chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
My thoughts the same as Macd and Norman. Hopefully the Landlord will allow you all access to clear the tenders from the beach by use of the gate, if not an amphibious excursion beckons.
Denial of Access to the boats - legal position and compensation ?
- Thread starter Binnacle
- Start date
My thoughts the same as Macd and Norman. Hopefully the Landlord will allow you all access to clear the tenders from the beach by use of the gate, if not an amphibious excursion beckons.
TOKOLOSHI
Well-Known Member
Priority should have been keeping the owner on side! Why? If its only a days work to repair the access, round up the other boat owners and do the job? If you are there on sufferance then there is more to gain by keeping him onside!:encouragement::encouragement:
oldharry
Well-Known Member
I actually had quite a lot of sympathy with the property owners once it became clear why they had done this. It was winter time so I wasnt using the access, but apparently the place was clogged with twitchers cars. The final straw for the residents was when some idiot actually parked IN somebodys drive! But arriving the next spring and finding it all closed was quite disruptive for a while. Its nothing like as good as it used to be, and what was free, now costs quite a bit because of one persons thoughtlessness. I think OP is probably facing the same. Somebody has upset the land owner, so he has pulled the plug on the arrangement. Now they all have to travel 10 miles to the place where they can access their boats. Lucky if they only have to go that far - I guess most forumites have at least an hour in the car to get to their boats! Sorry if I sound unsympathetic, but frankly I dont think you have a chance of retrieving the situation if the Landowner doesnt want to discuss it. As others have said taking the legal options only increases costs, and can never restore the former status quo if the landowner chooses not to.
Giblets
Well-Known Member
Normally a hostage situation requires an outcome or demand. If the foreshore where your tenders are located is his property and he is now not allowing access to remove them is the question of possible theft not involved?
Blue Sunray
Well-Known Member
A1Sailor
...
You've been low key for 3 months. What have you achieved in that time?
sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
macd
Well-Known Member
Sorry, missed that bit from your much earlier post. As said, it's not strictly a hostage situation, but it does put a different complexion on matters. It seems more akin to NCP accepting your car for parking, then indefinitely denying you access to it for no reason. (Except that NCP would probably make some effort to ensure the car wasn't damaged, which would be the very least of their liabilities.)
Am I right that you've collectively consulted a solicitor on this? Surely that raised alarms for them?
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Capt Popeye
Well-Known Member
If as I understand it the boats are on a foreshore of a River or Sea, then the boats are not in any way in hemed in by the lack of access as the river will go somewhere and the sea is open to all; just go to get together with the others is that sittuation and get there by boat, take their boats away = probs solved + but no more moorings on that foreshore; for now;
dgadee
Well-Known Member
Farmers! My father was a senior police officer who retired to be a sheep farmer. A neighbour built a substantial gate pillar on what he considered his land. My father knocked it down with a tractor. He said he never heard anything more about the matter.
Binnacle
Well-Known Member
"You've been low key for 3 months. What have you achieved in that time?"
Frankly I am amazed that you think that nearly 40 sailing / motorboat people would sit back and do SFA for three months. Of course we have been writing letters, reading up on the multiple land and marine-based legal domains that are impacted by the landlord's actions, monitoring/considering/challenging a number of defamatory, and legally incorrect, notices the landlord has posted on the gate, avoiding every form of publicity or press involvement, sending emails offering informal talks, offering to go to formal mediation, and generally trying to work within the boundaries of politeness and reasoned communication. We have eschewed very carefully anything which hints of confrontation, anything with the slightest tint of "Hey, you looking at me Jimmy ? " that leads to bar room brawls.
There are no alternative places from which we can launch tenders safely and conveniently to reach our boats which are on moorings licensed by the harbour authority and by MMO. The landlord, so far has said nothing apart from " a decision has been made to terminate the agrement, We see no point in discussing this further" or refusing to reply to emails and letters.
Our position has been to be as polite as possible so as to avoid any form of confrontation or escalation. Perhaps we should say "Enough" and let loose the dogs of war (aka solicitors) ?
Frankly I am amazed that you think that nearly 40 sailing / motorboat people would sit back and do SFA for three months. Of course we have been writing letters, reading up on the multiple land and marine-based legal domains that are impacted by the landlord's actions, monitoring/considering/challenging a number of defamatory, and legally incorrect, notices the landlord has posted on the gate, avoiding every form of publicity or press involvement, sending emails offering informal talks, offering to go to formal mediation, and generally trying to work within the boundaries of politeness and reasoned communication. We have eschewed very carefully anything which hints of confrontation, anything with the slightest tint of "Hey, you looking at me Jimmy ? " that leads to bar room brawls.
There are no alternative places from which we can launch tenders safely and conveniently to reach our boats which are on moorings licensed by the harbour authority and by MMO. The landlord, so far has said nothing apart from " a decision has been made to terminate the agrement, We see no point in discussing this further" or refusing to reply to emails and letters.
Our position has been to be as polite as possible so as to avoid any form of confrontation or escalation. Perhaps we should say "Enough" and let loose the dogs of war (aka solicitors) ?
Blue Sunray
Well-Known Member
Possibly, if you think the benefit for the remaining period of the agreement (or what might be left of it by the time the legal cogs have rotated) is worth the solicitors fees
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Binnacle
Well-Known Member
Our objective is to get back to, or preferably improve upon, the situation which prevailed before the landlord locked the gate. That is a an annual renewal ' on the nod' of the access agreement, advance payment of our access fee including the maintainance payment to the landlord, and access to our dinghies. As has been going on since the agreement was set up 10 years ago.
A four month mid-winter delay before leaving is not what we want, nor what we believe the agreement (possibly a lease by now ?) entitles us to. How do we get talking to the landlord if he refuses to reply. Is it really a matter for a court to decide whether he is committing a legal nuisance, denying us access, improper termination of the agreement, loss of amenity, etc ? If that went ahead, and we 'won', would compensation be a possibility ?
A four month mid-winter delay before leaving is not what we want, nor what we believe the agreement (possibly a lease by now ?) entitles us to. How do we get talking to the landlord if he refuses to reply. Is it really a matter for a court to decide whether he is committing a legal nuisance, denying us access, improper termination of the agreement, loss of amenity, etc ? If that went ahead, and we 'won', would compensation be a possibility ?
Blue Sunray
Well-Known Member
Well you could try asking a solicitor (or other qualified individual), for example via the RYA if you are a member, or you could try putting the question out on the internet and see what a load of unqualified old buffers of distinctly varying levels of education think. The latter option is admittedly somewhat the cheaper of the two.
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bigwow
Well-Known Member
You could take a leaf out of our traveller friends book and nick the gate so there is nothing to lock?
Binnacle
Well-Known Member
I have had a lot of common-sense advice, plus a few enthusiastic suggestions, from a distingushed, highly experienced, and wordly forum posters 
NormanB
Well-Known Member
I have had a lot of common-sense advice, plus a few enthusiastic suggestions, from a distingushed, highly experienced, and wordly forum posters
Well I sincerely hope you achieve an equitable solution soon and that your boats are OK and still afloat.
prv
Well-Known Member
Does it seem at all likely that you’ll be able to force someone to keep renewing a contract against their will?
Pete
chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
:highly_amused:
armchairsailor
Well-Known Member
Have you actually asked him what the problem is? Doorstepping him and politely chatting about it in order to get his side of things might well pay dividends. Diplomatically approaching the individual may well help to fix things. If that’s not possible, you’ll find out why.
It may also be possible for you to suggest a work party to fix the access issues - if everyone lends a hand the job gets done quicker and to everyone’s satisfaction.
An observation for you: In my training with dealing with other cultures, we’ve been told that asking “what happened” is a lot more productive than asking “what’s the problem?”
It may also be possible for you to suggest a work party to fix the access issues - if everyone lends a hand the job gets done quicker and to everyone’s satisfaction.
An observation for you: In my training with dealing with other cultures, we’ve been told that asking “what happened” is a lot more productive than asking “what’s the problem?”
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