Chichester Marina hazard to navigation warning

[Wavey]

Firmly tongue in cheek but when you've mastered navigating the non tidal Thames when the dinghy sailors are racing then anything down on the Solent is a doddle Especially when the dinghies treat you like one of their course markers

 

[Fantasie 19]

Ahem. Because it's inconsiderate, that's why.
ProDave didn't say it isn't fun, he said it's inconsiderate, and I wholeheartedly agree.

Mind, if you re-read my post #6, you'll see that I was the first to say that I would have overtaken the sailboats on the stbd side of the channel, right after they came about to their stbd tack.

But suggesting that they were right in doing what they were doing because it's fun is as inconsiderate as actually doing that, imho. :ambivalence:

So the first time I arrive in a narrow channel and my outboard doesn't start, and I haven't practised it, or honed the skill.... am I still being inconsiderate? I'd call it good seamanship, but clearly there are a lot of polarised opinions on whether it is inconsiderate or not... best probably to agree to disagree?

 

[Blue Sunray]

So the first time I arrive in a narrow channel and my outboard doesn't start, and I haven't practised it, or honed the skill.... am I still being inconsiderate? I'd call it good seamanship, but clearly there are a lot of polarised opinions on whether it is inconsiderate or not... best probably to agree to disagree?

It is of course quite possible to practice such a manoeuvre not actually in a narrow channel. Though IMHO the yachts in this clip were not actually much of an obstruction and with care and timing could have been passed with ease.

I was rather saddened to be abused in that exact stretch of water in April this year by the crew of a X-boat as they overtook me (I was in a motor cruiser at minimum revs which given the traffic was what I considered a safe speed) for not getting out of their way. Not least as I have a certain sentimental attachment to that fleet from the dim and distant past and I expected better.

 

[MapisM]

It is of course quite possible to practice such a manoeuvre not actually in a narrow channel.

Positively +1.
I learned many years ago from the pilot of a busy harbour (and former navy officer) that the first thing to do when helming any boat for the first time is practicing her reactions in open, unobstructed waters.
If it weren't for his suggestion, I'd have probably crashed my current boat the very first time I reversed in her berth.
But since F 19 suggested to agree to disagree, who am I to argue...? :encouragement:

 

[DAKA]

The most surprising action in my opinion was that both raggies decided to tack in front of the stinker when it would have been much easier to sail straighter for longer and utilise the open water immediately adjacent to the fairway.
There wasn't any boats on the moorings at the side of the fairway, there was no need for either raggie to tack.
The raggies were in charter boats apparently deliberately attempting to cause a collision.

 

[Blue Sunray]

The most surprising action in my opinion was that both raggies decided to tack in front of the stinker when it would have been much easier to sail straighter for longer and utilise the open water immediately adjacent to the fairway.
There wasn't any boats on the moorings at the side of the fairway, there was no need for either raggie to tack.
The raggies were in charter boats apparently deliberately attempting to cause a collision.

Before a raggie jumps in might I just say that is utter bollocks. No wonder some of them have a thing about ignorant mobos.

 

[Seahope]

I used to hate going down narrow channels like that. The one at the entrance to Port Solent is even narrower so all sail boats had to be under power. The problem I had was that engines on tick over still resulted in about 6 knots. I never considered over taking in the channel so often had to go into neutral to follow the slower boats. The problem is the boat then lost steerage and risked being blown onto something nasty .

 

[MapisM]

Before a raggie jumps in might I just say that is utter bollocks.

Again +1.

I just looked at the video again to double ckeck.
Daka, those folks indeed did not DECIDE to tack, they HAD to.
Besides, but from your viewpoint, it was very easy to predict that.
Bottom line: you can definitely blame them for not going under power, but since they didn't, you can't blame them for tacking at the channel border.
All imho, and based on a very limited sailboats experience.

 

[l'escargot]

...The raggies were in charter boats apparently deliberately attempting to cause a collision.

I'd be surprised if they were Pete, no life rafts apparent which you would wxpect on coded boats and the second one has 3 burgees on the port spreader and is towing a dinghy, neither of which would be usual on a charter. Anyway, why would they want to deliberately collide - it would wreck their credit card and to what benefit? If they wanted a collision it could have been achieved very easily...

 

[superheat6k]

To save you time

Narrow channels.

(a) A vessel proceeding along the course of a narrow channel or fairway shall keep as near to the outer limit or the channel or fairway which lies on her starboard side as is safe and practicable.

(b) A vessel of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway.

(c) A vessel engaged in fishing shall not impede the passage of any other vessel navigating within a narrow channel or fairway.

(d) A vessel shall not cross a narrow channel of fairway if such crossing impedes the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within such channel or fairway. The latter vessel may use the sound signal prescribed in Rule 34 (d) if in doubt as to the intention of the crossing vessel.

And your point is ?

This was an impatient Mobo driver. The yacht is perfectly entitled to sail his vessel, and the Mobo's obligation was to keep clear - of a vessel under sail, and one he is overtaking, not hassle his way past, which is what he did.

 

[rafiki_]

And your point is ?

This was an impatient Mobo driver. The yacht is perfectly entitled to sail his vessel, and the Mobo's obligation was to keep clear - of a vessel under sail, and one he is overtaking, not hassle his way past, which is what he did.

+ another 1

 

[Steve Clayton]

And your point is ?

This was an impatient Mobo driver. The yacht is perfectly entitled to sail his vessel, and the Mobo's obligation was to keep clear - of a vessel under sail, and one he is overtaking, not hassle his way past, which is what he did.

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

 

[jmcc500]

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

Isn't the key bit "hamper a safe passage", not hamper a fast passage. Would be fine if mobo slowed to their pace and/or passed behind after tack.

 

[NealB]

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

The sailing boats were not, in any way, hampering the safe passage of the power boat.

The power boat skipper's behaviour is cringe-making (I speak as someone with feet in both 'camps').

 

[RichardS]

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

I humbly suggest that Daka's preferred choice of breakfast cereal is more relevant than this. :encouragement:

Richard

 

[Nigelb]

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

Steve, you are quoting collision regulations without any understanding of their correct application. Just because a vessel has an engine installed, does not mean it is a power driven vessel. Look at the exhaust port, the yacht is so confident of his ability to maintain steerage that he is not running his engine (even in idle) so point one is false.

Secondly I don't believe either vessel is hampering traffic in the channel, the overtaking vessel could pass with ease and if he had kept to Stbd to anticipate the tack then he would not have spilled his G&T.

Honestly, what is all the fuss about, do you really believe the skipper should be motoring because to do otherwise is inconsiderate to other river users, fascinating insight to other people's perspective.

 

[Blue Sunray]

The sailing boats were not, in any way, hampering the safe passage of the power boat.

The power boat skipper's behaviour is cringe-making (I speak as someone with feet in both 'camps').

+1

I humbly suggest that Daka's preferred choice of breakfast cereal is more relevant than this. :encouragement:

Richard

:encouragement:

 

[dom]

A mobo with half decent throttle control and a modicum of spacial awareness would have crept up the stbd side of the channel, waited behind the sailboat and then gently accelerated past as he tacked ...basic seamanship and no fancy collregs required.

Then again this is Chichester, an area where one vaselines one's eyes, puts in a mouthguard and has the missus spray water in your face as you enter. Mobos are the lowest form of life here, followed by those somewhat bloated yachties in the vid, then the small racers. At the top of the foodchain are the older X Boats and boy do these guys aggressively exercise their rights over all

What we are witnessing in the vid is two mid-status rutting bulls having a pop at each other, all perfectly normal in a day at the Itchenor zoo

 

[superheat6k]

Sorry, you are wrong. Chi Harbour rules and regs prevail.
(a) Every vessel under power, whether under sail or not, is considered to be a power-driven
vessel.
(b) Although generally power gives way to sail, a sailing vessel has no right to hamper in a
narrow channel the safe passage of a power-
driven vessel which can navigate only inside
such a channel.

And the safe navigation of a power boat includes his ability to travel very slowly or stop in the water if necessary, and not just barge his way through which is what he did.

Your second statement is ludicrous - what was the raggie meant to do - hover ?

The video clearly shows the driver had no clue about the restrictions faced by a sailing boat in such circumstances. Just a bully with a horn.

 

[Blue Sunray]

And the safe navigation of a power boat includes his ability to travel very slowly or stop in the water if necessary, and not just barge his way through which is what he did.

Your second statement is ludicrous - what was the raggie meant to do - hover ?

The video clearly shows the driver had no clue about the restrictions faced by a sailing boat in such circumstances. Just a bully with a horn.

Bully is probably a bit strong (though I sure that's how he seemed to the raggies at the time, particularly wrt the horn), ignorant and a poor seaman certainly though.