Fastnet Yacht capsizes off Baltimore

[bbg]

When inside the rescue boundary of lifeboat services, they run the boat as close to 100% as they dare, then peg it back as they lose cover (e.g. on transatlantic) to a minimum of 85% before dialling it back up as they reach cover again.

Am I being an old fogey, or is this irresponsible to say the least, and basically risking not just the crew but the rescue personnel - remember the helo crew lost in 'Perfect Storm', a true story ?!

I don't see it that way. Anyone who sails offshore will do things differently than when they are sailing coastally. Your spares list will be much greater offshore than for a day sail. You might reef earlier offshore.

That isn't irresponsible, it is boat management.

 

[mjcoon]

I do have a one-man liferaft out of an ejection seat; the girlfriend can arm wrestle me for it.

Does she know about that survival of the fittest (arm) criterion? And hasn't chosen to bring one of her own?

Do you go ballooning together?

Mike.

 

[andymcp]

Perhaps the reason they reduce to 85% is not to do with lifeboat availability but more to do with distance and time under load. After all a F3 1000 miles from land probably loads the boat up less than 100%.

Great machines.

You may well be right - they simply presented it as a factor related to rescue capability but I didn't challenge them on it - was too keen to get out and have a go...

 

[flaming]

To me the most interesting / worrying thing about this incident is just how close they came to being lost without anyone knowing.

One of the best funded racing boats in the world, with all of the safety kit you can imagine, and the only distress signal that got out is reportedly from a PLB that a crew memeber had brought with them.
Leopard and 3 Volvo 70s went round the rock within an hour or two of Rambler (behind them). Leopard only 30 minutes afterwards No DSC alert, or voice mayday made it out and so they must have sailed right past without even knowing. If any flares or a handheld VHF had made it out with the crew there were boats pretty much on scene.

The Irish times is reporting that the signal from Rambler's own EPIRB wasn't recieved until 0400 the following morning - well after the crew were all safely ashore. For the 16 guys on the hull, that might have been just good enough, but for the 5 guys in the water....

All that safety gear on board, and the only thing that made it into the hands of the crew once the boat flipped was a PLB in someone's pocket.

Time for all boats going offshore with canting or "thin" keels to be thinking about storing safety gear where it can be reached from the water with the boat upside down?

 

[jpd85]

Rambler 100 has been towed to shelter of barley Cove/ Brow head. Plan is to assess the damage today.

So how do you recover it? Assuming the 40m mast is still intact and very little balast to keep it upright once they get it right way up. Do you need a floating crane or is there a simpler method?

 

[Sequoiah1]

Time for all boats going offshore with canting or "thin" keels to be thinking about storing safety gear where it can be reached from the water with the boat upside down?

Open 60's Class 40's have always had to have access to the boat and the IMOCA rules made sure of that last year with a specific requirement for the interior of the inverted boat to be accesible from a hatch either in the transom or the hull (there are some neat ideas for these)

 

[flaming]

Open 60's Class 40's have always had to have access to the boat and the IMOCA rules made sure of that last year with a specific requirement for the interior of the inverted boat to be accesible from a hatch either in the transom or the hull (there are some neat ideas for these)

Absolutely. It actually amazes me that a boat that is in essence an open 60 on steroids didn't have these features.

 

[jpd85]

I was surprised that the liferafts didnt deploy once it capsized. Is it normal for them to need to be manually deployed?

 

[savageseadog]

Time for all boats going offshore with canting or "thin" keels to be thinking about storing safety gear where it can be reached from the water with the boat upside down?

and seating moulded into the hull plus a hole to mount a table

 

[Pinnacle]

The yacht in happier times....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuzXRIeaJgM

Great photography!!

 

[sailorman]

The yacht in happier times....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuzXRIeaJgM

Great photography!!

thanks for that awesome speeds

 

[Seajet]

To me the most interesting / worrying thing about this incident is just how close they came to being lost without anyone knowing.

One of the best funded racing boats in the world, with all of the safety kit you can imagine, and the only distress signal that got out is reportedly from a PLB that a crew memeber had brought with them.
Leopard and 3 Volvo 70s went round the rock within an hour or two of Rambler (behind them). Leopard only 30 minutes afterwards No DSC alert, or voice mayday made it out and so they must have sailed right past without even knowing. If any flares or a handheld VHF had made it out with the crew there were boats pretty much on scene.

The Irish times is reporting that the signal from Rambler's own EPIRB wasn't recieved until 0400 the following morning - well after the crew were all safely ashore. For the 16 guys on the hull, that might have been just good enough, but for the 5 guys in the water....

All that safety gear on board, and the only thing that made it into the hands of the crew once the boat flipped was a PLB in someone's pocket.

Time for all boats going offshore with canting or "thin" keels to be thinking about storing safety gear where it can be reached from the water with the boat upside down?

Flaming,

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here, and if there’s any logic in this world maybe ‘The Rambler Incident’ may lead to design & rule improvements, just as the 1979 Fastnet did.

When one considers that a lot of aircraft have carried liferafts in the wings since World War 2, and the equipment generally survives that environment, maybe we yotties are being unimaginative and aiming too low re. safety kit ?

Just plonking a liferaft on the coachroof will not be much help with a fallen rig or inverted boat on top of it…

The obvious thing would seem liferafts set into a recess in the transom, though this has the snag of possibly blocking an escape / access hatch which will probably need to be there as well.

One incident which always amazes me is the capsize of ‘Drum’ when her keel ‘fell off ’, how everyone got out of the inverted hull in a severe gale in the dark is a miracle; note, no EPIRB then, just flares...

At a personal level, it can’t be a bad idea to carry a Miniflare pack or similar, though these are quite critical on expiry date; I tried some ( a long way inland ! ) at a November 5th and a whole pack failed, it was about 2 years out of date – 5 years old.

If I’d been bobbing around offshore hanging onto a fender or something, I’d have been quite disappointed.

Time for more pro-active survival systems, instead of hoping for a lifeboat with psychic detective powers; first on sponsored racing yachts then filtering into general yacht design ?

 

[kevino]

Word is that the boat has been righted. Not sure how they did it but could be the "crude" way. A line from one side, over the top of the hull. A Line from the other side, under the boat (remember its upside down) and then the lines are pulled by tugs. I suspect with a boat like Rambler with a very narrow beam it would flip very quickly.

On another note. I've heard that the epirb from the boat was not detected until a day after the incident. However a signal from a personal epirb worn by one of the crew was picked up and this triggered the rescue. Do doubt we'll get the full story as the inquiry gets under way.

Rambler 100 has been towed to shelter of barley Cove/ Brow head. Plan is to assess the damage today.

So how do you recover it? Assuming the 40m mast is still intact and very little balast to keep it upright once they get it right way up. Do you need a floating crane or is there a simpler method?

 

[Monique]

FWIW, There are no modern aircraft with the life rafts in the wing roots that I know of...

Though some 60's designs did have this feature.

 

[NorthUp]

]

Quote-"Time for more pro-active survival systems..."

http://www.rnli.org.uk/mob_guardian/

 

[Stig]

Film on RTE News tonight of her being righted. Rig all gone.

 

[savageseadog]

Film on RTE News tonight of her being righted. Rig all gone.

Pantaenius were asking some pertinent questions about the value of our carbon rig earlier today.

 

[Highland Bear]

Film on RTE News tonight of her being righted. Rig all gone.

That's a sad sight.......

 

[2700]

Film on RTE News tonight of her being righted. Rig all gone.

Dont know how much of the rig is left but the IT is reporting this;

Seán Harrington of Atlantic Towage and Marine Ltd of Castletownbere, Co Cork, said the location of the mast on the seabed had been identified and marked.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0818/1224302640302.html

 

[jpd85]

From various news reports in Ireland I had gathered the rig was cut away before she was righted so presumably the rig is still there on the seabed. Maybe they'll recover that too.
Rambler 100 is now in Baltimore and proving to be a bit of a tourist attraction.