Buying advice please

[brissle]

My son, who lives in New Zealand is coming to Europe with his wife at the end of March for 10 months and is asking my advice about buying a sailing boat which they intend to take across the channel and down through the european waterways to the Med where they will sail for several months before returning to the UK via the Canal du Midi.
He is asking my advice on the best places to look for buying a suitable boat - he has specified a 25' - 30' sloop with twin keel and having had a recent survey (presumably to give an indication of condition).
He has not specified a budget but I'm guessing around £10K max.
He's very practical, so minor work needing to be done would not be an issue, but of course his time is limited.
We are based in Bristol but he will travel reasonable distances to buy.
I'm assuming he will be looking to sell on at the end of his stay in Europe - that makes me nervous when I read about it being a "buyers market" at present.
I would be very grateful for any advice on how to start this process - I am not a sailor and am struggling.

 

[gjgm]

Cripes, that sounds ambitious.Maybe ambitious is too gentle a word!
If you dont get a response, try the Yachting forum...

 

[brissle]

For a guy who travelled to NZ solo by motorbike across Europe and Asia this is a doddle. Three years ago he took a year out to ride his bike all around the coast of South America. He's a firefighter and member of Urban Search and Rescue in Christchurch (shaky city) so he has to be tough.

 

[prv]

Cripes, that sounds ambitious.Maybe ambitious is too gentle a word!

Not sure why you say ambitious - presumably the son and daughter-in-law are sailors although the father is not.

Unless you meant ambitious to complete both a purchase and a sale quickly enough to have a worthwhile time sailing it in between? Purchase needn't take long, there are plenty of boats out there. Sale might be more of a problem (how long do you leave between getting back to UK to put it on the market and the planned date of departure back to NZ?) but allowing for a suitable price drop ought to attract a buyer. Any reasonable price drop for quick sale is still going to be a hell of a lot less than chartering for 9 months - presumably exactly the reason for the plan.

Pete

 

[brissle]

Yes both are sailors and have recently completed a top-up skippering course. I am not a sailor.
I imagine they will return to NZ in March 2013. Yes they did consider chartering and quickly ruled that out. My (innocent) suggestion was to get a deal like poeple do with campervans in the USA - buy with a guaranteed buy-back price (subject to condition).
But I guess that rules out a private purchase. And may not be possible for a boat.
thanks
Chris

 

[alahol2]

I would be very grateful for any advice on how to start this process - I am not a sailor and am struggling.

The place to start is probably with the local brokers. You can search online for both brokers and boats (eg Boatshed).
The more information you can get from your son about what he is looking for the better chance you have of narrowing the choice.

 

[Tranona]

There are plenty of boats on the market that would fit that set of criteria. The "benchmark" (in that they are the most numerous with around 2500 built) is the Westerly Centaur where there are usually 40 or so for sale at any one time at +/-£10k. You can see a good selection of boats for sale by getting on www.yachtworld.com and using the advanced search engine. Don't limit to bilge keels as most boats of this size are shallow enough draft to do the canals - and bilge keels can be at a disadvantage, limiting the ability to get near the canal banks, particularly in the Canal du Midi.

The biggest problem with buying a boat of this type/age is condition. Most will be over 40 years old and many would not be capable of doing the trip without work/expense. However, it is possible to get well kept examples and one that has a modern replacement engine is a must. At a guess probably half the boats for sail will have had their engines replaced.

Probably as important as choosing and buying the boat is understanding what is involved. what sounds straightforward is in fact a major undertaking which most people plan for years before undertaking. To achieve any meaningful sailing in the Med, particularly if you want to "do" the more interesting (and cheaper) eastern Med and return to UK is a minimum of 2 years - and that would be on the move most of the time. There is masses of information about the subject - books, magazines, blogs, websites. A scroll down the Liveabord forum will give plenty of leads.

The 10 months your son has available is simply not long enough to buy and prepare a boat and undertake any meaningful trip. It is not a year round activity and if everything went well starting in March he might get away by end May which gives enough time to get to the South of France by the end of the season. Even in the Med most activity ceases end October. If they want to sail in the Med, it might be better to blow the dosh on a month's charter in say the Greek islands.

 

[Zorro]

One boat fits the bill perfectly, it was my first boat and is still my favourite, you can buy these today for around £8,000 and would sail down Biscay no problem if they just wanted to do the canals one way.
The best sailing boat ever built, the sadler 25

 

[ostell]

Has he thought of the certificates that he will need to enter the canals?

 

[brissle]

Has he thought of the certificates that he will need to enter the canals?

Thank you for this thought - have passed that on.
And thanks for other ideas / suggestioins - will do some research later today
Chris

 

[Spyro]

a lot of brokers wont have boats below or around £10K. Try online sites like
http://www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk/
http://www.apolloduck.co.uk/
If he has £10k to spend do be too offput by adverts above £10k as there is usually room for negotiation.
As others say to get a good reliable boat with decent sails and engine for trip like that on that budget might be a bit ambitious.
Might be better just to head out to the Med and buy something there.
If he is only keeping the boat for a short time he is really only paying for the loss (or gain) that he might make on the sale at the end of the time so if he could stretch himself further he might get a better boat but the loss/gain might be the same when he comes to sell.

 

[brissle]

Unexpected health problem delayed my further research, but my son has been following up the excellent advice offered earlier, for which he says thank you.

He tells me that he has short-listed 2 boats to consider when he arrives in the UK at end March - a Colvic Watson - 26' - 29' or a Westerley Centaur.
If anyone knows of either of these models for sale in South Coast (UK) area we would be interested to hear. He and his wife will be spending a week, mid April, in Portland (Weymouth) on a theory and practical course to bring him up to date with UK and european sailing practices.

He's after a boat in reasonable condition, good engine, decent sails, equiped for living on board (e.g. H&C water, cooker, fridge, diesel heater)
His budget is around £10K.

Neither of these boats have come up on the links suggested earlier and Google isn't much help. Next process is just to plod through website for every yard I can find. Unless anyone knows better....?

Thanks again.
Chris

 

[alahol2]

A few Centaurs here.

 

[brissle]

Thanks - yes several good leads there - have passed on the link to my son