Do you use a motor cone when motor sailing?

Woodlouse said:
Naturally, if you abide by all the rules then a collision will never be your fault. But you'll still have had a collision. Where as a man who doesn't go by the rules, and doesn't have a crash will still have done nothing wrong.
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Thats my father in law, been driving 60 years, never had an accident, seen plenty in his rear view mirror...........................
 
There is a difference between deducing that someone is motoring from the way the main is set and seeing a cone. If there is a cone up you know that the skipper accepts that he has to act as a mobo . If he has sails but no cone you can't be sure whether he will behave as sail or power. Imagine you are approaching from his starboard side under power - will he give way or not?
 
Mrs Sea Mist II said:
Is they reason we don't use an anchor ball or a motoring cone plain laziness?
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No, I think it is the shear impracticality of the concept; requiring people to fly a shape which won't be visible for perhaps a quarter of the horizon, and which will require you to go forward in potentially bad conditions sounds a) a dangerous and b) useless. It also fails to take into account that a sailing boat motoring with the mainsail drawing may be just as restricted in its ability to manoeuvre as it is under full sail, as the power generated by the sail varies a lot depending on the point of sail. Motoring to make progress into a stiffish breeze with a head sea means that as soon as you move the boat's head off the wind, you will be sailing as the sail will provide more power than the average auxiliary engine.
 
AntarcticPilot said:
No, I think it is the shear impracticality of the concept; requiring people to fly a shape which won't be visible for perhaps a quarter of the horizon, and which will require you to go forward in potentially bad conditions sounds a) a dangerous and b) useless. It also fails to take into account that a sailing boat motoring with the mainsail drawing may be just as restricted in its ability to manoeuvre as it is under full sail, as the power generated by the sail varies a lot depending on the point of sail. Motoring to make progress into a stiffish breeze with a head sea means that as soon as you move the boat's head off the wind, you will be sailing as the sail will provide more power than the average auxiliary engine.
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So, the cone is ineffective for 1/4 of the horizon, 25%. So that makes it effective for 75% of the horizon, yes? So you are going to exclude the majority of the horizon because a minority of it wont see?
 
So I suppose to be fair you could say hoist a motoring cone only if you are prepared and able to act as a motor vessel. I always treat sails as such, whether I suspect, or even it is obvious that, the vessel is motoring. What else can I do? Same as when you see a fishing signal, although it is obvious fishing is not taking place.

I did spend some effort avoiding a small gaffer, ghosting along with all sail set in very light airs, although I was shooting gear, because I assumed he would have little steerage way. Turns out he was motoring anyway. The point would be, if he was only under sail, I would not have made to shoot my gear until he was clear, I was not 'engaged in fishing' until I started to shoot. If he flew a cone I could have stood on, it would not have inconvenienced him, but it would be very poor practice to force the issue. (....incumbent upon the master of any vessel to take steps to avoid a collision situation...)

I have to say I've never seen a motoring cone.

Cue post which includes the words 'fishing signal welded to the rigging'.....
 
We have ours up ALWAYS when motor sailing. Then if we were to have an accident how so ever caused, we would have the RIGHT on our side re Collision Regulations. Any way it always makes me feel good to be doing the correct thing and hope that others will NOTICE it?

Peter
 
I nearly always use the cone in the river/estuary/sound but often don't in open sea where 1) I can take early action to avoid all other vessels and 2) it's not always practicable or safe to keep fiddling around on the foredeck particularly when use of the engine is intermittent - if another vessel starts to get close enough to see a cone I could always run forward with it (or stop the engine!).
 
Mrs Sea Mist II said:
Is they reason we don't use an anchor ball or a motoring cone plain laziness?
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I can only answer for myself and say I don't use them it's because I don't own one of either! :D

If I had one, however (and it looks like I need to) then I would almost certainly use the anchor ball (easier to set when you single hand) but the motoring cone is at best unlikely ('difficult' to raise/lower when single handed and no tiller pilot) - I prefer to make sure I steer well clear of other boats..

PS. Yes I'm aware that the colregs don't give me a choice... ;)
 
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