Charterers beware

[Magaz97]

I've just come back today from 3 weeks in the BVI and the only cats that went over in that time were a bunch of Hobies that are going island to island.

Your point is what?

 

[RupertW]

RupertW's wife is a large lady. She was a Russian shotputter in the 1970's but he picked up cheap after her athletic career was over.

Polish champion swimmer so you are surprisingly close and her recent diet may even get her back to her 1980s proportions, not that I dare make any comment.

She was never willing to steer the boat in close quarters before that holiday but changed her mind, so for the last 10 years she's been doing a lot more mooring and parking than me. My place is now firmly on the foredeck.

 

[jimi]

Polish champion swimmer so you are surprisingly close and her recent diet may even get her back to her 1980s proportions, not that I dare make any comment.

She was never willing to steer the boat in close quarters before that holiday but changed her mind, so for the last 10 years she's been doing a lot more mooring and parking than me. My place is now firmly on the foredeck.

Jings ;-)


Swmbo always does the driving when anchoring or picking up a buoy but gets nervous near other craft.

 

[Jeannius]

Your point is what?

The previous poster seemed to be implying that they were chartered cruising cats. They weren't, they were beach cats. Just setting the record straight.

 

[Whiskey Bravo]

The previous poster seemed to be implying that they were chartered cruising cats. They weren't, they were beach cats. Just setting the record straight.

I don't think I did, although the radio messages re the 3 people overboard, 1 still missing several hours later, certainly sounded like something bigger than a Hobie. [This was during the last week in January].

The point I was trying to make is that in the prevailing conditions I would want to know my lifejacket was servicable and I stand by that, whatever the size of yacht in question.

 

[DownWest]

The LJs were non-compliant? To what? He didn't say they didn't work.

 

[cgull]

Sounds like a good case to stick with Sunsail or Moorings, at least a measurable standard is offered.

 

[snowleopard]

The LJs were non-compliant? To what? He didn't say they didn't work.

Automatic lifejackets have dates on them. In UK waters a charter company who supplied out-of-date jackets would lose its coding very smartly. In the Caribbean regulations are less rigorously enforced, if at all. You only find out whether they work when your life depends on it!

 

[snowleopard]

RupertW's wife is a large lady. She was a Russian shotputter in the 1970's but he picked up cheap after her athletic career was over.

Ooooh! I remember someone being banned for saying something very similar to that a few years back! (actually he didn't say it, it was a troll who hacked his account but he still spent a long time in the sin bin)

 

[jimi]

Ooooh! I remember someone being banned for saying something very similar to that a few years back! (actually he didn't say it, it was a troll who hacked his account but he still spent a long time in the sin bin)

If i remember correctly, that very unsavoury incident bore absolutely no resemblance to what I just said either in content or motive, and I rather suspect you know that very well.

 

[RobF]

For others in a similar situation, put the deposit for your charter on your credit card. If the charter company deduct money, you can assert that it was paid under duress and ask your credit card company to claim it back for you.

 

[webcraft]

If i remember correctly, that very unsavoury incident bore absolutely no resemblance to what I just said either in content or motive, and I rather suspect you know that very well.

I don't think you should call people unsavoury bores

- W

 

[snowleopard]

If i remember correctly, that very unsavoury incident bore absolutely no resemblance to what I just said either in content or motive, and I rather suspect you know that very well.

There were a couple of elements in common though. Will now remove tongue from cheek.

 

[Steelfish]

.. but why should chartering be such a lottery. Sounds like someone should set up a charter equivalent of Tripadvisor.com.

I'm really sorry the OPs had such a bad time. The Dufour 40 is a fantastic boat.

Ok, I am a bit biased.

***

Glad you asked! - check out YachtCharterAdvisor.com (YCA). I heard about VPM Bestsail when Mrs. B wrote a review at YCA. I don't have the budget that Tripadvisor does but I do what I can. I'm a charter sailor who has set out to try and measure the customer satisfaction of the charter industry and help others steer clear of charter professionals with questionable reputations.

 

[Steelfish]

Nope, but I'd like to hear the other side of the story before rushing to judgement

I'm with Jimi here to a certain extent. The service sounds terrible and the deposit withholding too. But I wouldn't see fire extinguishers and non-compliant lifejackets as much of an issue for a week or two in such lovely benign and busy waters. Anything chartered for 7 years will be scruffy as it will have had more use than 30 year old owners boat, and GPS in the Caribbean is a distraction at best so not really an issue.

I would have been highly irritated at the anchor windlass and engine though as those are real holiday wreckers. When both those things went wrong when I chartered a few years ago my poor wife had to haul up the anchor 5 times in one bay as I tried to find the best spot.

I detect the attitudes of charter professionals here.

For everyone else, it's quite cavalier to suggest that fire extinguishers and questionable life jackets are ok for some waters or durations at sea. I'm a charter sailor, former USN submarine sailor and commercial salvage diver - safety is always king and a personal responsibility. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise or send you out with questionable safety gear.

 

[Steelfish]

Thanks for your message of support. It so frustrating when I dont speak either French or German. [They seem to be a company split between two countries]
Has anyone else had problems with poor service from European charter companies?

Giles - thanks for sharing your experience. Respectfully, you can take some responsibility for not fully vetting the charter broker, company and vessel before booking, it can be difficult but well worth the peace of mind. Ask for recent client references and photos of the actual boat, *carefully* read the T&C's and negotiate contracted services over price (decent charter is a good holiday value). As the founder of Yacht Charter Advisor (.com) and common sailor (not a charter professional) I'm happy to help you with this in the future - no cost of course.

Here's more tips on how to protect your holiday charter investment.

As for European charter companies with questionable reputations, since you asked, have a look at my caught in the act article. Due to their online reputation destroyed by former clients (with a little help from YCA) Chandler Yacht Charters Greece renamed their business to Exclusive Yacht Charters Greece - Caveat venditor (seller beware!). At the YCA site we also brag about high performing European charter professionals.

To be fair, my research into the charter industry since 2007 shows 80% of charter professionals deliver satisfactory service and set proper expectations. A select few ~5% deliver exceptional service and boat quality for a similar price. The highest performing charter company I've personally done business with is San Juan sailing in the U.S. Pacific Northwest - truly awesome service and vessels in magnificent sailing grounds.

Cheers!

 

[Steelfish]

Personally I find it suspicious however genuine it is when the very first post from someone is used to blacken the name of a business. The same report from an established poster is a different matter entirely. I mistrust things like Trip Advisor and sites which review things the same way, simply because happy campers rarely vote but unhappy bunnies always do, the resulting picture presented is therefore somewhat biased. I feel sorry for companies that can be caught by this trial by internet, but then realise that genuine complaints do arise and it is useful to hear of them, Catch 22.

The comment makes mention of a great number of issues, but then mentions non-compliant lifejackets and fire extinguishers as being the most important, to me that seems worthy of note yes but super important not. We had a windlass problem on our last 41ft boat one year and had to pull it up by hand, bummer yes but sometimes things do go wrong on boats and you have to deal with it. Likewise an engine problem two days from finishing a 6 week charter is a bummer, but the person in charge is the skipper and things like this are not predictable, exactly what was the problem? What too was the 'spurious' reason for withholding 50% of the deposit? I'm not saying it was justified at all, just that without the reason given we cannot make reasonable judgement.

All the above regardless I trust it didn't spoil the honeymoon too much and that there are some more pleasant memories to recall.

A very astute observation about "first posters", I've been working to understand this online social phenomenon since 2007 when I started YachtCharterAdvisor.com(YCA). The short answer is YES, 60%+ of first posters who write reviews write negative reviews. The jury is still out on the authenticity of these reviews, this requires that each review must be vetted by an independent researcher (like I do at YCA) with policies to accommodate new findings and decay of old data. Just because it's negative doesn't mean it's not authentic. In my experience it's the positive reviews you have to watch out for, (charter) professionals are known to write false positive reviews about themselves.

I'm not convinced that an "established poster" should be given more trust than anyone else though, certainly if you know the poster (family or friend) studies indicate more trust is afforded, not to say it's warranted (I have a dizzying intellect). At Yelp.com they get hundreds of daily reviews on coffee shops and car washes (etc.) and do apply a filter that prevents publication of lesser known posters; positive or negative. I believe they do this because they can't possibly research each review like we do at YCA.

Bottom line - if you have an authentic charter review to share come on over and share it at YCA. Your honest 'perception' of the service delivered and boat quality is what's asked for - you can't be wrong about this. YCA believes charter pros are responsible for setting and meeting expectations, charter sailors are responsible for taking those expectations and making the experience safe and enjoyable.

 

[ridgy]

Seems to me that Mr Giles and Mr SteelFish are likely to be the same person.

 

[penfold]

Seems to me that Mr Giles and Mr SteelFish are likely to be the same person.

I don't know about that, but a cynic might say Steelfish is a naughty spammer trying to drum up trade for YAC.com or whatever it is.

 

[A1Sailor]

Mr Steelfish,
Why the sudden interest in the thread after a gap of 8 months? Did you come across it by accident, and resurrect it for the public benefit? If so, very good of you.

A1