up or underused petrol geny on a boat add a fuel stabiliser between long ( ish ) lay ups .They prevent carb gumming .
See the instructions on the bottle for the dose .


Edit - if it’s a petrol fit a new plug as well for the sake of a fiver .They go off .

 

[Bouba]

Once the carb is cleaned and if possible rebuilt....set the idle screw and low speed mixture so that it doesn’t conk out again

 

[vas]

curious, do 4stroke engine carbs gum up? thought it's the 2T ones that suffer this

 

[Meps1983]

When I took the fuel pump off last autumn it didn't look that dirty to me but there was certainly crud in there as you can see in the pic.
So the general census I'm getting from replies is that the carb needs to come off to be cleaned/serviced. As I've mentioned its unlikely I can get to it without getting the whole genny out.
Could I perhaps try the carb cleaner route first without removal of gen.
Could I remove the fuel line on the outlet side of the fuel pump then blast a load of carb cleaner up to the carb itself? Then crank it several times and leave over night perhaps?
Thanks for the responses anyway

 

[Portofino]

curious, do 4stroke engine carbs gum up? thought it's the 2T ones that suffer this

They get more of a what I’d call a varnish which can compromise tiny holes in carbs .
Also over time a new set of gaskets won’t go amiss . Ie a full carb strip + service .

But this looks like access is an issue ? So that’s gonna dictate what’s done , not what needs doing .

 

[Seastoke]

Can you not unbolt the Jenny and spin it around to work on

 

[Meps1983]

I don't think so Seastoke. I would still need to disconnect everything in front of the genny because of how crowded it is down there. But I might be able to get a bit of movement and turn it slightly perhaps? At that point it's nearly out so it's a tricky one!

 

[Bouba]

Do they still do those carb cleaners in a high pressure aerosol can ?....that would be my first thought....then try adjusting the carb...with a bendy screwdriver if necessary. If it’s got mechanical points I would service them...change the plug...after setting the gap. These are just the first things to do on the easyiest to do list....