EBay Problem

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Wandering Star

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Not sure if this is the right forum to ask for advice but as it involves a watermaker purchased for my boat, I thought I'd start here and the mods can move it to another forum if they feel so inclined.

I spotted a Watermaker for sale on the American eBay site. It had a very low Buy it Now price so I did BIN. I talked to the seller who agreed to ship it to UK and it cleared UK Customs this morning. The total outlay was $400 (USD) including shipping (which I know is cheap) and I paid £57 to Parcelforce for taxes & duties etc.

I really thought I'd got the bargain of the century. The watermaker was described as being complete and in new condition apart from the box. There's a link here http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/pur-water...PlKxbtoJHfC38JtHWKLhA%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

I've just opened the box and the watermaker is in pieces, the 12 volt motor assembly is clearly missing and I suspect there are a few more missing bits too. As the motor assembly is the most important part I'm hugely disappointed. I had suspected the membrane would need replacing because of it's age but to discover the whole thing is incomplete to a substantial degree is making me livid.

I've written to the seller but so far (early days) haven't had a reply. I did pay using Paypal so I'm sure I can get some satisfaction from them but I believe to get a refund requires the purchased item to be returned at the buyers expense to the seller first, which would be another $100 down the pan.

After looking at the auction description, do you think I'm justified in believing the auction was mis-described? Paypal took the money from my Visa debit card - am I entitled to ask Visa to refund it, not Paypal, or is that protection only afforded to credit cards.

Any advice?

Cheers, Brian.
 
As Northwind says - open a dispute on Ebay.

If yoiu haven't already then make sure that all communication goes through Ebay - that way they will adjuducate and if appropriate then you will get the money back via Paypal

It clearly says "but all parts and complete manuals are present" so you should be covered
 
I also had a problem with a purchase in the USA when I contacted ebay they informed me that I was not covered outside Europe.
I then contacted the USA eBay site, they were totally different in their attitude 36 hours later vendor was told to refund me in full, including return postage. I was also able to reclaim the tax/duty, this was à bit of a pain but worth it.
 
northwind said:
Open a dispute on eBay, say the item is not as described, 99% of the time eBay will find in your favour, and the seller will have to refund you.
Click to expand...

Agree, Paypal are very good if you are the buyer, remember that Ebay own Paypal.
I reckon you have been stitched up :(
 
capsco said:
I also had a problem with a purchase in the USA when I contacted ebay they informed me that I was not covered outside Europe.
I then contacted the USA eBay site, they were totally different in their attitude 36 hours later vendor was told to refund me in full, including return postage. I was also able to reclaim the tax/duty, this was à bit of a pain but worth it.
Click to expand...
I have now opened up a claim and so far the experience is exactly as you describe. It was rejected by the UK eBay site who pointed me at the USA eBay site where I've started the process. If the buyer doesn't respond by 21st February then I can ask eBay to make a Judgement. Much easier than I thought! Thanks for the advice from everyone.

Cheers, Brian.
 
Wandering Star said:
I've just opened the box and the watermaker is in pieces, the 12 volt motor assembly is clearly missing and I suspect there are a few more missing bits too.
Click to expand...
ne o
I wouldn't know one of a watermaker from another, especially in a small photograph - is the motor, or any other parts, shown in the picture ? If so it would seem reasonable to assume they should have been included.
 
moodyNick said:
ne o
I wouldn't know one of a watermaker from another, especially in a small photograph - is the motor, or any other parts, shown in the picture ? If so it would seem reasonable to assume they should have been included.
Click to expand...
I thought I could see what looked like the motor but it turned out to be a couple of aluminium cones or something in a polybag. The thing is it clearly states its in excellent condition and complete - which it's not!

Actually I had a PM from a forumite pointing out the seller has some historical bad feedback viz:

Nov-25-09 09:42 Took too long to receive,no communtion,
Nov-04-09 08:39 V bad packaging, arr. broken,rusted thru-out,not usable
Oct-20-09 13:29 Took 2 1/2 wks for delivery..paypal claim..received as described
May-10-05 14:03 BEWARE! BUYER NEVER PAID FOR ITEM. DEAD BID!
Dec-21-04 17:03 Never paid, never responded per e-bay policies. BEWARE - BAD BUYER!

Unfortunately because bad feedback only lasts a year his current feedback rating is 100% and I hadn't noticed the old feedback comments.

Cheers, Brian.
 
nigelmercier said:
Did you get what is in the pictures? The seller may not have realised a part was missing.
Click to expand...

He still offered it for sale as "all parts [...] are present". So the best case is that he was foolish, rather than malicious, in making such claims about a machine he didn't understand. Still not the OP's fault, he's entitled to rely on that statement.

He also said it was "in excellent condition", which seems dubious given the visible surface rust, and he picked an eBay condition category indicating that the item was new.

Pete
 
An update for anyone that's interested. The seller has now contacted me and claims he was unaware it was a motorised unit and he's apologised, his reply acknowledges there wasn't a motor assembly included in his parcel. Seems quite a nice chap actually. He mentions it would be pointless me returning the unit to him and is asking me for my ideas on how we can resolve the issue. Because he's apologised, I feel slightly churlish to ask for all my money back but on the other hand, what he's sent me is pretty much worthless to anyone who doesnt already have a similiar watermaker and who could use it for spares (possibly) in the condition it is. I doubt I'd get anymore than a token few quid for it if we agree i should keep it and accept a partial refund. How do you think I should reply?u
 
Am I right in thinking this is one of the hybrid models that can be both motorised and hand-pumped? Is the hand pumping lever included? If so, it does have some value to someone, even if it's not what you're looking for.

Pete
 
Wandering Star said:
An update for anyone that's interested. The seller has now contacted me and claims he was unaware it was a motorised unit and he's apologised, his reply acknowledges there wasn't a motor assembly included in his parcel. Seems quite a nice chap actually. He mentions it would be pointless me returning the unit to him and is asking me for my ideas on how we can resolve the issue. Because he's apologised, I feel slightly churlish to ask for all my money back but on the other hand, what he's sent me is pretty much worthless to anyone who doesnt already have a similiar watermaker and who could use it for spares (possibly) in the condition it is. I doubt I'd get anymore than a token few quid for it if we agree i should keep it and accept a partial refund. How do you think I should reply?u
Click to expand...

Accept a full refund, you stand the taxes and duties, otherwise he gives full refund and pays for return.
 
Under no circumstances cancel the eBay dispute - let it run and make sure you get all your outlay back.

You could get him to relist it (correctly described) and to say it will be despatched from UK (by you). If it sells he gets the money and pays you the P&P by Paypal - get him to pay it as a gift
 
could you re-sell it (correctly described) on ebay, and if it makes less than you paid (incl) taxes) he refunds the difference. If it makes more, you keep the 'profit'.

It relies on you making a reasonable sale of the item - which is in your interest, given that there have been issues in the past.
 
Follow through and get the refund. Also its worth pushing for the shipping and taxes. He made a false representation and is now asking you to pay for an item that is not what you ordered.

It is a ploy of bad ebayers to ship faulty / incomplete goods then when caught out, offer a discount or compromise - so you end up paying quite a lot for a item that you do not want or need. Do not let him get away with it.

Do not under estimate how valuable ebay feedback is or how helpful / powerful Ebay customer services is.
 
PhillM said:
Follow through and get the refund. Also its worth pushing for the shipping and taxes. He made a false representation and is now asking you to pay for an item that is not what you ordered.

It is a ploy of bad ebayers to ship faulty / incomplete goods then when caught out, offer a discount or compromise - so you end up paying quite a lot for a item that you do not want or need. Do not let him get away with it.
Click to expand...

If he was a commercial seller I might be incline to agree - but this looks like a private sale to me so I would take things a bit differently.

Pete
 
Sorry to put my four penny worth in, but this water maker does not have a motor, it is intended for use as an emergency unit or for use by the Atlantic rowers etc, if you Google Katadyn you will find the it is at the bottom of their range, the next one up has a motor retails at about £3000.00.
So I would think that the seller did describe the goods correctly, the photo's were clearly showing the pumping handle! I do however think that is is possible to up-grade the unit to include a motor.
Halb
 
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