cleaning beta heat exchanger stack - easy or not?

[Pagetslady]

No, there is no seal on the divider. I can't imagine the water taking a shortcut unless either the tubes are blocked or the divider is damaged. It maybe that you are not passing enough water through the system as a whole. Too small an inlet? Collapsed inlet tube somewhere? Damaged impeller?[/
My 35 Beta certainly has a seal on the horizontal devider I can't see how a seal can be made without one. First time I cleaned mine it dropped out without me knowing, fortunately I found it before reassembling it.
Mike

 

[LittleSister]

Some years on from original but problem remains unsolved for me and I'm getting no advice from Beta UK. For whatever reason, my oil dipstick tube sits directly behind the alternator end of the tube stack cap. I've unscrewed the bolt partially but can go no further. That movement has screwed the O ring seal and any attempt to re-position the cap, water leaks, so I now have an unsealed HE and I cannot get the cap off in order to replace the O ring and reseal. I looked at cutting the dipstick tube off by 1 inch, which would allow me to remove the cap, if not the stack but the area is so confined that a Dremel cutter may do more damage than intended. I'm at a loss and grateful for any thoughts

Very unusual to get no help from Beta. They're famous for their service.

The dip stick tube isn't part of the engine casting, so presumably is screwed or otherwise fitted into that casting. If it is fouling the tube stack I suspect it has been moved - rotated or bent - out of the correct position, and can presumably be moved back into it. If not, perhaps it can be unscrewed or otherwise temporarily disconnected from the engine, and replaced when you've done the heat exchanger.

Cutting the dipstick sounds a bit drastic, but if you do it, don't forget (a) to put something in the tube (that you can get out again!) to stop swarf falling down the tube into the engine, and (b) your dipstick won't subsequently correctly indicate oil level.

 

[stepcor]

Yes indeed I agree, in the past Beta have been very responsive but alas not this time over a period of two weeks.
The dipstick is a conundrum: cutting the tube itself shouldn't be a problem with a corresponding trim of the dipstick also but as I said, space is really confined and I'm likely to more damage. Access is seriously limited but there appears to be no attachment holding it to the block and it's absolutely straight from the sump up. Stupid positioning but I have no option but to find a solution otherwise I'm not going to be able to rehouse the end cap. It's a curious engine- impossible to identify but we think about 38HP, the raw water pump is inaccessible, fixed around the side behind the air intake, which makes impeller replacement amusing. As with the dipstick, no idea who at Beta did this or why but despite its shortcomings, it's served me very well for the 10 years I've had it. I'll post when a solution is found.

Further to that @littlesister, my thanks for putting me on a different thought track. Although it wasn't bent, after your comment I thought perhaps it could bend out of the way, so I heated it for a short time and put a rather nice graceful arc a couple of inches away from the tube stack housing. Perfect and the stick slides in no problem. Managed to get the cap off and to my great surprise the stack looks in good shape. For future ref for anyone with similar issues, the tube cannot be removed so this was a great outcome.

Thanks for the reply

 

[Praxinoscope]

Wow! I fitted a Beta 10 in my last boat and ran it for 20 years before selling it, and in those 20 years I never even thought about looking at the stack, never had any problems either neither to my knowledge has the new owner. Idid have a very efficient filter in the raw water intake, not the usual Vetus, but maybe I was just lucky?
My new boat also has a Beta engine which runs well but now you all have me worried so I have just addd cleaning the stack to my Winter maintenance schedule.
I should add that the zinc pencil anode was replaced every year and I had the Speedseal cover on the impeller housing which made removingthe impeller each winter for storage relatively simple, only had to replace one impeller in 20 years and that was my fault when test running the engine before an annual launch I let it run dry and it chewed up on vane.

 

[cindersailor]

A couple of words of caution about this job. If you find that the tube stack is stuck when you remove the end fittings do not get too enthusiastic with the hammer. In the older design heat exchangers (mine is 2006) the tube stack ends sit in aluminium bushes that are held into the exchanger tank with adhesive/sealer and it is possible to break this seal. Beta cannot supply a new bush, but fortunately I managed to refit mine with epoxy, after a good clean up. If you clean up the tube stack with acid (brick cleaner) you will find that the anode consumption rate will go up for a year or so. Exposing clean bright metal results in more electrolytic action.

 

[graham]

Bit of old thread resurrection. I just took the end caps of my beta 20 for the first time since buying the boat about 3 years ago.

It looked pretty good I could see through all the tubes except two which I poked through with a bit of wire.Some small strands of weed and bits of anode at the back end .all ceaned out easilly.

What I didnt do was remove the stack from the heat exchanger as it didnt want to come out and I didnt want to risk damaging it .

I may make up a puller for next time which would thread onto thd end cap bolt hole thread.

Im not concerned as it looked clean and temperatures all ok.Probably helped by my mooring being in a fresh water river (we lock out to sea to go sailing but it allways gets a good fresh water flush coming back to the mooring from the lock.

Anyone else find their tube stack stuck ?

 

[PetiteFleur]

One point to note if you have the early end caps with a single central bolt - you MUST replace these bolts every 10 yrs. which Beta recommended. If you don't replace they will break and the end cap come off... fortunately I had just started the engine at the beginning of the year and saw it happen! My engine was 12 yrs old. Later HE have 3 bolts to hold each end cap.

 

[graham]

One point to note if you have the early end caps with a single central bolt - you MUST replace these bolts every 10 yrs. which Beta recommended. If you don't replace they will break and the end cap come off... fortunately I had just started the engine at the beginning of the year and saw it happen! My engine was 12 yrs old. Later HE have 3 bolts to hold each end cap.

By coincidence a friend of ours had exactly that happened on his beta 10 just recently .luckilly his also happened before they left the berth.

 

[BabaYaga]

What I didnt do was remove the stack from the heat exchanger as it didnt want to come out and I didnt want to risk damaging it .

I may make up a puller for next time which would thread onto thd end cap bolt hole thread.

Im not concerned as it looked clean and temperatures all ok.Probably helped by my mooring being in a fresh water river (we lock out to sea to go sailing but it allways gets a good fresh water flush coming back to the mooring from the lock.

Anyone else find their tube stack stuck ?

Have you removed the O-rings? I have found the stack comes out easily once they are. It can be tricky getting a grip on the rings without them being damaged, but they should be exchanged anyway.

 

[carpetsauce]

The tube stack will come out either way (access allowing). Just tap carefully with a piece of wood between your hammer and the stack. Rather than using expensive products to clean the stack drop it and its end caps into a tupperware container of vinegar overnight. In the morning the cruddy material blocking any of the tubes will be easy to free with a thin rod and the rest of the stack will look almost new. Cheap as chips, but prob not a good idea to use the old vinegar on your celebratory fries.

 

[MOBY2]

The tube stack will come out either way (access allowing). Just tap carefully with a piece of wood between your hammer and the stack. Rather than using expensive products to clean the stack drop it and its end caps into a tupperware container of vinegar overnight. In the morning the cruddy material blocking any of the tubes will be easy to free with a thin rod and the rest of the stack will look almost new. Cheap as chips, but prob not a good idea to use the old vinegar on your celebratory fries.

 

[MOBY2]

Did mine recently Nanni N2.10, bit fiddly due to lack of space. Alternator off and had to tap the stack with wood and rubber mallet to get it going and it can only go backwards. Had 4 O rings to replace, I found a local firm who tested what they were and supplied them for half the price and were brilliant to deal with. There was a little crud but after 500 hours not too bad so soaked in Rydlyme and clean as a whistle. Again fiddly to reassemble but my advice would be take some pictures as you go and I've typed up a procedure to make life easier next time as I will have doubtless forgotten by then. ?

 

[bluerm166]

A bit shocked at those who run valuable and essential engines but don't source or download a manual and read at least the maintenance schedule..

 

[oilybilge]

While you're at it, it's worth removing the stainless steel tube that connects the heat exchanger to the salt water pump, and checking for limescale build up. I found loads this year at the pump outlet.

It's easy to do, on the Beta 20 anyway. Just hose clips and the plastic clamp on top.

 

[TwoFish]

Thanks to all who have contributed to this thread. I found it very useful in understanding how to remove and clean the heat exchanger tube stack on our Beta 28. I'm very glad so I did so as there proved to be a good deal of scale and muck as well as a broken piece of impeller in there. I suspect an overheating incident might have followed in not too long, had the job not been done.

Lessons learned:

• Despite the scale and crud, only a little gentle tapping was needed to loosen the tube stack. I used a large wooden bung as a drift, applying a few gentle hammer taps.
• A bamboo BBQ skewer made an excellent tube-rodding tool.
• A packet of dishwasher descaler in about half a litre of water made a good acid bath for descaling the end-caps and the tube stack.
• Refitting (even with new O-rings) was a fiddle, with the exhaust-side end cap leaking small amounts of coolant on the first two reassembly attempts. Third time lucky (with even less tightening of the single end bolts, after a helpful conversation with Beta) and even then there were a few initial drips, before the seal seemed to 'settle'.

 

[chrishscorp]

One point to note if you have the early end caps with a single central bolt - you MUST replace these bolts every 10 yrs. which Beta recommended. If you don't replace they will break and the end cap come off... fortunately I had just started the engine at the beginning of the year and saw it happen! My engine was 12 yrs old. Later HE have 3 bolts to hold each end cap.

Interesting never heard that, 2 sets on Mondays shopping list.

 

[Refueler]

Can you not do it chemically ? ie something like Furnox or similar that is Aluminium / Alloy safe ??

Even common Anti-Freeze has cleaning agents in .. so instead of raw water to the HE ... setup a container with AF mix in ... collect it at exhaust ... Let engine and mix cool ... run it through again repeatedly ?

Just asking ...

 

[graham]

Can you not do it chemically ? ie something like Furnox or similar that is Aluminium / Alloy safe ??

Even common Anti-Freeze has cleaning agents in .. so instead of raw water to the HE ... setup a container with AF mix in ... collect it at exhaust ... Let engine and mix cool ... run it through again repeatedly ?

Just asking ...

Personally I dont understand why people soak heat exchanger tube stacks in various acids so they are gleaming new looking when they reassemble it.

The dull patina on the metal is protecting it from ordinary corrosion and electolisis corrosion.

Its well known that with Beta tube stacks if you clean it to bright and shiny your anode in the heat exchanger will dissapear quicker than usual.

Im no expert but it seems sensible to me to clean it but dont do anything to remove the dull surface patina.

 

[Refueler]

Personally I dont understand why people soak heat exchanger tube stacks in various acids so they are gleaming new looking when they reassemble it.

The dull patina on the metal is protecting it from ordinary corrosion and electolisis corrosion.

Its well known that with Beta tube stacks if you clean it to bright and shiny your anode in the heat exchanger will dissapear quicker than usual.

Im no expert but it seems sensible to me to clean it but dont do anything to remove the dull surface patina.

Passing a chemical cleaner - especially Anti-Freeze through instead of water flow ? I don't think it would result in 'shiny metal' .... but if you dismantled and soaked in it - yes I agree.

 

[TwoFish]

Personally I dont understand why people soak heat exchanger tube stacks in various acids so they are gleaming new looking when they reassemble it.

The dull patina on the metal is protecting it from ordinary corrosion and electolisis corrosion.

Its well known that with Beta tube stacks if you clean it to bright and shiny your anode in the heat exchanger will dissapear quicker than usual.

Im no expert but it seems sensible to me to clean it but dont do anything to remove the dull surface patina.

So I'm new to this and thus 'treading lightly' given the (very welcome) expertise of others here, but:

My reason for 15 mins in an acid bath was not to have the shiniest tube stack in Christendom, but to help get rid of large amounts of scale that risked stopping the tube stack (and end cap ports, and a few other bits) from doing their job. The stuff fizzed and foamed away like a dying alien on Doctor Who and the scale fell away. I do accept that I may lose a £10 engine anode a little faster as a result. However I'd much prefer that to losing engine power due to overheating, or perhaps damaging the tube stack by cleaning it only by bashing, whacking, scraping, drilling or other mechanical means.