Damsel in distress

[Tranona]

Last winter we of the Twister Class Association enjoyed one of our periodic get-togethers at CA House, London.

A great weekend but what struck me, as always, was the great diversity of people who sail Twisters. People of all ages, thirty somethings to octogenarians, different
backgrounds, and some who had travelled from other countries to be there.

At dinner I sat next to a corporate lawyer from one of the big London law firms, a man who could probably afford to buy any modern yacht he fancied yet there he was, the enthusiastic owner of a 55 year old Twister. Opposite me, a doctor. Further down, a builder. Nearby a teacher.

The plain fact is, all kinds of men, and women too, love Twisters, enjoy sailing and caring for them, and often spend more money on them than their value might suggest is justified.

Some cross oceans, some stick to coasting, some are just happy restoring a beautiful boat.

My point is that your attempt to stereotype the owners of Twisters as aged luddites, trying to recapture their lost corinthian youth is so wide of the mark as to be ludicrous.

Of course, but you are talking about a small subset of a tiny proportion of the overall cruising boat owning population - and none of the examples are young couples with a one year old toddler!

I too am a professional person who can afford to buy a new modern boat - indeed have bought two but choose to own an old boat. That does not make me typical. As explained in my last post I am an outlier in a typical cruising club where the vast majority own mainstream modern boats Moodys, Westerlys, Bavarias, HRs , Hanses, Beneteaus, Jeanneaus, Elans (lots of them) Dehlers, Southerlys, Malos, Maxis, Sadlers (lots of them), Feelings, Mirages, Sigmas- the list goes on.

Best not to confuse the dedicated enthusiast with the norm or try to project their enthusiasm onto others who have very different requirements.

 

[Tranona]

Hillyard 9 tonner,centr cockpit,quintessenial family boat

No. Only in your rose tinted spectacled 1950s view. All the Hylliard owners I have known and met fall into my stereotype of old style boat owners. A modern family would take one look and run a mile!

 

[Wansworth]

No. Only in your rose tinted spectacled 1950s view. All the Hylliard owners I have known and met fall into my stereotype of old style boat owners. A modern family would take one look and run a mile!

I helped build a 9 and 12 tonner in 1969……..a brand new Hillyard with shining varnish ,was a magnificent sight

 

[Poignard]

...

Of course, but you are talking about a small subset of a tiny proportion of the overall cruising boat owning population - and none of the examples are young couples with a one year old toddler!

I too am a professional person who can afford to buy a new modern boat - indeed have bought two but choose to own an old boat. That does not make me typical. As explained in my last post I am an outlier in a typical cruising club where the vast majority own mainstream modern boats Moodys, Westerlys, Bavarias, HRs , Hanses, Beneteaus, Jeanneaus, Elans (lots of them) Dehlers, Southerlys, Malos, Maxis, Sadlers (lots of them), Feelings, Mirages, Sigmas- the list goes on.

Best not to confuse the dedicated enthusiast with the norm or try to project their enthusiasm onto others who have very different requirements.

Of course, but you are talking about a small subset of a tiny proportion of the overall cruising boat owning population - and none of the examples are young couples with a one year old toddler!

I too am a professional person who can afford to buy a new modern boat - indeed have bought two but choose to own an old boat. That does not make me typical. As explained in my last post I am an outlier in a typical cruising club where the vast majority own mainstream modern boats Moodys, Westerlys, Bavarias, HRs , Hanses, Beneteaus, Jeanneaus, Elans (lots of them) Dehlers, Southerlys, Malos, Maxis, Sadlers (lots of them), Feelings, Mirages, Sigmas- the list goes on.

Best not to confuse the dedicated enthusiast with the norm or try to project their enthusiasm onto others who have very different requirements.

All I have done is to suggest a type of boat that goes a long way towards meeting some, if not most, of the OP's requirements.

Having owned such a boat for a very long time, and having no reason to be disappointed in my choice, I am well qualified to point out its merits. Which I have done in my usual enthusiastic way.

Unlike you, I have not sought to disparage anyone else, or their suggestions.

But there lies the difference between you and me.

I suggest. You pontificate.

 

[Concerto]

Ah, the Hylliard, oh I remember so well in 1965. My parents had just bought a Kingfisher 30 and another owner had just bought a Hylliard of a similar length and far greater cost. The Kingfisher 30 was a lot slower than a Twister, but it left the Hylliard behind. A final comment on the Kingfisher 30 is I would never recommend one, even though some like them.

Returning to the OP's requirements, there have been a number of good suggestions and hopefully she has realised there are a wide variety of boats that could suit her requirements and budget. The real problem is finding any of the best suggestions in a condition that reduces the amount of improvements or upgrades. The biggest problem is the budget and having a sporty type of performance. Many of the AWB's do not have a sporty performance and will feel a little tame to a racing sailor.

 

[Wansworth]

Ah, the Hylliard, oh I remember so well in 1965. My parents had just bought a Kingfisher 30 and another owner had just bought a Hylliard of a similar length and far greater cost. The Kingfisher 30 was a lot slower than a Twister, but it left the Hylliard behind. A final comment on the Kingfisher 30 is I would never recommend one, even though some like them.

Returning to the OP's requirements, there have been a number of good suggestions and hopefully she has realised there are a wide variety of boats that could suit her requirements and budget. The real problem is finding any of the best suggestions in a condition that reduces the amount of improvements or upgrades. The biggest problem is the budget and having a sporty type of performance. Many of the AWB's do not have a sporty performance and will feel a little tame to a racing sailor.

Hillyards have engines

 

[Concerto]

Hillyards have engines

And lots of paint and varnish to maintain to stop them rotting.

 

[Wansworth]

And lots of paint and varnish to maintain to stop them rotting.

Wooden boats have a soul

 

[Daydream believer]

Hillyards have engines

And we know why

 

[Daydream believer]

Wooden boats have a soul

No they do not.They are just a drain on the pocket. They have rotten bits, peeling paint, Dim interiors, leak, cost more to run & are difficult to maintain, look run down after a few years . Giving less sailing time to the owner, unless he wants to spend his/her time fettling instead of enjoying sailing.
I know - I have had two.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

No they do not.They are just a drain on the pocket. They have rotten bits, peeling paint, Dim interiors, leak, cost more to run & are difficult to maintain, look run down after a few years . Giving less sailing time to the owner, unless he wants to spend his/her time fettling instead of enjoying sailing.
I know - I have had two.

Ours is just manageable, at just 20ft long. Anything bigger requires exponentially more care, and more money. Yet people love them. Most likely love the thought of them. Maybe like marrying Gwynneth Paltrow. Initially appealing, then they go all weird and expensive on you. Conscious uncoupling becomes the only way forward, at an immense loss.

 

[MisterBaxter]

Maybe like marrying Gwynneth Paltrow. Initially appealing, then they go all weird and expensive on you. Conscious uncoupling becomes the only way forward, at an immense loss.

Very true. We feel a definite admiration when a Chris Martin steps up and takes the project on, but no blame or judgement falls when someone finally decides that it's all become A Bit Much.

 

[ashtead]

I trust the OP enjoyed the classic yacht week ,certainly seemed much celebration at the Royal dart yc and I agree a contessa 32 “of Kyle” looked lovely as we walked by her on the pontoon . As a first solution I wonder if you need to bite the bullet and have a charter on an AWB as a family ideally but on basis whatever you buy might be sold on in a few years as child grows up/more arrive the a simple AWB has much to recommend in terms of space. You don’t say where you intend to keep vessel/sail as I guess needs vary between drifting around Solent to long trips to say Scillies etc or West Country is or plans to travel to Ireland. If say a Bavaria or Hanse/dehler don’t fit then a US Hunter seems for a small boat to have oddles of space , although the backstayless rig might not appeal to you. I think in reality a keen sailor is likely to want to replace some items on any purchased vessel so your real purchase budget might be closer to 25k to allow a margin. A self tacking headsail is a great benefit if crew are below with baby but just be aware of any maintenance pit which takes up time which might be in short supply.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

What's magic about a Twister? I could wax equally lyrical about the socio-economic spread of people you find sailing Sigma 33s, also designed to win races offshore in all weathers, conversing with an owner just a couple of months ago who is at the end of several years of ground-up restoration(a boggling and probably alarmingly expensive exercise but he did it, even down to removing the deck and keel)and it would be equally anecdotal and irrelevant. People like what they like.

A comrade at our sailing club owned a Twister and took part in the TA jester challenge. When he decided he wanted to go places with his growing small person, he sold it and bought a Fulmar.

Much to recommend about Fulmars, fast family cruiser with potential for club racing (unlike our old tub) and about the minimum suitable size for to OPs requirements for long passages with little one aboard

 

[davidej]

The old MAB v AWB debate being played out yet again.

ZZZZZZZZ

 

[38mess]

No they do not.They are just a drain on the pocket. They have rotten bits, peeling paint, Dim interiors, leak, cost more to run & are difficult to maintain, look run down after a few years . Giving less sailing time to the owner, unless he wants to spend his/her time fettling instead of enjoying sailing.
I know - I have had two.

I had a wooden boat years ago, 24ft of thick paint. It was like an old lady, lots of paint and attention to keep her looking reasonable.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

The old MAB v AWB debate being played out yet again.

ZZZZZZZZ

Not really, budget considerations also play a part.

The OP put a limit of £30k and if one takes on the fact that any boat will probably need £2k to £5k to get it sorted out to the new owners satisfaction, very new boats and thus latest modern designs are out if the Op wants a boat big enough to suit family needs. Its not as if big rear boats made other designs redundant - no steam versus sail discontinuity - and late 20th century designs show much development from 1970s style design in terms of handling ease and and creature comfort.

 

[steve yates]

It is perhaps worth mentioning that all the Twister supporters on here are old blokes - as are I would guess the majority of Twister owners.

If these boats really were the perfect answer one would expect there to be thousands of them in use rather than the less than 200 built. Equally you might expect those that remain in use to be very sought after and sell for high prices rather than the actual bargain basement prices asked!

Get real old blokes, they are totally unsuitable for modern day family coastal cruising compared with more modern boats designed with that type of use in mind.

They sell for close to 20k, far more than most similarly sized old boats.

 

[steve yates]

Again you miss the point. There are boats that are far more suitable for the OPs requirements. Boats like the Twister were killed stone dead by newer types like the Centaur (which sold 10 times as many in a fraction of the time) and all the others that the introduction of GRP and massive increase in wealth spawned. If that type of boat was so superior it would have been made in the thousands, but you only have to recall the brief against which it was designed to appreciate that is a million miles away from the requirements of a young family in the 2020s - or indeed in the 1970s!

You are right - the rare "good" ones command a premium over similar size boats of that type - but they are penny numbers and would hazard a guess that buyers are also oldies. No different with my Golden Hind - rubbish ones sell for peanuts, rare good ones fetch good money in comparison with similar age/size boats. However that is not a measure of their suitability, just that there is always a small number of people who buy the boats for what they are, often like me oldies reliving their youth. Not young families with small children.

But she also said classic lines We all know final choice has to be a compromise.

 

[Poignard]

Captain Fitzroy.

By now you have probably reached that stage, familiar to many who seek advice here, of wondering why you bothered asking in the first place.

But I would like to know what you do end up buying and, a couple of seasons later, whether you are happy with your choice.