Gas locker

[MagicalArmchair]

Hello all,

On my venerable 30 foot Albin Ballad my gas locker is rather worse for wear. To my alarm, after launching this season, I noted the drain pipe on the bottom of the stainless box had actually broken off. The box has never been sealed from the top (which I understand is a requirement these days), so I figured it might be time to either augment what I have, or order something built for the purpose.

Can anyone recommend a Gas Locker box 'off the peg'? I suppose alternatively I could fashion a lid for the stainless box, I suspect I would never get the seal complete though.

Thanks for your help.

Mark

---

www.albinballad.co.uk

 

[prv]

It doesn't really need to seal at the top, just drain well from the bottom. LPG is heavier than air, and will flow out through the drain rather than wafting out through the top. The Boat Safety Scheme, though we don't have to comply with it in seagoing boats, is worth a look for its gas requirements, and I'm not sure they even require a lid. The locker just has to be sealed up to the height of the highest joint in the plumbing, or something like that.

Pete

 

[pvb]

The box has never been sealed from the top (which I understand is a requirement these days),

It isn't a requirement. The gas locker can be open-topped, as long as the sides extend as high as any high-pressure components. It does have to have an adequate overboard drain.

 

[MagicalArmchair]

Great, the box will work just fine as it is then. The drain drains out into the cockpit, and then I suppose the thinking was it would drain out of the cockpit drains, so as long as I fix that tube then I will be safe.

 

[VicS]

As above but a lid would be a worthwhile addition even if not actually gas tight IMHO.

Ensure the drain is adequately sized. See the BSS for recommended diameters.

Flame resistant grp lockers are available but vary from expensive to very expensive. Google will find I am sure.

 

[VicS]

Great, the box will work just fine as it is then. The drain drains out into the cockpit, and then I suppose the thinking was it would drain out of the cockpit drains, so as long as I fix that tube then I will be safe.

Draining into the cockpit is only acceptable if thcockpit drain outlets are always above water and if bridgedeck will prevent gas flowing into the interior

 

[rogerthebodger]

I read some where that a LPG locker must fire proof for up to 30 minutes to prevent fire getting to the gas bottle to give more time to escape before it explodes, so a close fitting is essential but it does no have to be gas sealed.

 

[Caer Urfa]

Hello all,

On my venerable 30 foot Albin Ballad my gas locker is rather worse for wear. To my alarm, after launching this season, I noted the drain pipe on the bottom of the stainless box had actually broken off. The box has never been sealed from the top (which I understand is a requirement these days), so I figured it might be time to either augment what I have, or order something built for the purpose.

Can anyone recommend a Gas Locker box 'off the peg'? I suppose alternatively I could fashion a lid for the stainless box, I suspect I would never get the seal complete though.

Thanks for your help.

Mark

---

www.albinballad.co.uk

Hi Mark

I bought this one last year from http://www.force4.co.uk/339/Force-4-Gas-Bottle-Locker.html

Easy to fit, the 19mm dia drain is in the bottom to outside through a skin fitting, in the locker next to it I have fitted a 'gas bubble detector' plus an additional on/off gas valve in addition to the bottle regulator valve.

Mike

 

[rogerthebodger]

gas bubble detector' plus an additional on/off gas valve and regulator valve shoud be in the same locker as the gas bottle so if there is a leak in that section of piping it will drain overboard

 

[lw395]

It doesn't really need to seal at the top, just drain well from the bottom. LPG is heavier than air, and will flow out through the drain rather than wafting out through the top. The Boat Safety Scheme, though we don't have to comply with it in seagoing boats, is worth a look for its gas requirements, and I'm not sure they even require a lid. The locker just has to be sealed up to the height of the highest joint in the plumbing, or something like that.

Pete

We call that the 'Trenchard model'.
The gas locker should be sealed to the main spaces of the yacht.

 

[mikeinkwazi]

The force 4 gas locker notes say the following. If it vents (drains) though the door it's not safe!
Gas Bottle Locker - A self contained waterproof locker specifically designed to hold a 3kg gas bottle (Camping Gaz 904 or 907) with regulator.
Ventilation is via a gap under the bottom edge of the door.
Includes watertight gas hose inlet & fixing straps for the gas bottle.
• Front Size: 405x 375mm
• Recess Size: 330 x 300mm
• Depth: 250mm
• Right hand opening door

 

[prv]

If it vents (drains) though the door it's not safe!

Depends where you're putting it. If in a modern-style cockpit with an opening stern of some kind, or above-water drain pipes glassed in, then it's probably fine.

An older style cockpit, no, not ideal.

Pete

 

[Caer Urfa]

The force 4 gas locker notes say the following. If it vents (drains) though the door it's not safe!
Gas Bottle Locker - A self contained waterproof locker specifically designed to hold a 3kg gas bottle (Camping Gaz 904 or 907) with regulator.
Ventilation is via a gap under the bottom edge of the door.
Includes watertight gas hose inlet & fixing straps for the gas bottle.
• Front Size: 405x 375mm
• Recess Size: 330 x 300mm
• Depth: 250mm
• Right hand opening door

I added the 19mm dia drain myself in the bottom, even though everything is mounted in the cockpit side locker

Mike

 

[Bilgediver]

Great, the box will work just fine as it is then. The drain drains out into the cockpit, and then I suppose the thinking was it would drain out of the cockpit drains, so as long as I fix that tube then I will be safe.

This may not be acceptable unless you have one of those modern transomless boats. Generally one of the few things insurance companies ask for is that the locker drains ovrboard though some of the wording used is at best ambiguous using words like drain outside the boat. This is what can be a problem for some boats as the locker may sit so low in the boat that the drain can not be located the required height above the waterline.

 

[VicS]

This may not be acceptable unless you have one of those modern transomless boats. Generally one of the few things insurance companies ask for is that the locker drains ovrboard though some of the wording used is at best ambiguous using words like drain outside the boat. This is what can be a problem for some boats as the locker may sit so low in the boat that the drain can not be located the required height above the waterline.

But if necessary the drain from the locker can be positioned up from the bottom provided the free space below it is blanked off... details in the BSS http://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/180428/bss guide 2005 complete web.pdf

 

[boaterbaz]

Great, the box will work just fine as it is then. The drain drains out into the cockpit, and then I suppose the thinking was it would drain out of the cockpit drains, so as long as I fix that tube then I will be safe.

As long as you dont have a ciggy in the cockpit. Was going to say have a fag!

 

[Bilgediver]

But if necessary the drain from the locker can be positioned up from the bottom provided the free space below it is blanked off... details in the BSS http://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/180428/bss guide 2005 complete web.pdf

The wording regarding the padding up is a wee bit ambiguous Vic.. The bottle needs the lower bottom in the locker due to boat construction and insufficient headroom for bottle valves etc below cockpit moulding so lifting the bottle on a false bottom is not a solution on some boats. However if filling some of the lower volume around the bottle was acceptable this might help however the BSS does specifically talk about area and not volume so it seems are really are looking for a locker which is effectively no deeper then the drain connection whether achieved by locker design or false bottom . The alternative might be to use smaller gas bottles and associated lockers in some cases.

 

[pvb]

The wording regarding the padding up is a wee bit ambiguous Vic.. The bottle needs the lower bottom in the locker due to boat construction and insufficient headroom for bottle valves etc below cockpit moulding so lifting the bottle on a false bottom is not a solution on some boats. However if filling some of the lower volume around the bottle was acceptable this might help however the BSS does specifically talk about area and not volume so it seems are really are looking for a locker which is effectively no deeper then the drain connection whether achieved by locker design or false bottom . The alternative might be to use smaller gas bottles and associated lockers in some cases.

I don't think it's at all ambiguous, and it doesn't talk about lifting the bottle, merely ensuring that space below the drain is filled with LPG-resistant material There's even this little diagram to explain it...

 

[VicS]

The wording regarding the padding up is a wee bit ambiguous Vic..

Yes.. In 7.3.2/R they use the word "volume" in the first sentence

"Is the drain opening at or close to the bottom of the cylinder
locker or is any volume beneath the drain-opening minimised
by the use of suitable material?"​

but then use the word area in subsequent sentences.

"If the drain opening is above the bottom of the locker check that
any area below the drain opening that could retain leaked LPG is filled
with LPG-resistant material

"Any area in the cylinder locker below the drain that could retain leaked
LPG must be filled with LPG-resistant material.​

To my way of thinking they do mean volume and this is made clear if you look at the diagram on the next page

C. Side opening drain below
which is filled LPG-resistant
material 7.3.2​