finally got the webaato fired up however, was it luck?

[symondo]

After my last thread related to the heater we have not firing, it turned out I don't think it was receiving fuel.

Its a webasto air top 5000

So today, ice taken out the filter, added a new unit, un hooked the pipe from the unit and used a syringe to draw the diesel up through the system.

Re connected it and 2 goes in, finally after 4 months of head scratching it fires up and gives out got air! Delighted didn't cover it.

However... it ran for 3 cycles and then appeared to not fire and the resulting fault code again.

Is this normal for these things?

 

[Steve Clayton]

Can you hear the pump clicking? Some pumps have a secondary thimble sized filter.

When it runs out of fuel, and everything is in order, it can take 3 to 5 start attempts before it runs normally.

 

[volvopaul]

After my last thread related to the heater we have not firing, it turned out I don't think it was receiving fuel.

Its a webasto air top 5000

So today, ice taken out the filter, added a new unit, un hooked the pipe from the unit and used a syringe to draw the diesel up through the system.

Re connected it and 2 goes in, finally after 4 months of head scratching it fires up and gives out got air! Delighted didn't cover it.

However... it ran for 3 cycles and then appeared to not fire and the resulting fault code again.

Is this normal for these things?

It is yes, sounds like you have a fuel supply problem.

I moved a heater for a client (forum member) that had his heater fitted by another forum member that I had a good laugh at the dangerous fire hazard installation , the fuel pipe was on the exhaust! , some moved it for him, it would not fire up , so with a length of wire I tested the supply pump, no fuel so removed the tank stack pipe, it was 8 inches long than it should be , nicely coiled up in the tank. Anyway after cutting it to the correct length about 2 inches from the bottom of the tank so it does not suck up the dirt which it had done and blocked the pipe, with a few contacts from the wire supply it spitted diesel straight away to the pump and fired.

Eberspacher owners remember you only have 5 attempts to get an eberspacher going before the control box locks out then its dealer ££££ to come and unlock it. A webasto does not do this stupid stuff, turning it on and off or removing the 5 amp fuse resets the fault code. Btw its webasto every time when I recommend new installations.

So back to the thread, I'd be looking at the filter in the pump and its supply, rig up a 12 v supply to flash the fuel to the unit, as I said only 5 strikes and your in the cold.

 

[symondo]

A filter in the pump?
I would of never thought to look at that as we had a filter installed before the pump.

It ticks away quite the thing, if I put a live feed over it to pulse it manually, I assume that's acceptable?

Maybe hit the air bubbles I caused checking the filter I guess, never really thought about that at the time

 

[David2452]

Firstly, Webasto pumps have no filter, Ebers do though a small external one is sometimes used on Webos. if I understand you correctly the thing is igniting but not continuing to run after the glowpin finishes its start up cycle(s) if so there is fuel and I strongly suspect a layer of carbon on the pin and probably the evaporator too. You are probably getting five rapid followed by one flash. If the pin is masked it will not remain hot enough when finished being energised and the resistance will drop below 0.6Ω which on the first fail will initiate another couple of attempts (your three) before giving up the ghost and shutting down with an error code. You say it ticks when energised manually but does it click whilst trying to start.

 

[Steve Clayton]

Firstly, Webasto pumps have no filter,........

From Webasto Technical

Fuel not being fed to heater, although combustion air blower is running
Additional tank (where applicable) is empty, air in fuel system, defective coupling in heater, fuel filter and/or screen at fuel pump blocked, fuel shut-off valves (as applicable) closed, defective solenoid valve, defective fuel pump, crossed fuel lines.

Mine has a filter in the pump

 

[Mr Googler]

I have a webasto thermotop in my landrover d3. Can you hook an air top up to webasto thermo test software (which is free) via a wbus wire on pin2? I have just done this via a custom loom. Very straight forward. You can clear codes and run tests etc.

 

[symondo]

Hmm ok more investigation needed. I think its safe to say the glow pin will be manky, I don't think the previous owner paid much attention to the heater.
I've got the manual somewhere I'll maybe see about getting it apart to clean and test with a meter.

I had the 1 followed by 5 flashes 3 times, then it fired, I then moved the thermostat up and had the flashing back
Also thinking about it, air is likey as I altered the feed pipe so possibly caused a few air bubbles to be in the pipe somewhere

 

[David2452]

Mine has a filter in the pump

What model is it? there is no screen in the DP pump supplied with AT heaters being discussed here, in fact the pump is completely sealed and non serviceable. Some pumps with the old HL series had screens but that was 20 years ago.

 

[David2452]

From Webasto Technical
Fuel not being fed to heater, although combustion air blower is running
Additional tank (where applicable) is empty, air in fuel system, defective coupling in heater, fuel filter and/or screen at fuel pump blocked, fuel shut-off valves (as applicable) closed, defective solenoid valve, defective fuel pump, crossed fuel lines.

Mine has a filter in the pump

Also you are quoting diagnostics for the Pressure jet Spheros / Thermo 200/ 230 / 300 range which are an entirely different kettle of fish and do of course have a filter and a feed and return line, they are huge and operate on an entirely different principle to heater we discuss on here.

 

[Steve Clayton]

What model is it? there is no screen in the DP pump supplied with AT heaters being discussed here, in fact the pump is completely sealed and non serviceable. Some pumps with the old HL series had screens but that was 20 years ago.

It's an AT5000 - installed at build by Janneau so not surprised it might be non-standard and cobbled together with what was on the shelf. When our filter packed (it's not a repairable item) I fell over at the price of a genuine new one so I fitted a Halfords see through inline filter for £3 - still gong fine after 4 years

 

[symondo]

It's an AT5000 - installed at build by Janneau so not surprised it might be non-standard and cobbled together with what was on the shelf. When our filter packed (it's not a repairable item) I fell over at the price of a genuine new one so I fitted a Halfords see through inline filter for £3 - still gong fine after 4 years

Bit of a daft question..
We have been loking for 1 of these filters as it'd be handy to see whats going on - however whatever i type into google binrgs up filters at £40 upwards, im sure these things should be about a fiver tops. what did you look for?

 

[David2452]

It's an AT5000 - installed at build by Janneau so not surprised it might be non-standard and cobbled together with what was on the shelf. When our filter packed (it's not a repairable item) I fell over at the price of a genuine new one so I fitted a Halfords see through inline filter for £3 - still gong fine after 4 years

Obviously at cross purposes, not helped by relying on tech information that refers to heaters the size of many yacht auxiliary engines, the filter you refer to is a small inline jobby fitted before the pump not inside it like Ebers and as you say they can be bought from motor shops easily, I suspect the Jeneau install is pukka as every factory one I've attended have been and the little inline filter is a standard item that used to be supplied with marine kits with tygon fuel lines prior to the switch over to all copper and BS7840 hose fuel systems.

 

[David2452]

Bit of a daft question..
We have been loking for 1 of these filters as it'd be handy to see whats going on - however whatever i type into google binrgs up filters at £40 upwards, im sure these things should be about a fiver tops. what did you look for?

Buy a Mikuni one http://www.mikuniheating.com/Details.cfm?ProdID=148 for £4.50, if you are fitting it to a heater make sure you fit it vertically or it will trap an air bubble and give problems, if your boat mooring makes you subject to the BSS then fitting it would make it fail that, fine if not.

 

[symondo]

perfection! cheeky little bracket to clip it into, the pipe work we have should easily allow a vertical fitment

 

[RAI]

I discovered the hard way that my Webo does not like fuel bug. It blocks that silly plastic inline filter and burns a deposit onto the evaporator that necessitates replacement. I now have a standard CAV diesel engine filter inline with water trap and dose the heater tank heavily with Marine 16. Advice on the net suggests running the beast on paraffin occasionally will help clean out the carbon deposits.

 

[David2452]

I discovered the hard way that my Webo does not like fuel bug. It blocks that silly plastic inline filter and burns a deposit onto the evaporator that necessitates replacement. I now have a standard CAV diesel engine filter inline with water trap and dose the heater tank heavily with Marine 16. Advice on the net suggests running the beast on paraffin occasionally will help clean out the carbon deposits.

That's how we do it now too, and with all copper fuel tube.

 

[symondo]

its been run on paraffin recently as there was a 4L bottle of that pretty much empty attached to the system before i re attached the diesel.

Its all done via copper tubing. There was a larger filter in place - i have removed this to try and check it out but struggling to get into the housing.
We had hoped to put this little see through unit in to at least see that fuel is being drawn through the system.
Provided i can take apart the filter i removed and either get a new layer indie it or clean it out i'd be happy to add it back in as it does look a solid bit of kit, i just dont know what state its in.

 

[David2452]

its been run on paraffin recently as there was a 4L bottle of that pretty much empty attached to the system before i re attached the diesel.

Its all done via copper tubing. There was a larger filter in place - i have removed this to try and check it out but struggling to get into the housing.
We had hoped to put this little see through unit in to at least see that fuel is being drawn through the system.
Provided i can take apart the filter i removed and either get a new layer indie it or clean it out i'd be happy to add it back in as it does look a solid bit of kit, i just dont know what state its in.

You can get a couple of BS7840 hose joiners & clips from Mikuni with the filter which will make it an easy fit, technically you should really form a hump like an olive on the copper when you fit hose but without the forming tool to do it all starts to get a bit over the top.