Catamarans: is it really sailing?

\"serious cruising\"

hm, "serious cruising" sounds um serious.

Long-term cruising means sailing perhaps one day a week. So six days a week at anchor. For me, that means a cat.

I think you can tell how you prefer your boating when there's a fortnight or more: if you find you stay longer and longer at anchor and do less and less, then a cat makes more sense. If you find that with a bigger crew you go sailing every day then probly a mono.

I don't like sailing long passages so much that i would choose (say) a mono for seven or eight days over a cat for five.

Also the most skilful aspect of my sailing is hanging about waiting for nicer weather, and I have to say i am rather world class at hm perhaps we'll give it till Wednesday. No, i meant wednesday next week ...
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

Well, admittedly it was a bit tongue in cheek.

On our 6 month east coast jaunt the longest we stayed in one place was 6 days (Block Island, 'cos it was so entertaining). Typically we would stay 1-3 nights and move on, nearly always day-sailing, usually 8-10 hour trips. Oh, forgot, 2 weeks in Maine but took the ferry to Canada during that time. Anyway, this seemed to fit nicely between weather systems, certainly later in the season. Now, if we had been able to spend that six months in, say, Florida and the Bahamas instead, with occ. jaunt to BVI etc etc then yes, cat fantastic. But, um, we're thinking what about bringing said boat back to UK/Europe? Bad enough marina police wandering around tape in hand measuring how far your davits overhang to the nearest angstrom, what about getting charged double just cos you like to own a boat with L/B ratio of an oil rig??

See, if I was a retired millionaire with a base in the BVI's or Bahamas or sumfink yes I'd definitely have a cat and keep it down there, preferably with paid deck fluff to keep it all buffed up and shiny. But, since I have to keep working, I'd rather move the boat closer to hand which sadly means a) on the delightful Severn estuary (err...) or b) down on the SW coast somewhere, where marina prices are inversely proportional to sunshine hours.

In the end I can handle all the sailing and living pros-cons but what about the classic multihull chestnuts: a) how likely is it to tip over? and b) what do you do if it tips over? and c) are you likely to be charged 1.5 or 2x the marina fees per foot compared to mono's?

Anyway, tcm, what are you thinking of buying? Will you keep it over there? Are you a retiring millionaire and I didn't know it?? And will you be hiring deck fluff?
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

[ QUOTE ]
if I was a retired millionaire with a base in the BVI's or Bahamas or sumfink yes I'd definitely have a cat and keep it down there, preferably with paid deck fluff to keep it all buffed up and shiny.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh I see.... so really you are an aspiring Cat owner but don't have the wherewith all to own one just yet...

Take it from me it's great fun... and the deck fluff is a must! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif


Just don't let her know I posted this or I'll be keel hauled!

253134690_5baa03c8ea.jpg
 
Interesting post. As owners of a small cruising cat (Heavenly Twins 27) we love the space, relatively easier motion and the fact that with young kids they can move about safely when we are under way. I find it harder to sail than all the monohulls I've owned before. there is more intuitive feedback from the heeling on a monohull; with the cat if we want to make a fast passage we have to concentrate the whole time. Marina's with our current engine set up are a slightly nerve wracking event, but we will cure that with twin engines - nothing motors or manoeuvres as well as a twin engined cat, with a prop in-front of each rudder, you should see one turning with one engine in forward and the other in reverse, they just pivot on the spot! It's horses for courses but my family can't spend enough time on board now we have a cat, before this I had to persuade them.
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

I think most of the arguments for and against have been aired and I agree with all of them - it's a matter of balancing virtues and vices and making your own choice. There are certainly things I miss about mono sailing and going round the show I got a bit misty eyed on the Sunbeam 34 and positively weepy on the Discovery 55. I look forward to sailing the new Najad 35 when it arrives at the end of the year.

But I still felt I had come back to my spiritual home when I boarded the new Fountaine Pajot Mahe 36 which deserves to be a very successful first boat for families making the cross-over.

As far as safety is concerned the question of capsize really isn't an issue in modern cruising cats - yes it can happen if you are idiot enough to keep full sail up in 40 knots of wind, but a Prout or a Lagoon is more likely to lose its rig first. Even so, in the wrong conditions of wind and waves any cat can turn over just as any mono can have a 360 and sink or lose its keel and sink, or get overwhelmed and sink or get holed and sink. Most cats are more or less unsinkable so even if you do go over you have a built in liferaft with access to survival kit.

A boat like my Dazcat is a little more likely to go over so good reefing discipline and attentive watch keeping in marginal conditions is important.

If you do go over the outcome depends to an extent where you are. Close to a harbour you will probably be able to get someone to either tow you in and right you or even, if you are lucky in getting help from someone who knows how to do it, be righted at sea. In either case you will probably, but not absulutely necessarily, lose your rig and the boat will be more or less uninhabitable until it has been sorted. Internal damage will be considerable. Well offshore you have little option but to abandon the boat. You should really scuttle her but this can prove very difficult with cats - they will float even when broken into quite small pieces.

Marinas will almost certainly charge at least 1.5 times although some charge only once - Plymouth Yacht Haven, I believe, for one, Sovereign Harbour at Eastborne for another (but please don't take this as gospel). Up the Tamar there are many cats on moorings which are as cheap as for monohulls. We pay £250, but there is now a waiting list.
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

Poser /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

And you jolly well deserve to be keel hauled for posting without the necessary approvals tsk tsk

Where is that by the way?

Now hang on, I thought all CE approved boats had to have hatches that opened hinge for'ard, as a clever piece of market differentiation from non-Euro boats which open hinge astern. So where does that put your cat, hmmm, hmmm??? In your photo I can see hatches akimbo, hinges flung to all points of the compass. How does that work? Is it designed to flood the accommodation no matter which way the seas are being taken? Or is it just to show off to mono owners that even full of water the thing will still float, so we just don't care? /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
 
You cant compare a catalac 9m with a modern cruising cat - chalk and cheese! If you needed the wind behind the beam to get her sailing there was something wrong with your rig - However close hauled they do not do. I reckon about 45 deg to the apparent in reasonable seas, increasing to 50 degrees if short heavy seas. when using the genoa, much better with the jib.
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

[ QUOTE ]
the new Fountaine Pajot Mahe 36 which deserves to be a very successful first boat for families making the cross-over.

[/ QUOTE ] A £110,00 36 footer as a first cat? Is everyone else rich or am I just poor?
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

Crikey, how embarrassing - Dartmouth, and I didn't even recognise it. Been about 18 years since I was there but it can't have changed that much. Maybe I'm distracted by the deck fluff.

CE stuff came in, err, 1997 I think, so I guess any boat older than that is ok. Actually, I've only looked into it for mono's, to see how dreadfully complicated and expensive it would be to bring a boat back from the US. I don't know how it affects cats - I should think the stability caclulations are a bit different /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

Blimey, James, it's taken me ages to digest all that. So, upshot is, probably less likely to flip over than to have a rollover in a mono, and if you do you'll get stuck but won't sink. But you will need outside assistance, whereas a mono, provided it doesn't sink, might be able to sail on, provided it had a rig or part thereof, or if it's engine started.

We watched some big cruising cats on moorings when we stopped at Newport RI and when the breeze kicked up they yawed around a lot, more so than the monos, except for perhaps the (US) Hunters, which seem to seesaw more than any other boat I've ever seen (just an observation). Is this your experience? I guess it's due to relatively high, slab sides meaning fair windage and not much underwater to dampen down any surface skating around. Not sure it's important, just something we all noticed sitting in the cockpit one night. Given we generally avoid marinas as much as possible when cruising the extra costs of a cat are perhaps less significant but it's when you get back to earth with a bump to work and have to keep her somewhere it comes as a shock - a permanent mooring in a sheltered spot would do fine but I'm finding even that is difficult on the Devon estuaries.

Anyway, I think I may be coming down with something. I've spent all afternoon on the Broadblue and Fountaine Pajot websites and I'm about to go look at Lagoons. I think a good stiff drink will cure me of it but for the time being I'll just have to sweat my way through it /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

My experience is that if I use a bridle when on anchor or hanging on a buoy my catamaran is quite stable.
You wrote about lack of feeling of sailing in a catamaran so maybe after Lagoon pages you could, together with that strong medicine in your glass, check the Outremer pages as well. You might find that they give a little more on the sailing side.
 
Re: \"serious cruising\"

I'm a bit of a Lagoon fan and have found that they give very satisfactory speed and a decent bit of "feel" to the steering once they get moving. A lot better than other cruising cats I've sailed so far.

Haven't tried the Outremer though, and I suspect the Dazcat isn't the kind of load-carrier I'd ideally like for a long cruise, but I bet it's a blast to sail.
 
Re: lagoon fan

I have to admit I quite like the look of the Lagoons too. Saw a lot of them in the US but never got on one. Don't know about the practicality of them for long term use vs, say, the Broadblue which seems to be solidly built for long term cruising. Pity there weren't any at LIBS I would have liked to look in one. They have a diesel-electric hybrid one as well, which is neat.

Looked at the Outremer website - they look like quite a different animal, definitely not yer average charter cat.

What is the "pecking order" in the cat world? Which makes are the BenJenBavs, which are the RassyMaloNajads and which are the, er, well, Oysters I suppose?
 
It really goes against the grain to roll up some sail to point higher, but I have been playing with this and had some successful results. Taking in a 3rd of my 145% genny in lighter winds does seem to help out a lot.

We have an almost new 20 year old jib on board, I intend to have a play with it this year. The biggest problem, even with all the deck space it is still a pain to take down the big genoa and pack it away before throwing up the jib. I wish I had twin forestays, now there's a thought??
 
The differences between different cats, and between different monos, are far more significant than the differences between cats in general and monos in general.

Thus, if you want feel and performance you might choose a mono J boat or cat Dazcat 10, but if it's lazy comfort, a Westerly or Heavenly Twins.

Of course, if you're rich, you can buy a 45ft cat or mono with both feel and comfort!

Tony MS
 
I have several times thought about a temp forestay for a going to windward sail/stormsail, and of course to enable a second genoa to be rigged for going downhill that bit quicker.
 
Spent a fair bit of this past summer skippering a Lagoon for a charter company. Lovely yacht, until you hit a seaway. Then who says you don't get wet! And reefing by numbers! If you don't reef at a specific wind speed, danger of flipping becomes serious, because you get little feedback from the yacht until she starts going, and then its difficult to stop.

Things I liked: Agree about the good night's sleep. Anchor to bridle is stable, and she does sit kindly when still, turns on a sixpence with twin engines, all-round vision from the saloon - particularly enjoyed this whilst crew was up top steering in a wet, dark night.

Things I disliked: Lack of feedback on wind speed, very exposed helm position (little to stop you if you fall backwards and to port), a patio door that either stays locked shut from the cockpit or risks taking your arm off in a seaway, horrid corkscrew motion close to the wind, foresail travellers too far inboard so getting the best from the foresail difficult, and the rather odd and uncomfortable circular 'bench' seat in the cabin, which makes it difficult to use for the odd crew member wanting to sleep off watch at night.

She was a fantastic 'warm water' yacht, but a horrid one for the kind of weather we sometimes get in UK waters.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Other threads that may be of interest

capnsensible
Worlds toughest row. Atlandic Edition.
2
Replies
27
Views
657
ridgy
R
R
Brokers.
Replies
6
Views
475
Irish Rover
Irish Rover
zoidberg
'This month's hot boating topic....'
2 3
Replies
42
Views
1K
tjbrace
tjbrace

Share this page

Top