Gas drain for Sadler 32

[Poey50]

I've Googled this pretty thoroughly and searched the Sadler and Starlight website but I'm still stumped so please forgive another in my near endless series of questions.

The Sadler 32 has a side-opening gas locker with potential for draining gas into the bilge since the cockpit drains are water-locked. I've read some accounts of sealing up the side opening, converting to top opening and setting up a drain from the bottom of the gas locker to the transom. The problem is the downward slope on the transom creates another sump. Someone wrote that a 110 degree near-right angle skin fitting solved it but I can't figure out any way of fitting this that doesn't allow even that to form a water lock at the bend. Has anyone done this successfully who has pictures?

 

[Tranona]

snooks (Graham) who posts here has built a gas locker for his 32. Wrote it up in one of the mags he writes for. Suggest you pm him.

 

[Poey50]

snooks (Graham) who posts here has built a gas locker for his 32. Wrote it up in one of the mags he writes for. Suggest you pm him.

Thanks I've done that. Any other 32 owners who've done this?

 

[lw395]

On my previously boat the gas drain water locked at the transom.
I changed the skin fitting to a length of ali tube epoxied through the transom at an angle.

 

[eddystone]

I've Googled this pretty thoroughly and searched the Sadler and Starlight website but I'm still stumped so please forgive another in my near endless series of questions.

The Sadler 32 has a side-opening gas locker with potential for draining gas into the bilge since the cockpit drains are water-locked. I've read some accounts of sealing up the side opening, converting to top opening and setting up a drain from the bottom of the gas locker to the transom. The problem is the downward slope on the transom creates another sump. Someone wrote that a 110 degree near-right angle skin fitting solved it but I can't figure out any way of fitting this that doesn't allow even that to form a water lock at the bend. Has anyone done this successfully who has pictures?

A water lock may stop the gas draining out but doesn't it also stop the water getting in? Like when a skin fitting above the waterline becomes a skin fitting below the waterline i.e. when the rail is in the water. I can't help thinking that this reg was designed for canal boats not sailing boats. BTW how many of the 300 plus Sadler 32s built since 1979 have suffered a gas explosion?

 

[Poey50]

A water lock may stop the gas draining out but doesn't it also stop the water getting in? Like when a skin fitting above the waterline becomes a skin fitting below the waterline i.e. when the rail is in the water. I can't help thinking that this reg was designed for canal boats not sailing boats. BTW how many of the 300 plus Sadler 32s built since 1979 have suffered a gas explosion?

The fitting will be on the transom not on the side. The downward angle will also determine water ingress.

Most sailors spend quite a lot of effort (and cash) guarding against high impact but low probability events - that's why the boat has a liferaft, emergency aerial, flares etc etc. It just stacks the low odds a little bit more in our favour. Of course, you have to draw the line somewhere .. but I'm quite happy to spend relatively little to help guard against shuffling off this world in a big bang.

 

[Lucent83]

Apologies for reviving this thread, but I'm in the same dilemma and would be keen if anyone in the interim has devised a cunning solution?

 

[VicS]

Apologies for reviving this thread, but I'm in the same dilemma and would be keen if anyone in the interim has devised a cunning solution?

If it helps . The gas locker drain need not be from the bottom or even at the lowest point of one of the sides. ( Drain openings on the side of cylinder lockers not greater than 25mm (1 in) above the bottom of the locker may be considered as at the lowest point of the side) but any area in the cylinder locker below the drain that could retain leaked LPG must be filled with LPG-resistant material.

See chapter 7 of the Boat Safety Scheme for guidance:- https://www.marinesurveys.net/BoatSafety/Guideline-chap7LPG.pdf

.

 

[vyv_cox]

Apologies for reviving this thread, but I'm in the same dilemma and would be keen if anyone in the interim has devised a cunning solution?

Is this also for a Sadler 32? One of the problems (mine is a 34 but similar) is that the gas locker is completely open to the cockpit. The original flawed concept was that gas would flow down the cockpit drains, which we now know does not happen.
So either, arrange for the cockpit drains not to have a right angled bend below the skin fitting into the sloping transom, or arrange a gas tight bulkhead on the front of the locker and a separate drain into the hull. I think this is what Graham Snook did.
A problem with this is it would occupy a surprising amount of lazarette space on a 34 which would severely impact on what I stow in mine

 

[B27]

There's a fair few 32's about and they've been around a long time.
Have any of them blown up recently?

Safety is not just about ticking boxes on a scheme intended for idiots on inland water.
If you are rigorously careful and maybe splash out on a gas alarm, you should be safer than someone ticking boxes.

 

[vyv_cox]

There's a fair few 32's about and they've been around a long time.
Have any of them blown up recently?

Safety is not just about ticking boxes on a scheme intended for idiots on inland water.
If you are rigorously careful and maybe splash out on a gas alarm, you should be safer than someone ticking boxes.

That's the approach I adopted. No modifications to the boat, just take care

 

[Lucent83]

There's a fair few 32's about and they've been around a long time.
Have any of them blown up recently?

Safety is not just about ticking boxes on a scheme intended for idiots on inland water.
If you are rigorously careful and maybe splash out on a gas alarm, you should be safer than someone ticking boxes.

Quite. But it's a pre requisite for the marina I'm berthed at currently.

 

[Lucent83]

Is this also for a Sadler 32? One of the problems (mine is a 34 but similar) is that the gas locker is completely open to the cockpit. The original flawed concept was that gas would flow down the cockpit drains, which we now know does not happen.
So either, arrange for the cockpit drains not to have a right angled bend below the skin fitting into the sloping transom, or arrange a gas tight bulkhead on the front of the locker and a separate drain into the hull. I think this is what Graham Snook did.
A problem with this is it would occupy a surprising amount of lazarette space on a 34 which would severely impact on what I stow in mine

Yep, Sadler 32. I'll need to refresh myself on the routing of the cockpit drains. I had thought that adding a gas seal and a latch or potentially fabricating a separate compliant container within the existing locker might be an option.

I think the pain will be sorting out the routing for the drain.

I'm going to have a chat to the assessor this week at the boat which should also give some pointers I'm hoping.

Dp you think there would be the option to add a tap off the cockpit drain that remains above the waterline?

 

[B27]

Then I'd be looking at those top-loading through deck gas bottle holders if you can still get them?
Or simply (AKA crudely) putting a gas bottle on a rack on the pushpit.
I've also sailed on boats where the gas bottle is in the anchor locker.
Or, there is life without gas.
Meths, electric....

 

[Lucent83]

Yep, seems like these might fit the bill. I had considered as an option just telling the assessor I wouldn't have LPG on the boat whilst it was on the canal, if he'd buy that.

 

[Lucent83]

If it helps . The gas locker drain need not be from the bottom or even at the lowest point of one of the sides. ( Drain openings on the side of cylinder lockers not greater than 25mm (1 in) above the bottom of the locker may be considered as at the lowest point of the side) but any area in the cylinder locker below the drain that could retain leaked LPG must be filled with LPG-resistant material.

See chapter 7 of the Boat Safety Scheme for guidance:- https://www.marinesurveys.net/BoatSafety/Guideline-chap7LPG.pdf

.

That pdf is really helpful, thank you!

 

[Slowboat35]

I am surprised to hear that the cockpit drains are 'water locked' and it is thought that gas can't escape through them. How does this happen?
My Sadler 32 had the gas locker portside aft that vented into the cockpit and drains in both aft corners of the cockpit. Their hoses went straight to through-hull fittings above the waterline on the opposite sides of the hull. Why would/how could they not vent? The only caveat I saw was the questionable seal under the liftable cockpit floor. You'd need a big leak of gas in totally windless conditions for any to find its way down there without being blown away by the breeze or slipping down the drains. Even if the drain fittings are sometines submerged when motoring they'll not both be permanantly submerged andf the motion of the boat ensured some wind over the cockpit which will readily clear any leak (and to be serious enough to worry about you'd deffo smell it). When sailing the 'downhill' one is always ut of the water and venting to air on the other side of the boat, plus there is a wind blowing.
I can't see whaat the concern is.
I'd suggest that ensuring the cockpit floor seal is sound and a bilge gas alarm is more than adequate precaution. That seal if faulty is far more likely to allow a damaging ingress of water than gas. Don't ask how I know.

 

[Scomber]

Gas bottle ratchet strapped on pushpit on our s29. No probs.