Does the survey go with the boat.

[Sneaky Pete]

I've got interested in a boat that has had a recent survey. The individual who paid for the survey has walked away from it due to the type of work being required to rectify faults. Am I right in saying the survey goes with the boat, I don't want to have it resurveyed but would pay to have a copy of the survey from this individual. For insurance purposes does it make any difference if the survey has someone else's name on it other than mine.

 

[Minerva]

I got a boat surveyed last month - the boat was fundamentally rotten and surveyor made it *Very* clear to run away.

I sent the broker a couple of extracts with the key findings being reason for my walking away and that was sufficient for my deposit to be returned. If a subsequent prospective buyer wanted to give me some dosh to lessen my costs, that would be nice. In reality I suspect best course of action for you would be to find out who surveyed the boat and give them a call.

 

[Minerva]

P.s - what boat are you considering?

 

[Tranona]

I've got interested in a boat that has had a recent survey. The individual who paid for the survey has walked away from it due to the type of work being required to rectify faults. Am I right in saying the survey goes with the boat, I don't want to have it resurveyed but would pay to have a copy of the survey from this individual. For insurance purposes does it make any difference if the survey has someone else's name on it other than mine.

No. The survey belongs to the person who commissioned and paid for it - the previous potential buyer. He and the surveyor could assign it to you at their discretion , probably for a fee. You could then use it for your insurer - subject to rectifying the faults.

 

[BobnLesley]

I've got interested in a boat that has had a recent survey. The individual who paid for the survey has walked away from it due to the type of work being required to rectify faults. Am I right in saying the survey goes with the boat, I don't want to have it resurveyed but would pay to have a copy of the survey from this individual. For insurance purposes does it make any difference if the survey has someone else's name on it other than mine.

That Survey is 'Owned' by the person who paid for it; that said, provided that it's 'recent' I doubt that an Insurer would balk at accepting it.
Then again, how have you come by the 'original' survey document without the consent of the chap who paid for it, or is this just a photocopy of said survey? If the latter, then can you be sure that what you have is a true copy of that original survey?

Edit: What Tranona said first.

 

[wingcommander]

The insurance belongs to whoever commissioned it . You can ask for a copy , or offer beer tokens. Yes your insurance will accept it , mine did on a previous purchase.

Edit beaten to it

 

[neil_s]

The survey is of the boat in question - but one of the first paragraphs in the report should tell you the parameters under which it was carried out. For instance, from a survey I commissioned:-

A survey was commissioned to establish the condition of the craft for insurance purposes. It was carried out at the request of ----------------------
The craft was examined at Itchenor both in the water and on the hard on _________
The survey was carried out on the understanding that we are legally liable to our client only and not to any subsequent holders of the report.

I would check with your insurance company before assuming they would accept it.

 

[wingcommander]

My insurance company wanted a survey report that was within the last ten year's. I contacted the to see if the previous owners valuation survey ( approximately five years old) was adequate. They confirmed and just wanted a copy . This was 2019 . Obviously it was in previous owners name , and I was concerned regarding legality

 

[Sea Devil]

I've got interested in a boat that has had a recent survey. The individual who paid for the survey has walked away from it due to the type of work being required to rectify faults. Am I right in saying the survey goes with the boat, I don't want to have it resurveyed but would pay to have a copy of the survey from this individual. For insurance purposes does it make any difference if the survey has someone else's name on it other than mine.

The copyright possibly is owned by the surveyor... Normally ask the broker/previous possible purchaser for a copy of the survey and 'normally' they will end it to you... The person who commissioned the survey will certainly be pleased to share it with you for a fee to help offset their loss I imagine.. If the surveyor owns the copyright then the same applies - as for a copy for a fee.
The survey does not 'automatically go with the boat.... Insurance companies are more interested in how recent the survey was not who commissioned it.

 

[westernman]

Sometimes (often?) the contract you have with your surveyor prohibits you giving/disclosing the survey to a third party without the consent (and presumably adequate additional renumeration) of your surveyor.

 

[jamie N]

The boat that I'm presently buying had a survey a couple of years ago, that I've never seen, and have only ever been told of by the seller, and that everything on it was addressed. I believe them and it's apparent that's probably the case. I contacted my insurer, telling them about the new situation, and they seemed quite happy to accept it on an 'as seen' basis, telling me that if I can get hold of the survey, that's great, "it is the seller's property", but "not to worry" if not, and gave me a good quote.

 

[Refueler]

As one who made and produced Yacht Surveys ... and my continued main business is Ships / Cargo Surveys around the world - the Report is purely for the Paying Client. Even I as the Producer of the report have no right whatsoever to pass that report to anyone else without Clients specific permission. I am not even to pass on any part of it verbally or in written form.

It goes as far as : Let say I survey Fred's boat. I produce the report and he pays for it. The Original report is passed to Fred. He then passes a copy to Insurance or allows Broker to view it if boat is for sale. The Broker / Insurance Company / Seller have no right to ask me for a copy. It all goes back to my Client as the principal .... for him to decide.

Therefore to OP - Contact the previous who had the survey conducted. He is the decider on this. If he agrees to let you have a copy - probably for a consideration towards the fee he paid - then its perfectly valid for Insurance Purposes ....

BUT are you sure you want it - WHY did he walk away from buying after having paid for a survey ? Are you sure you want it - to show Insurance Company ?? with all the likely clauses that they may then create ??

 

[jwilson]

The copyright of a survey rests with the surveyor. He assigns the person commissioning it the right to use it for specific purposes.

Most surveyors will "assign" a very recent survey to a second person for a fee, sometimes 50% of the original survey cost. Sometimes they then give the previous owner who paid for that survey some of that extra fee. If you rely on a old survey that is not "assigned" to you, and something horrible is wrong with the boat that the surveyor did not report on, you cannot sue the surveyor for not finding it.

In practice some insurance companies often happily accept old surveys done for a person other than a new owner.

 

[Refueler]

The copyright of a survey rests with the surveyor. He assigns the person commissioning it the right to use it for specific purposes.

Most surveyors will "assign" a very recent survey to a second person for a fee, sometimes 50% of the original survey cost. Sometimes they then give the previous owner who paid for that survey some of that extra fee. If you rely on a old survey that is not "assigned" to you, and something horrible is wrong with the boat that the surveyor did not report on, you cannot sue the surveyor for not finding it.

In practice some insurance companies often happily accept old surveys done for a person other than a new owner.

Not in my Company .. and not with any report issued in past or present ...

Client holds the Rights to distribution - not the Surveyor. Surveyor is just providing a service which is paid for by Client. The client can make as many copies as he sees fit and Surveyor has no control on that.

If as you say Surveyor holds copyright - then Client would not be legally allowed to create any copies other than what Surveyor permits.

Think of it like a bag of sweets ... you go into shop and buy a bag of sweets. You then hold rights over that bag and can distribute those sweets as you see fit. The shop-keeper who put the sweets in the bag and sold to you has no right to take that bag and distribute as he sees fit ... he cannot sell that bag on to another either. But the buyer can.

I've been in this game for over 40 years .... I have no right to assign / pass any survey carried out for a Client to another unless Client gives permission to do so. Its so fundamental in fact - that I will only do so on written confirmation from client that they have no objection.

 

[nevis768]

I was given a survey of the boat I bought last year by the Broker. He was given a copy by the buyer who walked away because his wife didn't like the colour scheme of the interior of the boat once she saw it in the flesh, she didn't see it before survey. My insurance would accept it, but another wouldn't, and didn't get the business. There is a moral to the story re a wife's opinion being more important than the the brokers. It reminds me of what my wife says if I am considering a new car, 'What colour is it?'

 

[lustyd]

I had a survey and walked away recently. I sent the survey to the broker and offered that he show it to other prospective buyers if they ask.
My costs are already sunk and I figure it may help the vendor sell faster. The boat was lovely but needed more work/money than we could put in but I figured someone may as well benefit.

 

[Keith 66]

I started in the boat trade when i left college in 79, Since then i have seen legions of people think they are getting a good deal by using a survey a seller has had done for purchase or insurance. They think they are saving themselves the cost of getting a survey.
And yet i have actually seen & heard someone tell a very well known surveyor " Right, I want two surveys for this boat, One for me & one for the punters"! He got two completely different surveys just as he asked.
If you aint paying for it you cannot rely on it & have no recourse if the surveyor has missed something or outright lied.
I have seen a 31ft keelboat purchased off the back of a sellers insurance survey that was actually at the point of its keel dropping off & needed extensive structural work. He had no recourse & it cost him a lot of money to fix!
A Westerly Centaur bought of the back of an owners insurance survey that stated "Bilge keels have been reinforced"
Except they hadnt & were on the point of failure. The buyer had no recourse & had to swallow the considerable repair costs.
I could regale you with similar tales for the next half hour. Its quicker to just say If you havent paid for a survey it isnt worth the paper its written on. Just dont do it!

 

[Refueler]

Posts 15 + 16 ..... they illustrate the fact that if Principal who has survey done - gives a copy to the Broker - then that action basically allows the Broker to use the survey in a manner he sees fit.

 

[Sneaky Pete]

As one who made and produced Yacht Surveys ... and my continued main business is Ships / Cargo Surveys around the world - the Report is purely for the Paying Client. Even I as the Producer of the report have no right whatsoever to pass that report to anyone else without Clients specific permission. I am not even to pass on any part of it verbally or in written form.

It goes as far as : Let say I survey Fred's boat. I produce the report and he pays for it. The Original report is passed to Fred. He then passes a copy to Insurance or allows Broker to view it if boat is for sale. The Broker / Insurance Company / Seller have no right to ask me for a copy. It all goes back to my Client as the principal .... for him to decide.

Therefore to OP - Contact the previous who had the survey conducted. He is the decider on this. If he agrees to let you have a copy - probably for a consideration towards the fee he paid - then its perfectly valid for Insurance Purposes ....

BUT are you sure you want it - WHY did he walk away from buying after having paid for a survey ? Are you sure you want it - to show Insurance Company ?? with all the likely clauses that they may then create ??

After some detective work, I emailed several surveyors in my area and one positively replied. They are of the view that they are the copyright holder and should I want a copy they are the people to see for it. However if I had just shelled out a few quid for this report I would be a wee bit peed off if it was then sold on to someone else. If I being the one who commissioned a surveyor someone asked me for a copy in exchange for the folding stuff I would be happy as I can be reimbursed for some of my outgoings.
Fortunately I have found out why the boat was rejected for as the prospective buyer didn't want the hassle of the repairs. The repairs are time consuming and costly but very doable mainly mechanicals.

 

[ylop]

BUT are you sure you want it - WHY did he walk away from buying after having paid for a survey ? Are you sure you want it - to show Insurance Company ?? with all the likely clauses that they may then create ??

If it was bad enough for someone to walk away - will the insurer want a follow up survey to prove work done?

Think of it like a bag of sweets ... you go into shop and buy a bag of sweets. You then hold rights over that bag and can distribute those sweets as you see fit. The shop-keeper who put the sweets in the bag and sold to you has no right to take that bag and distribute as he sees fit ... he cannot sell that bag on to another either. But the buyer can.

It’s not a bag of sweets though - so the analogy fails. I think your point is however that it really depends on the T&Cs of the contract (explicit or implied) between the surveyor and those instructing him. My last survey was quite clear that it was for my own use only and I had no right to “resell” it. There’s a chain of three previous surveys covering its entire life so will be added to the file at the point of sale. Importantly, the subsequent recipients will have even less (zero) ability to sue the surveyor than I would for any faults with the survey.

Posts 15 + 16 ..... they illustrate the fact that if Principal who has survey done - gives a copy to the Broker - then that action basically allows the Broker to use the survey in a manner he sees fit.

No - I can gift you a book of CD but it doesn’t entitle you to do anything you want with it.