Dangerous diesel heaters impounded

[jon and michie]

Yes, everyone who reads this forum (apart from the select one or two) is well aware of the need to replace at least some of the parts, but there must be loads of people who just buy one and expect to use the supplied parts.

Totally agree - and without doing any research into these things - The all in one units that some think are ok are definitely not - it other groups it had been mentioned when taking the case off that the fuel pipe is hellishly close to the exhaust.

 

[jon and michie]

First Mate and I are off to the boat this afternoon. The big Webasto will be flat out once aboard and a 2KW electric heater will get the boat toasty quickly. Once comfortable the Webasto goes off. 750W on the electric heater's lower setting keeps it comfortable. Tomorrow I will service the engine and genset. Monday remove the in mast furling line ready for replacement. If the Webasto dies, a cheaper, just as effective heater will be used as a replacement.

And if the webasto was to fail and you change it out - you already have the decent parts already fitted - all you would need to do is change the unit out and the controller.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

And if the webasto was to fail and you change it out - you already have the decent parts already fitted - all you would need to do is change the unit out and the controller.

That’s what I did. Though my exhaust skin fitting is alloy, and now showing it’s age.

 

[PaulRainbow]

There are also half a dozen FB grouos dedicated to Chinaspachers and their installation, and most purchasers will have studied these at some length.

- W

It is, perhaps, telling that these heaters need so many sources of discussion to be able to safely fit one.

 

[davidej]

This thread reminds me of the “refilling Calor Gas bottle “ threads.

One lot telling you that you will die if you try it, and the other lot saying they do it all the time.

 

[jon and michie]

This thread reminds me of the “refilling Calor Gas bottle “ threads.

One lot telling you that you will die if you try it, and the other lot saying they do it all the time.

Very much so
This subject is like a Tuk Tuk Car from Asia - is it safe - yes if driven on a queit country lane - No - if Driven on the M25.

 

[Plum]

You will actually have required Building Consent rather more than Planning. Planning may have been involved for the visual aspect of the chimney but Building would be interested in the safety aspects such as CO alarm, hearth size, combustion air supply etc

Yes, my mistake, we applied for both Building Consent and Planning at the same time, both granted based on drawings and nobody inspected after installation.

 

[colhel]

It is, perhaps, telling that these heaters need so many sources of discussion to be able to safely fit one.

This is my concern. There may be hundreds of these working without incident, but who should I take advice from, and where should I source the relevant parts for a safe installation? Taking advice from someone who posts a lot but has no shown little engineering or mechanical aptitude doesn't sit well with me. If I buy the parts to make them safe for use on a boat, I'd want the supplier to conform to standards that would guarantee I'm getting what I'm paying for.

 

[ProDave]

You will actually have required Building Consent rather more than Planning. Planning may have been involved for the visual aspect of the chimney but Building would be interested in the safety aspects such as CO alarm, hearth size, combustion air supply etc

I built my own house, including the heating (Air source heat pump) and the wood burning stove.

Building control inspected the stove installation and the stove manufacturers instructions to confirm required hearth sizes, air supply and flue instalation.

I did all my own plumbing. a local plumber signed off the unvented hot water cylinder install and a different local plumber signed off the very simple LPG installation (2 cylinders on a changeover, one bit of pipe, feeding a gas hob)

Plenty you can do yourself.

I reinstalled the Chinese heater in our new boat this year, because the original install was frankly dangerous, but it was easy and not difficult to correct all the previous errors.

 

[waynes world]

If he bought the Chinese one had somehow managed to interpret the instructions chances are it would be a lethal installation. Reason being, he would be likely to fit it using the supplied components, same as he would with the Eber.

You wouldn't throw any parts away with an Eber/Webast/Planar, so why would you expect to do so for a Chinese one ?

As i was saying. If you bought all parts needed for a marine set up if the heater does not contain whats needed for a safe fitting then it then no problem with the cheap ones. Its down to the fitter. Even an Eber marine kit can be fitted wrong.

Its down to the person doing the work and if they have common sense in doing it.

.I have seen work done by a marine LPG registered fitter and it was shocking.

 

[PaulRainbow]

As i was saying. If you bought all parts needed for a marine set up if the heater does not contain whats needed for a safe fitting then it then no problem with the cheap ones. Its down to the fitter. Even an Eber marine kit can be fitted wrong.

Its down to the person doing the work and if they have common sense in doing it.

.I have seen work done by a marine LPG registered fitter and it was shocking.

How many of these heaters have been sold on Ebay and the like, to people who assume that the parts they have been supplied with are fit for purpose ? No matter how well they install dodgy exhausts with condensation holes in the silencer, it will still kill them and their friends/family when it poisons them with Co.

If i buy a heater kit for my boat i expect to be able to fit the parts i'm sold.

 

[Bilgediver]

Installed one on my boat 2 years ago and it's been brilliant. Common sense said bin the exhaust, some of the ducting and fittings and get marine grade.

If you can't work that out for yourself you really shouldn't be out on your own.

I believe these low cost heaters are aimed at vehicles and small buildings hence the exhaust and other items which are unsuitable for marine installations. Can still save money even if using Eber parts.

 

[webcraft]

It is, perhaps, telling that these heaters need so many sources of discussion to be able to safely fit one.

No it isn't. They are in fact no more difficult to fit than an Eberspacher or Webasto. (I have fitted both a Webasto and a Vevor 'Chinaspacher')

The principles are exactly the same, and the heater units themselves are virtually identical.

If you want more after sales support and better quality ancilliary components then go for a Planar. (Which is a Russospacher)

- W

 

[webcraft]

I believe these low cost heaters are aimed at vehicles and small buildings hence the exhaust and other items which are unsuitable for marine installations. Can still save money even if using Eber parts.

Vevor Chinaspacher was £89, Eber exhaust bits, silencer and ducting was £200

- W

 

[webcraft]

Do you have any proof of that assertion?

I am judging by the levels of participation in these groups, and the fact that I obviously have a higher opinion of boat owners than you and Mr. Rainbow.

- W

 

[webcraft]

This is my concern. There may be hundreds of these working without incident, but who should I take advice from, and where should I source the relevant parts for a safe installation? Taking advice from someone who posts a lot but has no shown little engineering or mechanical aptitude doesn't sit well with me. If I buy the parts to make them safe for use on a boat, I'd want the supplier to conform to standards that would guarantee I'm getting what I'm paying for.

It's not rocket science. For a marine installation throw away everything except the heater unit itself and the fuel pump and install exactly as for a Weber or Eber using approved parts.

One tip I would offer from my own experience - buy a silicon gasket to replace the rubber base gasket, eg this one

GENUINE EBERSPACHER AIRTRONIC D2 / D4 NIGHT HEATER BASE SILICONE GASKET 252069010002

- W

 

[Greg2]

No it isn't. They are in fact no more difficult to fit than an Eberspacher or Webasto. (I have fitted both a Webasto and a Vevor 'Chinaspacher')

The principles are exactly the same, and the heater units themselves are virtually identical.

If you want more after sales support and better quality ancilliary components then go for a Planar. (Which is a Russospacher)

- W

I am guessing that the point is that you have to know what to chuck away, what to replace those bits with and what is okay to use as opposed to the complexity of the installation work. You kind of illustrate the point in post #176 when you recommend a silicon gasket.

As I said at post #120 I acknowledge that some will have installed ‘chinaspachers’ responsibly and safely, including no doubt your good self, but some will not and that is a bit of a concern.
.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I am guessing that the point is that you have to know what to chuck away, what to replace those bits with and what is okay to use as opposed to the complexity of the installation work. You kind of illustrate the point in post #176 when you recommend a silicon gasket.

As I said at post #120 I acknowledge that some will have installed ‘chinaspachers’ responsibly and safely, including no doubt your good self, but some will not and that is a bit of a concern.
.

Nail on the head Greg

 

[jon and michie]

It's not rocket science. For a marine installation throw away everything except the heater unit itself and the fuel pump and install exactly as for a Weber or Eber using approved parts.

One tip I would offer from my own experience - buy a silicon gasket to replace the rubber base gasket, eg this one

GENUINE EBERSPACHER AIRTRONIC D2 / D4 NIGHT HEATER BASE SILICONE GASKET 252069010002

- W

Bang on Look at Post #123

 

[jon and michie]

I am guessing that the point is that you have to know what to chuck away, what to replace those bits with and what is okay to use as opposed to the complexity of the installation work. You kind of illustrate the point in post #176 when you recommend a silicon gasket.

As I said at post #120 I acknowledge that some will have installed ‘chinaspachers’ responsibly and safely, including no doubt your good self, but some will not and that is a bit of a concern.
.

But Then if someone hasn't fitted a diesel heater wouldn't they want to get some knowledge of them in the first place ?
What would you do if you wanted to buy an expensive boat for the first time ? just jump in or ask what is involved not only in the buying process but additional costs etc