First Sailboat Purchase Looming - Friendly Advice Appreciated!

[reyes]

Hey all

I know there are a few previously posted questions on first purchases but as my situation is unique to me, I hope you don't mind indulging my request for advice!

So, as the title suggests, I'm getting tempted to buy my first boat and have seen a Beneteau Oceanis 373 that looks really nice.

Where I'm at in my boating experience is:

- Own a powerboat
- Own a sailing dinghy (been dinghy sailing since last year)
- Completed RYA Competent Crew, SRC for VHF, and second assessment for Day Skipper Theory this weekend.
- Day Skipper Practical booked for May

Requirements are:

- Boat for me and my partner
- Definitely capable of being able to be slept on for a few days
- Potential for single-handed sailing
- Allows for me to grow as a sailor where I won't need to sell the boat and upgrade when it comes to English Channel crossings, or even some North Sea cruises


My questions are:

- Should I wait before purchasing? Is this still a good time of year to be able to negotiate? (My thinking here is the purchase may take a while!)
- Is my suggested boat size I've suggested reasonable for what I've stated in your opinions based on your own experience(s)?
- What else am I not asking that I should?

I already know of a marina it can reside in; I also have an RYA instructor who's willing to assist in deliver which would mean I gain some additional experience over a >300nm trip to my home marina.

Thanks in advance for any input!

 

[RunAgroundHard]

Go for it, if the survey is okay and the price acceptable. Personally, I would not wait and delay, based on your post, as you are doing the right things. Book yourself on a RYA VHF course to use the VHF.

" ... If not now, when?", Hillel the Elder

No, Yes
Yes
No more questions, analysis paralysis.

 

[Tranona]

Go for it.

 

[flaming]

1. If you've seen a boat you like, don't delay. You'll only miss more of the coming season for no particular reason.
2. Boat size is reasonable, but you could make a case for going a bit smaller, say more in the 32-25 foot range. Perfectly capable of channel crossing in comfort, and likely to be significantly less stressful for someone new to the sport to berth. The jump from under 35 to 38ish often comes with a fairly big step up in deck gear etc, which makes things more complicated and frankly costlier when things need replacing. Plus loads get considerably higher. All of which is fine, but as I say, you can make a case that going a bit smaller isn't a bad idea. Especially if you're going to mostly be a couple or small family.
3. What you're not asking is the condition of the boat - the 373 is a fairly old model now, so how up to date has it been kept? Does it have a new chart plotter? New autopilot? Has the rigging been inspected and serviced? How are the sails? Is the cordage original? Has the engine been regularly serviced? If it was bought and not really updated at any point, you're in line to find some nasty surprises.

Don't lose sight of the fact that a 300 mile delivery trip, whilst good experience, is likely to be quite a lot of sailing in a straight line with the autopilot driving. As you've done DS theory, and presumably have some sort of chartplotter / phone app, I can't imagine that the nav side of things is going to be any issue for you. But a lot of what really gets newcomers in a pickle is the 1st and last 100 yards. Once you have the boat, whatever it ends up being, a day of that instructor's time in learning berthing will be time and money well spent.

Oh, and keep that dinghy for a while yet.

 

[John_Silver]

 

[dunedin]

Hey all

I know there are a few previously posted questions on first purchases but as my situation is unique to me, I hope you don't mind indulging my request for advice!

So, as the title suggests, I'm getting tempted to buy my first boat and have seen a Beneteau Oceanis 373 that looks really nice.

Where I'm at in my boating experience is:

- Own a powerboat
- Own a sailing dinghy (been dinghy sailing since last year)
- Completed RYA Competent Crew, SRC for VHF, and second assessment for Day Skipper Theory this weekend.
- Day Skipper Practical booked for May

Requirements are:

- Boat for me and my partner
- Definitely capable of being able to be slept on for a few days
- Potential for single-handed sailing
- Allows for me to grow as a sailor where I won't need to sell the boat and upgrade when it comes to English Channel crossings, or even some North Sea cruises


My questions are:

- Should I wait before purchasing? Is this still a good time of year to be able to negotiate? (My thinking here is the purchase may take a while!)
- Is my suggested boat size I've suggested reasonable for what I've stated in your opinions based on your own experience(s)?
- What else am I not asking that I should?

I already know of a marina it can reside in; I also have an RYA instructor who's willing to assist in deliver which would mean I gain some additional experience over a >300nm trip to my home marina.

Thanks in advance for any input!

We see many “thinking of a new boat” posts on here. Many are understandably a bit naive. Some are dangerously ill prepared.

Yours by contrast sounds like somebody who has given this a lot of thought, done their preparation and makes very sensible comments. Bodes well to make a sensible skipper for voyages to come.

I don’t know the particular model of Beneteau but these are generally competent boats. And 37ft is a near ideal size for space and capability yet also able to be handled solo with ease.
Not sure if the boat has it, but for single handed sailing the autopilot is key. Ideally a below deck ram type is best, but a wheel pilot is probably acceptable if well maintained.

 

[mrming]

I assume you’ve done your homework on the big ticket items on the boat you’re viewing, but just in case it helps:

- Age of standing rigging
- Age and condition of sails and running rigging
- Age and service history of engine (no saildrive on the 373 afaik)
- Fuel system (is the fuel clean, is there a steel tank (hopefully not), and if so is it corroded?)
- Condition of interior, particularly with respect to any moisture ingress
- Age and functionality of electronics
- Condition of through hull fittings

With the exception of an interior in very poor condition (not usually seen on this era of Beneteau), none of these items are deal breakers in isolation, but if too many of them stack up, I would walk away and look for a better example.

 

[reyes]

I'm always so grateful to people who take time out of their days to help a stranger, so thank you very much for all the comments and advice so far.

I did omit a bit of context relating to the boat to give an idea of its state:

- 2005 model
- Standing rigging "renewed in 2021"
- Slab mainsail with lazyjacks
- 40hp shaft drive (which I think prevents the elevated expense of sail drive seals?) - last serviced winter 2023
- Electric windlass
- Bimini
- Liferaft (requiring a service)
- Raymarine ST6001 autopilot
- Raymarine Axiom 7 chartplotter
- Raymarine VHF

It's approaching the £40k mark so is not as cheap as something like a Sigma 33 which would probably be half the price. But, the comforts of the Beneteau, features, age (2005 vs 1988 or something for the Sigma) seems to explain in part why!

Any thoughts on that?!

 

[Chiara’s slave]

Looks good to me. You’re not likely to have to worry about out that liferaft for a while, don’t get premature with the service, or it’ll need another by the time you'll be properly reassured by it’s presence.

 

[wonkywinch]

If it's Hufflepuff then it looks nice, I personally would add a lot of points for it being represented by Clipper Marine as they have a reputation to keep. The photos show some work that needs doing, eg I think the owner swapped his £££ Rocna for something cheap off Gumtree for the sale and it doesn't fit the bow roller, the running rigging looks old and the teak needs a clean, the helm/wheel leather looks due for replacement.

I'd guess this boat has done service in the Med, as the cabin fans aren't usual on UK boats and there is the name in Greek on one side. I'd check it has a heater as this would be essential in the UK and an expensive retrofit, I can't see controls for any. There is a few more k to be spent but then spending money and tinkering is all part of the yachting world!

A friend has just sold his 393 which I've sailed on a couple of times and I liked a few things like the helm swivel to make the cockpit more sociable and it sailed very well.

2005 Beneteau Oceanis Clipper 373 For Sale - Clipper Marine

Friend's 393 he just sold/under offer - https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/yacht/2005-beneteau-oceanis-clipper-393-9388160/

 

[Caer Urfa]

Ask for a copy of the last survey as its amazing what you find and was any recommendations done ? Get a good surveyor yourself NOT one that the marina or seller suggests and get a marine engineer to check the big Yanmar engine usually a 40HP 3JH4E

 

[mrming]

I'm always so grateful to people who take time out of their days to help a stranger, so thank you very much for all the comments and advice so far.

I did omit a bit of context relating to the boat to give an idea of its state:

- 2005 model
- Standing rigging "renewed in 2021"
- Slab mainsail with lazyjacks
- 40hp shaft drive (which I think prevents the elevated expense of sail drive seals?) - last serviced winter 2023
- Electric windlass
- Bimini
- Liferaft (requiring a service)
- Raymarine ST6001 autopilot
- Raymarine Axiom 7 chartplotter
- Raymarine VHF

It's approaching the £40k mark so is not as cheap as something like a Sigma 33 which would probably be half the price. But, the comforts of the Beneteau, features, age (2005 vs 1988 or something for the Sigma) seems to explain in part why!

Any thoughts on that?!

Price seems very competitive to me. Some good smaller points noted by @wonkywinch above. Any idea what the sails are like? If they’re serviceable I would be tempted to get it surveyed, using an independent surveyor as @Caer Urfa says.

 

[dunedin]

Ask for a copy of the last survey as its amazing what you find and was any recommendations done ? Get a good surveyor yourself NOT one that the marina or seller suggests and get a marine engineer to check the big Yanmar engine usually a 40HP 3JH4E

Looks a good opportunity. Key thing as Caer Urfa says is to get a good survey done to avoid (reduce!) the hidden surprises

 

[john_morris_uk]

All good points. I’m not sure a heater is ‘absolutely essential’. It’s certainly a ‘nice to have’ but plenty of people go sailing in the uk without a heater on their boat…

If the engine is clean and serviced and it starts promptly from cold then the chances are that it’s fine. I’m not convinced you need an engineer to tell you anything else but if you’ve got a take one to have a look why not? The surveyor should report on engine mounts (they do fail) and anything obvious.

I was amused by the ‘big enough to sail across the channel’ comment. People sail that size yacht (or smaller) across oceans. However the 373 doesn’t have a lot of ‘sea berths’ where you can lie securely in your bunk when the boat is rolling around.

Lots of people put up with old sails. New sails will transform its sailing performance. They’re not cheap, but you can put up with the old ones and save up…

PS. The price looks very competitive to me.

 

[flaming]

PS. The price looks very competitive to me.

I'd be surprised if that wasn't an ex charter boat.

 

[Tranona]

Look carefully at its history. Suspect it is an ex charter boat, probably from the Med. Asking price is much lower than expected. £50-60k would be more normal. Engine hours would a good guide. Not necessarily a bad thing but the asking price suggests a hard life. It might also be a boat clipper have taken in part exchange for a new boat.

 

[potentillaCO32]

Agree with the other who say it looks reasonable value and I think they are very nice boats.

Also agree with the poster who suggested considering smaller. I singlehand mostly, and I think a common issue many have with sailing is getting willing crew.

I have taken my MG27 around the east coast, south coast and to france on my own. Currently got a 32 footer and that s about as big as I would want to go for single handed, although a bow thruster changes things a bit.

Sheet loads are heavier, mainsail is heavier. Pushing the boat around in the marina is much harder, berthing in a wind on your own on a bigger boat becomes more difficult.

But I get why newcomers, particularly if they have chartered abroad prefer bigger boats. Roomier and much nicer when actually moored up.

 

[john_morris_uk]

I'd be surprised if that wasn't an ex charter boat.

Good point. Although lots of charter boats are bigger…

Doesn’t mean it’s no good. Just look very carefully at the gear. For all the exorbitant prices we pay for boat gear, none of it seems to be designed or built for extended use. It wears out quicker than I think it ought to! And winches and blocks and sails don’t come cheap. Running rigging can be replaced gradually but some things just wear out.

 

[jlavery]

May have missed it in above posts - where are you going to be based, and where is the boat at the moment?

Just being nosey - can't add any more sage advice than already supplied above.

 

[macca499]

I recently bought my first sail boat via Mark at Clipper, similar motor boating background & obtained/planned qualifications as you. Have only good things to say about Mark, found him honest and very helpful, happy to help me arrange tradesmen, lifts and storage etc which has been invaluable as I live far from the boat, certainly the best broker I have ever dealt with.

Not really well placed to offer advice only to say my boat is much newer and was in great shape with many expensive upgrades and a credit to her previous owner but still the survey threw up quite a few small routine maintenance jobs needing done, I completed late January and have chosen to have all survey items addressed before I bring the boat the 700 odd miles home so definitely budget for some extra cost and time to get any items addressed before you can use the boat.

Best of luck with the search!