Cruising Schengen area from 2022.
- Thread starter Koeketiene
- Start date
stranded
Well-known member
It’s hardly news!
syvictoria
Well-known member
From the above link:
And I agree, this is old news!
Mistroma
Well-known member
I thought the tone was hilarious.
They mentioned "allowed to stay in Europe up to 90 days." but don't think they said the ETIAS visa waiver was valid for 3 years (earlier if your passport expires first). The report is technically correct but the details have been public knowledge for years. I seem to remember that the fee is only payable if you are 18-70.
How will ETIAS & Brexit affect UK citizens?
Almost as if the aim was to make it seem like something just dreamt up and specifically aimed at tourists from UK.
"Bloc to demand cash and pre-approval"
"Reports had surfaced in various European media in recent weeks"
"European Commission in Brussels confirmed all British travellers will have to pay"
They mentioned "allowed to stay in Europe up to 90 days." but don't think they said the ETIAS visa waiver was valid for 3 years (earlier if your passport expires first). The report is technically correct but the details have been public knowledge for years. I seem to remember that the fee is only payable if you are 18-70.
How will ETIAS & Brexit affect UK citizens?
Almost as if the aim was to make it seem like something just dreamt up and specifically aimed at tourists from UK.
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BurnitBlue
Well-known member
How will this impact British Citizens who have residence (permanent or temporary) in a Schengen member state?
billskip
Well-known member
Dunno, but you may have to pay £10 for a visa to go back to UK
westernman
Well-known member
Good job otherwise it would have been banned.
Graham376
Well-known member
Seems a grey area -
If you live in an EU member state country, ETIAS may or may not affect you depending on your nationality. Residents in Europe will not be affected by ETIAS in their resident country. However, if they intend to travel to Europe, it may be necessary to obtain an ETIAS.
At present, those who are residents of a European country will not require an ETIAS in order to carry on living in the respective European country. Residence in a Schengen country does not qualify for the ETIAS, as it is strictly for travel purposes. However, there may be further regulations for those who wish to leave their residence country and visit another Schengen country.
More info here - How Will ETIAS Affect Foreign Residents in European Countries? (etiasvisa.com)
Mistroma
Well-known member
Of course this is only for short stays.
I believe that my wife won't need a Visa to visit Greece for under 90 days but I believe she will require one if intending to remain for a longer period. We could arrive without a Visa and nobody would bother as most people are only staying for a few weeks. However, I wonder if it might come up when she applies to remain longer than 90 days. She could just ask for it free of charge at point of entry but I imagine that will cause some grief. We'd probably need a certified Greek translation of a recent marriage certificate and my Irish passport and put up with a delay.
At least the Greek Government have given a specific example for a boat owning UK national. It doesn't mention proof of prior residence or married to a EU citizen or other gotchas. Just that you have a boat, money, current medical insurance etc.
Brexit GR: British citizens who live in Greece
I believe that my wife won't need a Visa to visit Greece for under 90 days but I believe she will require one if intending to remain for a longer period. We could arrive without a Visa and nobody would bother as most people are only staying for a few weeks. However, I wonder if it might come up when she applies to remain longer than 90 days. She could just ask for it free of charge at point of entry but I imagine that will cause some grief. We'd probably need a certified Greek translation of a recent marriage certificate and my Irish passport and put up with a delay.
At least the Greek Government have given a specific example for a boat owning UK national. It doesn't mention proof of prior residence or married to a EU citizen or other gotchas. Just that you have a boat, money, current medical insurance etc.
Brexit GR: British citizens who live in Greece
Question: I own and maintain a sailing boat in Alimos marina in Athens and wish to remain in Greece for a time period exceeding the visa-free three-month (per six-month) rule currently applicable for UK nationals visiting the Schengen Area. How can I do this?
Answer: If you are a UK national who wishes to stay in Greece for long periods of time (longer than the visa-free 90-out-of-180-days period provided for, by EU law, to UK nationals and their family members visiting the Schengen area ), without establishment, either because you own real estate, have a long-term real estate rental agreement or maintain a privately owned vessel in Greece, you may, as third-country national, have access to certain beneficial provisions of the Greek Migration Code (Law 4251/2014).
Given the temporary nature of your stay in Greece, you can obtain from the Greek consular authorities a national entry visa as a financially independent person. After receiving the national visa and upon your entry in Greece, you will be able to apply for a two-year residence permit. The validity of the residence permit is not affected by temporary absences not exceeding six months a year. It is important to note that this type of national visa does not give its holder the right to any form of work.
Yngmar
Well-known member
From a British friend with French residence recently entering Italy: "They pushed our British passports aside and were only interested in the French residence card".
newtothis
Well-known member
This is exactly the same as anyone wanting to visit the US or a host of other countries. You need to pay for a visa waiver before entering the country. One paddock in the sunlit uplands is that UK is now just another third country to Europe, the same way the UK is just another third country to the US.
BurnitBlue
Well-known member
The US is a Federal State. The EU is not but behaves as if it was and certainly wishes it was.. The law suit(e) against Poland is crucial. In US, visa access to all states is the same identical initial access to (say) Florida given by the US Frederal State. (I am not sure of that, but lets say it is true). In the EU, Schengen is based on Federal Law which the EU does not have. There is only one Schengen system and all member states have agreed to the rules. Therefore permission to spend 360/360 in Schengen granted by a member state should be applicable in all member states signed up to it. But, there is the problem that member states have their own laws that are superior to EU law. Poland is an example of a state wishing to preserve that distinction.
Either there is only ONE Schengen or each member state supervise their own. 26 different Schengen States. I believe it is this problem that is delaying ETIAS until they can sort this out. In the meantime member states are asked not to stamp residents passports or the whole thing will come tumbling down. The court case against Poland is a stepping stone. The massing of Russian troops along the border of a future EU member is a distraction. To both the EU as well as NATO.
Inspecting the present rules for Schengen, is, in my opinion, a luxury of what if's. Note the phrase "in my opinion". Interesting though.
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BurnitBlue
Well-known member
what I am trying to say is that if the US grants a visa for 360/360 in Texas then that visa will also apply 360/360 in Florida. When EU becomes Federal that will also be the case between Sweden and Greece. Until then no passport stamps for those with resident visas. Wow should have wrote that instead of the gasbag stuff above.
syvictoria
Well-known member
Oh, the irony... As has been pointed out in other similar threads, the Schengen rules are not actually new. It's simply that the our (British) position has changed, added to which a new digital recording system is being implemented in 2022.
BurnitBlue
Well-known member
Schengen rules are new. Prior to Schengen every independent state in Europe could and did implement their own 90/180 system or any variation they wanted. That meant that every state could accept a single tourist for 90/180 even if that tourist had just come from a 90 day stay in another state. If they wanted to. Now 26 countries are in competition for those 90 days which in a fair world a librral minded tourist eager to share his tourist dollar is limited to spending three days in each member state. That is new and arrived with Schengen.
As has been pointed out in other similar threads, the Schengen rules are not actually new. It's simply that the our (British) position has changed, added to which a new digital recording system is being implemented in 2022.
BurnitBlue
Well-known member
What is more to the point is that a single citizen of a third state country cannot tour the "ex-independent" countries of Europe by spending 90 days or whatever in adjacent countries. The EU stopped that inside the bloc. And that is new, so quit this BS that it was always like this. Can anyone prodice a simple reason why all EU countries cannot return to previous system of 90 days in each independent country?
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Mistroma
Well-known member
I thought the original Schengen agreement was fairly new and only happened about 36 years ago. There were proposals for further changes around 31 years ago and it was only incorporated in EU law about 22 years ago. All fairly recent events and not ancient history dating back hundreds of years. I suppose the term new is relative.
Mistroma
Well-known member
I wonder how it would operate. Passports aren't routinely checked when driving around inside the Schengen area and crossing borders. I imagine they'd only be checked when leaving Schengen. A simple matter of carrying out extensive checks at that point to find out how long they had remained in each country visited. I suppose they could also just guess someone was a UK citizen and pull them over in their travels. An honesty system would work, just make it a requirement to get your passport stamped in each country.
A simpler option would be to go back to the old system and re-instate border checkpoints. However, that wouldn't be a great fit with freedom of movement for EU citizens.
I used to just spend about 180 days in Spain, France, Italy or Greece. I should really have registered my presence when sailing into a new country and remaining for >90 days, but never bothered. I don't think anyone bothered to track my movements inside the Schengen area. Of course I'll need to register now if remaining longer than 90 days as it is a requirement for all EU citizens. My Swedish, Irish and Germany friends probably won't bother, at least for a year or two. Unfortunately, my wife only has a UK passport and I'll need to comply.
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syvictoria
Well-known member
In the context of the current issues that are being experienced/debated by British passport holders, the Schengen rules are not new - new in this context meaning that they predate 2016/2020 and that other third country nationals have been visiting the bloc and dealing with the rules for decades already. Some seem to think that the rules have just been made up by the nasty EU to frustrate the naughty Brits - that is clearly not true!!!
As has also been pointed out soooooo many times within these forums, the VAST MAJORITY of British holiday makers/money are in no way affected by Schengen at all.
Yes - I can give you three very simple reasons. 1) Each state has individually agreed to the rules, 2) Each state's trade and citizens benefit from the rules and the ease of FoM that it creates, 3) To re-implement physical border control at all borders would take immense expense and effort (I assume that you remember how it was pre-Schengen?).
I am mystified as to how some were happy to enjoy the benefits of the Schengen rules for the last few decades, and yet now they want the rulebook rewritten! If that's not a blatant example of British self-entitlement, I don't know what is?
If that was meant for me... What?!!!
???
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westernman
Well-known member
And also please bear in mind, that cruisers who want to anchor in a nice bay somewhere and exceed 90/180 are few and far between.
If you want to count how many bring anything significant to the local economy, then this is even less.
Also UK second homes are not a great income maker for the local economy in Spain either.
Most countries far prefer Chinese tourists. They don't stay long and spend more per stay and considerably more per day than anyone else.
So why do you think any politicians are motivated to change the 90/180 rules?
If you want to count how many bring anything significant to the local economy, then this is even less.
Also UK second homes are not a great income maker for the local economy in Spain either.
Most countries far prefer Chinese tourists. They don't stay long and spend more per stay and considerably more per day than anyone else.
So why do you think any politicians are motivated to change the 90/180 rules?
