Contessa 33.. what's the verdict?

[reeferjon]

Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

Currently seriously considering replacing my Trapper 300 with a Contessa 33. There's loads of information on the internet about the Contessa 32 (she's even a contender for the YBW 100th anniversary best yacht award or something) but very little on her successor, the 33.

I'd be really grateful for any feedback / links for more Contessa 33 information, how she performs etc etc.

Thanks,

Reeferjon

 

[sailorman]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

33 a good boat fractional rig & quite different from the Co32.
i do konw someone who has owned one for @ least 20 yrs & raced most week ends
try the Co assn

 

[michael_w]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

Superb boat. I came 3rd in the 2002 RORC Class 3 series then did a 2 year Atlantic circuit. How's that for a perfect cruiser-racer.

Good points: Turn of speed, (Thrashed our friend's HR 46 under sail, whilst in live-aboard mode) quality construction, pretty, easy and a delight to sail, excellent engine access.

Bad points: Poor quality electrical installation. No crash bar on the galley, fo'c'sle berths a bit short. Low companionway threshhold.

Sold mine in the Azores on the way back home and have been looking for a 40ft version since.

PM me for any questions.

 

[jamesjermain]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

A review of the Contessa 33 appeared in YM in September 1984 (copies available from Copy Shop 01202 440832).

Good points: super performance and delightful handling (typical Rob Humphreys). Spacious, if slightly simple, interior with interesting decor by Conran (of Habitat fame), ergonomic cockpit for sailing.

Bad points: poor galley, lack of stowage in saloon (but two pilot berths with leecloths) layout along old fashioned lines with quarterberth aft and heads forward of the saloon.

We tested the first boat off the production line and there were changes later but the basics remain true. Contessa YAchts had high hopes that she would emulate the success of the Contessa 32 but, despite the brilliant hull by Humphreys, the layout was not what people wanted in the early eighties and the interior styling was probably a step to far. Also, Contessa Yachts was struggling by then. Sales were slow and eventually truncated by closure of the company.

These days she makes a great fast cruiser and a better value buy than the Contessa 32.

 

[Sailfree]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

In talking about the 1989 Fastnet Robin (I think) mentioned how well the 32 performed but another Contessa did not. Can anyone throw any light on this and confirm the length and reasons why it did not weather the storm as well as the 32?

 

[Guest]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

You will be thinking of the OOD34 (Offshore One Design). A very different design from the 32, it is a large volume lightweight boat relying heavily on form for stability.

The enquiry afterwards did tests when they compared the stability of the Contessa 32 to another unnamed half tonner involved in the race see here - I had a suspicion that the other design may have been the OOD34. Can anyone confirm?

 

[Aja]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

OOD 34 was'nt built to 1978 and it says in the report a 1976 1/2 tonner.

Donald

 

[Robin]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

[ QUOTE ]
In talking about the 1989 Fastnet Robin (I think) mentioned how well the 32 performed but another Contessa did not. Can anyone throw any light on this and confirm the length and reasons why it did not weather the storm as well as the 32?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are no definitive conclusions IMO only opinions, some well informed and some less so. The weather and more importantly I suspect the hugely confused sea conditions were probably the biggest culprits, plus design trends and crew experience (or lack of it). Winds of F8 were forecast but F10-F11 reached, warnings of worsening conditions were too late to change much for boats already at sea. There were also apparently storms within the storm, areas where windspeeds were locally even higher and seas rougher, the Labadie(sp?) Bank was suggested as contributing to local sea state variances.

Tests afterwards and theoretical conjecturing compared differences between older designs like the Co32 versus the newer race designs especially, like the Nicholson 345, OOD34s and one-off race boats. The Co32 was used as the benchmark boat in stability tests further enhancing it's reputation as a good heavy weather boat and there were a number of them on that Fastnet and all survived, but then a lot of other designs survived too. I believe there was a conclusion that high righting moments was certainly an advantage but that every (small) boat would capsize given the right sea/breaking wave combination, however better design COULD reduce the possibilty of the boat staying inverted too long - wide flat/flush decks with little buoyancy in the coachroof area made them too stable upside down.

There were other factors in the design of some of the one-offs that contributed to them being abandoned, like high-tech graphite rudder shafts that broke.

The original OOD34 (Offshore One Design) from memory differed slightly from the later Co34 which was the same boat in cruising trim and which I believe had a bigger coachroof, so less stable upside down in the event of an inversion. Compared also to the smaller and much slower Co32s, the OOD34s were in a different area at the worst of the storm, also I think they needed different tactics to survive from the traditional heaving to and laying ahull to running off towing warps.

It is easy to point fingers and criticise or use the results to 'prove' only one type of boat is best. However there were also some outstanding results from what could then have been seen as lightweight wide bodied designs too, like the UFO34 'Black Arrow' that not only finished the race but won it's class I think.

It is also worth remembering that most if not all of the boats abandoned were still afloat after the storm and that unfortunately many of the lives lost were actually lost from liferafts or when taking to liferafts, or being washed overboard and harness or attachment points failing.

I don't know if the RORC report after the event is available on the web but it is worth reading if you can find it as is Adlard Coles book Heavy Weather Sailing.

DISCLAIMER! I wasn't there so mine is but an armchair opinion. However we were at sea but just at the very start of this storm, a family crew of 2 adults, 2 young kids on an Elizabethan 30 returning from holiday. We came ashore to the news headlines and rescue stories and it would be true to say it affected us deeply.

 

[Guest]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

True, tho' it says a 1976 DESIGN - first ones being built in 1978 wouldn't be that illogical

 

[Robin]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

I think an OOD/Co34 would rate more like a 3/4 tonner. My Liz 30 was built for the Half Ton Worlds by way of comparison. There were lots of Half Tonners in the race, like I think 'Green Dragon' and Pinball Wizard, both wood I think and the latter BTW sailed by the lads from Crusader Sails in Poole, I bought their spinnaker to use on my Liz!

Also by the by, I think one of the more important bits of theoretical thinking was not so much the resistance to inversion, because any boat will go over given the right breaking wave (not wind note), but the INstability when inverted, some of the Fastnet '79 boats were apparently too stable upside down and needed a nudge from another wave to right them, they did right themselve but too slowly perhaps. The area of a stabilty curve below the line is important in that it shows this feature.

Would I buy a C034 - yes. Would I buy a C033 - I haven't sailed one nor do I know the layout, but a Rob Humphries design so probably good.

 

[Guest]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

yes, I understand from the summary in Heavy Weather Sailing (happily have no personal experience) that it takes a ridiculously small breaking wave to capsize a yacht, as you say more a question of whether it comes upright again (and other details like whether it still has a mast)! I have tried looking several times in the past looking for the full Fastnet enquiry report through Google but no success /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[Guest]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

I found some quotes from the official report: "The narrow models would always self-right from a capsize having no range of inverted stability. The other models however would often remain in the inverted condition as a result of capsize, and had a considerable range of inverted stability, such that large disturbances from the successive wave train were insufficient to right them."
"Both models displayed an equal propensity to capsize, but the high freeboard version remained inverted on more occasions".
"... it is apparent that those [boats] that have angles of vanishing stability less than 150- 160 degrees can be left floating upside down after encountering a breaking wave."
"...It appears that it is the righting moment values at 100-130 degrees heel which determine the hydrostatic resistance to capsize."

Quotes taken from the official report by an interesting article that appears here

 

[Twister_Ken]

Fastnet 79 - half tonner

"The enquiry afterwards did tests when they compared the stability of the Contessa 32 to another unnamed half tonner involved in the race see here - I had a suspicion that the other design may have been the OOD34. Can anyone confirm? "

The half tonner that performed very badly in the '79 storm was the Ron Holland designed "Silver Jubilee" model, built by Nicholsons. The yacht Grimalkin which is usually mentioned as a particular horror story was one of this class.

 

[Guest]

Re: Fastnet 79 - half tonner

Thanks!

 

[Ann C]

Re: Contessa 33.. what\'s the verdict?

Superb boat. I came 3rd in the 2002 RORC Class 3 series then did a 2 year Atlantic circuit. How's that for a perfect cruiser-racer.

Good points: Turn of speed, (Thrashed our friend's HR 46 under sail, whilst in live-aboard mode) quality construction, pretty, easy and a delight to sail, excellent engine access.

Bad points: Poor quality electrical installation. No crash bar on the galley, fo'c'sle berths a bit short. Low companionway threshhold.

Sold mine in the Azores on the way back home and have been looking for a 40ft version since.

PM me for any questions.

Hi Michael. Just browsing info on Contessa 33's and came upon this post. We bought your boat here in the Azores shortly before COVID hit so only just beginning to discover how beautifully she does sail. Would love to hear more about her past history. With regards Ann C

 

[michael_w]

Hi Ann
When we bought her she was called Browzer Too and lived in Lymington and had been owned by a couple of GPs. She'd done hardly any miles. Lymington to Yarmouth then Newtown Creek and back again had been her lot with an annual trip west.
Mike

 

[Frogmogman]

Great boat. I was on the crew of the prototype, Moonlight. We won lots.

 

[Bajansailor]

Another nice 'small world' story, re Ann finding Michael's post from 15 years ago - and Mike promptly responding with info!
This is the true spirit of Forums.

And Frogmogman is modest re his comment above - I remember how the Moonlight crew consistently just mopped up all the opposition in the 80's - they were invincible.

 

[Frogmogman]

Another nice 'small world' story, re Ann finding Michael's post from 15 years ago - and Mike promptly responding with info!
This is the true spirit of Forums.

And Frogmogman is modest re his comment above - I remember how the Moonlight crew consistently just mopped up all the opposition in the 80's - they were invincible.

You flatter me bajansailor. It was Tony Blatchford’s brilliant helming that got us the silverware.

What was impressive was that we campaigned the boat in the 3/4 ton class against pure stripped-out race boats, us with our comfortable Conran interior etc. Tony was very strict about weight; we raced with an empty water tank and about a thimbleful of fuel in the tank, so we ran out of diesel motoring in after the finish regularly. I became something of an expert on bleeding the fuel line…..

FWIW, Peter Bruce’s Contessa 33 “Owl” was even more successful - winning an astonishing number of races.

 

[PeterR]

I’ve never sailed a contessa 33 but I have raced against one. She was a total bandit upwind in light /medium winds and her owner loved her.

The subject of Contessas and Fastnet 79 came up in an earlier response. I did not do that Fasnet but I did regularly sail on the RAFSA yacht Black Arrow, the UFO 34 that finished and won her class. I spoke to the crew afterwards and they attributed their success, not to the boat, but to the fact they had seven very experienced crew on board. None of whom got sea sick and all of whom could helm in those conditions. That meant they never stopped racing. They were still actively sailing to windward when the storm was at its worst, each of them doing short spells on the helm. The OOD 34s fared very badly but they were new on the market at the time and could not possibly have been well worked up and I believe most had resorted to defensive tactics.

In order to try and rebuild their reputation Jeremy Rogers offered the Services a deal they could not refuse and both the RAF and Army bought one apiece and replaced them with another 3 years later. I did race and later cruise these yachts and found them very comfortable boats and a lot more pleasant than the UFO 34 which I always found a hard nosed brute, particularly downwind with a spinnaker up. I never personally sailed an OOD 34 in more than a force 7 but I know people who did and they were perfectly happy with the yacht’s performance.

There were only ever 20 or so 33s built, there are a lot more OOD/Contessa 34s around (the Contessa 34 is a slightly detuned version of the OOD) but they are both significantly different from the 33. All were designed to the IOR rule and have smallish mains and big headsails which really need large crews. You can certainly fit roller reefing headsails but that compromises windward ability in a blow and the mains are a bit too small to rely on non-overlapping headsails for all conditions. However that applies to most yachts built before designers realised that IRC favoured large mains and non-overlapping headsails.