Club membership Requirements for Racing. What does Your Club Do?

[savageseadog]

Our club has a rule that the helm has to be a club member to participate in club (ie not open competition) races. I believe this to be reasonably universal. The problem is crew, at least with our club it is. Our club decided some time ago that regular crew who were non members would have to join the club after taking part in four races, a small fee would be charged for the first four events too. After finding this caused owners problems it was decided that there would be a new membership status of "Temporary" member. On payment of a somewhat larger fee a temporary membership is granted to owner and/or crew for the day. My argument as owner has always been that whoever I decide to have as a guest/crew on my boat is my business and I shouldn't have to have my guests dragooned into joining a club they did.t want to join. The cost is an issue too.
What do other clubs do?

 

[H4B]

Nothing official. The prime aim should be to get ever more people involved . If over time faces become familiar then members might suggest to the non members, the obvious and 'moral' next step.

 

[lw395]

Dinghy club has vague 'guests OK for a few races rule'. Permanent crew expected to join. That's seen to be fair because crew are using facilities like changing and showers.
Yacht club charges for all races and crew are treated as temp members.

 

[savageseadog]

Dinghy club has vague 'guests OK for a few races rule'. Permanent crew expected to join. That's seen to be fair because crew are using facilities like changing and showers.
Yacht club charges for all races and crew are treated as temp members.

Except that a "vague" rule can't be a rule

 

[lw395]

Except that a "vague" rule can't be a rule

It can be if it's badly written and not uniformly enforced.

 

[Birdseye]

We have a three clubs in the area so all our races are area races rather than individual club events. In theory, the boat must be a club boat at one of the clubs and the crew should join the same club after a few races but there is no policing of this. So it doesnt happen. All a bit of a muddle but who cares?

 

[roblpm]

We have a three clubs in the area so all our races are area races rather than individual club events. In theory, the boat must be a club boat at one of the clubs and the crew should join the same club after a few races but there is no policing of this. So it doesnt happen. All a bit of a muddle but who cares?

I think the only problem with "who cares" is that normally clubs need some money to function. Contrary to a lot of the skippers at our place I have told a crew member that they couldn't race after four races unless they joined which is the rule. Some skippers turn a blind eye to get crew. The subs at our place are £130 i think. For which you can race about 80 times a year. Seems reasonable to get people to join! Policing it is very difficult......

 

[lw395]

I think the only problem with "who cares" is that normally clubs need some money to function. Contrary to a lot of the skippers at our place I have told a crew member that they couldn't race after four races unless they joined which is the rule. Some skippers turn a blind eye to get crew. The subs at our place are £130 i think. For which you can race about 80 times a year. Seems reasonable to get people to join! Policing it is very difficult......

Bit of a grey area between the guest who races 4 times and the member who gets excellent VFM in 80 races.
I think more clubs suffer from lack of competitors than lack of sub-paying members.
I wouldn't pay £130 to crew for someone half a dozen times, particularly if I wasn't making a lot of use of the clubhouse.

 

[Aurai]

A couple of challenges.

One is that, where licenced premises and membership rules apply to who is allowed to use bar facilities, membership categories and rules apply, whether they race or use the showers or not. I think this revolves around entering licenced premises, so you have to sign in as a guest.

Then you cannot be a regular guest, or you defeat the licence terms.

Our club allies the crewing rules to the drinking rules, six times as a guest and then you become a member or stay away. We have classes of membership "Associate" that do not break the bank for an avid crew.

To be honest, by the time someone has settled in to crew regularly, they are happy to join, it seems and the six visits rule copes for the once or twice and never seen again crew!

Cheers

 

[flaming]

This is a slightly odd thread to me.

I am not, currently, the member of any club. The nature of our racing is that we go to the events, rather than racing with the same club every week. So it is rare that we race more than a couple of events hosted by any one club in a year. And given the entry fees that are paid, granting temporary membership to all our 9 crew to spend money at their bar in the evening seems a reasonable state of affairs.

 

[Birdseye]

This is a slightly odd thread to me.

I am not, currently, the member of any club. The nature of our racing is that we go to the events, rather than racing with the same club every week. So it is rare that we race more than a couple of events hosted by any one club in a year. And given the entry fees that are paid, granting temporary membership to all our 9 crew to spend money at their bar in the evening seems a reasonable state of affairs.

Yes but that is a style of racing limited to the more serious racers - the hot shots if you like. In our area there is very little if any travel between clubs and racing is much more about the local area clubs or even one club. And I see that as an increasing trend. I did part of Falmouth week this year and compared to past years there was a poor turnout of non Falmouth boats. Used to be a fair number coming down from the Bristol channel but I didnt notice one such boat this year.

Mind you I didnt see any club wanting crew to have membership in Falmouth. They werent even that careful about who they fed for free after the races.

 

[DFL1010]

There were a few boats down from Swansea this year, and an Irish flagged boat, and one from the North-East area who 'does the South Coast circuit'. At least half a dozen visitors that I know of, and most likely more.

The trouble for Falmouth is it's a slog to get here, and usually clashes with another, well-known, week-long event up in the Solent.

Paying entry to Falmouth Week gains one rights to the host clubs each night, so it'd be very odd for them to want more money. As to free food, that's only at Helford (and you'd have to be a fool to drive all that way for a free sarnie), so why should the other clubs care to whom they sell food?


For the rest of the season, I think it's fairly sensible here. Being a member of one POFSA club gets you reciprocal rights at all other POFSA clubs so you can go to the bar afterwards, but you may have to pay a race-entry fee if you're not a member (or a higher one than the members do, depending on the club).
Quite often for the bottom line it's better to let people race and drink than turn people off racing at all (or maybe I just know the thirsty boats).

 

[lw395]

This is a slightly odd thread to me.

I am not, currently, the member of any club. The nature of our racing is that we go to the events, rather than racing with the same club every week. So it is rare that we race more than a couple of events hosted by any one club in a year. And given the entry fees that are paid, granting temporary membership to all our 9 crew to spend money at their bar in the evening seems a reasonable state of affairs.

That works well at the upper level, where there is an entry fee.
The problem is more at 'club race' level where there is no entry fee.
Possibly more common in Dinghy clubs?
It's not just the annual sub, it's 'duties' where members will be expected to take a turn in the RIB etc while visitors won't.
Different clubs seem to find their own compromise.
Personally, I think clubs could often benefit from working more with neighbouring clubs, and doing more to draw in non-members.

 

[markhomer]

This is a slightly odd thread to me.

I am not, currently, the member of any club. The nature of our racing is that we go to the events, rather than racing with the same club every week. So it is rare that we race more than a couple of events hosted by any one club in a year. And given the entry fees that are paid, granting temporary membership to all our 9 crew to spend money at their bar in the evening seems a reasonable state of affairs.

I guess flaming that you/ the owner others are members of the rya then , a loophole many use to compete in racing run by clubs affiliated to the rya , which most are ,
Think rrs 75 deals with the requirement to race that a boat entered to race under the rrs shall be entered by a member of a club or organisation affiliated to an isaf member national authority . Blah blah de blah.

In simples speak if someone enters a boat for a race they shall either be a club member or member of mna , in uk case rya .

Thereafter the can of worms open as you discuss , keelboat crews membership have been a perenial prob in our club , one thats never really been resolved , goes away and gets forgotten , prob is that ,by its nature keelboat sailing isnt a great drain on club resource , infact most keelboat owners are invisible members that provide a dripping roast , they should be encouraged to bring their crew into bars and functions and spend their loot , but the full time resource hungry members cant see this , ive feet in all camps and can see all views , dont have an answer , other than bucket of sand

 

[lw395]

Going to other clubs to race, for instance in dinghy open meetings can be quite an eye opener.
Some are clearly out to make money, which is fair enough, but a few clubs seem to take it all a bit far, charging as much as possible and having visitors (high) prices for drinks etc.
Others, you feel like they are inviting you in to their home, returning the hospitality they received the other week.
There is huge difference with various clubs and classes.

 

[bobgarrett]

For our cruiser racing club, a full member must be on board to race and potentially win trophies etc. Whether they helm is up to them. We also allow guest boats but as already implied they cannot win anything. This is to allow them to experience the race and social aspects of the club in the hope they will later choose to join.

 

[Birdseye]

I think the only problem with "who cares" is that normally clubs need some money to function. Contrary to a lot of the skippers at our place I have told a crew member that they couldn't race after four races unless they joined which is the rule. Some skippers turn a blind eye to get crew. The subs at our place are £130 i think. For which you can race about 80 times a year. Seems reasonable to get people to join! Policing it is very difficult......

WE have race fees to cover the costs of the racing inc prizes etc. £25 for a series of 9 or 10 races and something like £100 for the season.. Regattas are extra.

 

[Foolish Muse]

I think my club has got it right. We have a set price for beer at the bar. Those who pay on their club account number get a discount - only visible on their monthly tab. If you look at the bar on any racing night, you'll see a long line of non-member racers buying beer. Even if they only pay $1 extra per beer, it soon adds up to a lot of extra revenue for the club. This becomes their non-intrusive way of paying club expenses and resolves the whole issue of asking them to join.

 

[roblpm]

I think my club has got it right. We have a set price for beer at the bar. Those who pay on their club account number get a discount - only visible on their monthly tab. If you look at the bar on any racing night, you'll see a long line of non-member racers buying beer. Even if they only pay $1 extra per beer, it soon adds up to a lot of extra revenue for the club. This becomes their non-intrusive way of paying club expenses and resolves the whole issue of asking them to join.

I dont think that would work at our club. The new drink driving laws in Scotland have pretty much done for the beer receipts!!

 

[temptress]

Our club has a rule that the helm has to be a club member to participate in club (ie not open competition) races. I believe this to be reasonably universal. The problem is crew, at least with our club it is. Our club decided some time ago that regular crew who were non members would have to join the club after taking part in four races, a small fee would be charged for the first four events too. After finding this caused owners problems it was decided that there would be a new membership status of "Temporary" member. On payment of a somewhat larger fee a temporary membership is granted to owner and/or crew for the day. My argument as owner has always been that whoever I decide to have as a guest/crew on my boat is my business and I shouldn't have to have my guests dragooned into joining a club they did.t want to join. The cost is an issue too.
What do other clubs do?

Find a different club. Most clubs expect permanent crew to join at some time. What is this BS aboutnonly members can play (helm?). I WOULD SAIL ELSEWHERE. Sounds all very unfriendly to me.