Broom as a live aboard/solo cruising boat

[Shifty]

I think it is valid to point out what can be the reality of living aboard a boat and that it isn’t necessarily all a bed of roses, particularly in the U.K., but it is also important to acknowledge that we are all different and one person’s cabin fever is another’s tranquility.

Personally, whilst I love our boat I would not want to live aboard all year round, particularly during a U.K. winter, but I think I could certainly spend several months aboard during the spring/summer/early autumn.
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Agreed it is a valid point, but we are all different, we have an extremely comfy house on the IOW but chose to spend 10 days on the boat over Christmas, it was bliss, warm and proper home from home, we also went to Holland for two months last summer and cabin fever never set in.
As previously mentioned maybe post on the livaboard forum for some further knowledge.

 

[Dino]

@ingenious I have a Broom Ocean 38 and I regularly singlehanded it. I had a Crown before that and also a Continental. If you plan your mooring by getting ropes and fenders ready, you’ll be fine. You’ll definitely need a bowthruster and a remote control is also very handy.
Be careful with the 37, 39 and 41. These were part of the Offshore range and draw 4ft 3in. In my opinion p, that is too deep for many inland areas but especially canals.

 

[DWT]

Bequia, the 38 mentioned earlier, has a folding arch on hydraulics so lowers on the touch of a button, ideal for getting under bridges on the upper Thames

 

[PaulRainbow]

My partner and i live aboard our Princess 45 full time, in the UK. We have an all electric galley, small dinette, 2 electric head with showers, large cockpit etc. Winter isn't a problem, we have blown air diesel heating and that can heat the boat to a higher temperature than we want, even when it's been sub zero outside. We love living aboard.

 

[ingenious]

Just be clear to yourself ( forget us ) about why you want to do this and consider the practicalities

Thanks for this but nothing that I haven't already considered.
The aim is to be able to travel about Europe without living in a suitcase/living in airports as I have done. I'm not saying I will live 8 months a year all the time and won't be doing it in one stretch. I won't be living on it in winter in Northern Europe.
And before anybody mentions the whole Brexit embuggerances, I have a Dutch passport courtesy of my mother and will work around the 18 month thing.

 

[ingenious]

Bequia, the 38 mentioned earlier, has a folding arch on hydraulics so lowers on the touch of a button, ideal for getting under bridges on the upper Thames

Yeah, I've had that confirmed by the seller, takes it to 3.2m

 

[ingenious]

Be careful with the 37, 39 and 41. These were part of the Offshore range and draw 4ft 3in.

Yes, I just noticed that for the 37. Looking more and more that the 36 is the best option but I'll look at 36 and 38

 

[Tranona]

Thanks for this but nothing that I haven't already considered.
The aim is to be able to travel about Europe without living in a suitcase/living in airports as I have done. I'm not saying I will live 8 months a year all the time and won't be doing it in one stretch. I won't be living on it in winter in Northern Europe.
And before anybody mentions the whole Brexit embuggerances, I have a Dutch passport courtesy of my mother and will work around the 18 month thing.

If that is the plan, then maybe better to buy a boat more suited to that type of use, such as the many single engined displacement boats built in Holland. I appreciate the attractions of the Broom and other twin screw semi displacement and planing boats but they really are not practical for long term use in inland waterways. Why have 2 huge engines that you don't need? Travelling around the canals as you suggest you might probably means running 500 hours a year or more - not what those boats and engines are designed for. I know people do it but that is usually because they go with the boat they have and accept the compromises. However if you are starting from scratch and buying a boat for a specific type of use then maybe look at boats that are designed for that type of use.

 

[Flynnbarr]

Take a step back.

You are an inexperienced boater. Why do you want to live on a boat for 8 months of the year?

The boat you are looking at is small. Why do you want to live in such a small space?

Boats have nil insulation. Keeping them warm in winter is difficult / expensive.

You will need practical things like a washing machine.

I spend 3 months a year on mine in the med . I have been boating for decades. My boat is a lot bigger than the one you are looking at. I am handy and can fix pretty much anything.

Boating is a leisure activity. Would I spend 8 months a year on it ? No. Would I do upto 4 or maybe 5 if I was berthed somewhere warm ( which I am ) maybe - but once the summer cruise is over then what ?

Doing it alone will be solitary and if you are moving you won't find any community.

People do live on board boats of course. They are typically either sailing full time and even they winter somewhere for 6 months or find it a cheap place to live ( think Brighton Marina ). A friend in Italy ( he is on here ) spends a lot of time on his boat with his wife but he is in a Marina he has been at for many years and their whole social life revolves around it with a great community so the boat is a house ( with 3 bedrooms , 3 bathrooms etc. ).

Just be clear to yourself ( forget us ) about why you want to do this and consider the practicalities. Ask on the liveaboard forum.

If you still want to do it then buy a boat. If it is an old one make sure you have the ability to fix it ( it will need constant work ) if you are moving as finding engineers all over the place will be tiresome and expensive.

I know and have known plenty of liveaboards on 30-40ft fibreglass mobo’s and none,once they have taken the plunge have had any inclination to come back ashore……
Different strokes for different folks

 

[ingenious]

If that is the plan, then maybe better to buy a boat more suited to that type of use, such as the many single engined displacement boats built in Holland. I appreciate the attractions of the Broom and other twin screw semi displacement and planing boats but they really are not practical for long term use in inland waterways. Why have 2 huge engines that you don't need? Travelling around the canals as you suggest you might probably means running 500 hours a year or more - not what those boats and engines are designed for. I know people do it but that is usually because they go with the boat they have and accept the compromises. However if you are starting from scratch and buying a boat for a specific type of use then maybe look at boats that are designed for that type of use.

That's only part of the plan. Assuming I buy in UK, I see myself moving around the south coast for the first half year, parking over winter then crossing the channel,through France on rivers and canals then either west and south along Spain to Gibraltar or Morocco to exit EU or east to Italy, Greece and exit somewhere out there. The Dutch barge isn't going to be much use there. Whatever I get will be a compromise, it's a matter of finding the best one.

 

[Fire99]

I know and have known plenty of liveaboards on 30-40ft fibreglass mobo’s and none,once they have taken the plunge have had any inclination to come back ashore……
Different strokes for different folks

Mine is a little bigger than that but I've been living on my Trader for about 90% of the year for 3 1/2 years, and I have no desire to go back to land either..

 

[Greg2]

That's only part of the plan. Assuming I buy in UK, I see myself moving around the south coast for the first half year, parking over winter then crossing the channel,through France on rivers and canals then either west and south along Spain to Gibraltar or Morocco to exit EU or east to Italy, Greece and exit somewhere out there. The Dutch barge isn't going to be much use there. Whatever I get will be a compromise, it's a matter of finding the best one.

I think that Tranona was referring to single engined Dutch steel cruisers as opposed to barges and it is worth considering that as well as being ideal inland some are also intended to be seagoing. That said, steel and salt water aren’t necessarily a good mix and they are displacement speed only with a tendency to roll in a seaway.

As previously mentioned the Brooms were designed with your kind of use in mind and where I will perhaps differ with Tranona is that, in my view, there is no real problem with being inland with larger engines in the right boat, indeed all of our six boats have been seagoing motor boats used inland and on the coast and there are many such boats on the Broads, Thames etc. There are savings to be made on maintenance with a single engine of course and a single screw behind a keel is probably the best in terms of protecting the prop.

The only real practicality to consider is speed at tickover, which is illustrated in this thread. Perhaps not likely to be an issue with the Broom 38 but may be more so on a planing boat - our Broom 41 did in excess of four knots with both engines on tickover so in some area we had to drop to one engine or to slip in and out of gear so choosing a boat that will happily run on one engine helps and has the potential to half the hours on each when inland
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[Fire99]

My Trader does around 5kts on tickover unless you use the 'Low Rpm' function to drop the revs down which does work. However, I don't think my big CAT engines would appreciated 'trolling' for a long time continuously. I recently navigated the Crinan canal and the poor gearboxes got a tough time (in gear, out of gear, in gear, out of gear) so certainly a consideration if you're going to be on inland waterways/rivers rather than coastal waters for most of your time.

 

[Tranona]

That's only part of the plan. Assuming I buy in UK, I see myself moving around the south coast for the first half year, parking over winter then crossing the channel,through France on rivers and canals then either west and south along Spain to Gibraltar or Morocco to exit EU or east to Italy, Greece and exit somewhere out there. The Dutch barge isn't going to be much use there. Whatever I get will be a compromise, it's a matter of finding the best one.

That is very different from what you have said before and not sure that you have really grasped what is involved with that plan. While the type of boat you are looking at will work for living aboard they really are not suitable for long distance cruising such as you describe. They are primarily used for marina dwelling and short trips. Definitely not suited for coming north up the Iberian peninsular, particularly single handed, nor for long passages offshore such as across the Med.

Very, very few people use motorboats for cruising the Med, although of course many are based on the northern fringes, but used mainly for short trips. Realistically for longer passages you travel at displacement speed, partly for fuel cost and range reasons and partly because it is uncomfortable doing long periods at planing speeds. You rarely see motorboats used for liveaboard cruising east of Italy. Almost all long term liveaboard cruisers use sailing boats because of the flexibility, seaworthiness and economy. The only real compromise is using the canals as the draft limitations rule out most boats over about 35' except catamarans and the inconvenience of dealing with the mast, although if the canal section is just to get to the Med, that can be transported by road.

You are perhaps asking for just too much from a boat. Not only the suitability of the boat for very different styles of use, but the ongoing work and cost of keeping a boat running. For example the fuel costs, maintenance costs and berthing charges. A common expression is "liveaboard cruising is really mending things in nice warm places".

 

[ingenious]

I think that Tranona was referring to single engined Dutch steel cruisers as opposed to barges and it is worth considering that as well as being ideal inland some are also intended to be seagoing. That said, steel and salt water aren’t necessarily a good mix and they are displacement speed only with a tendency to roll in a seaway.

As previously mentioned the Brooms were designed with your kind of use in mind and where I will perhaps differ with Tranona is that, in my view, there is no real problem with being inland with larger engines in the right boat, indeed all of our six boats have been seagoing motor boats used inland and on the coast and there are many such boats on the Broads, Thames etc. There are savings to be made on maintenance with a single engine of course and a single screw behind a keel is probably the best in terms of protecting the prop.

The only real practicality to consider is speed at tickover, which is illustrated in this thread. Perhaps not likely to be an issue with the Broom 38 but may be more so on a planing boat - our Broom 41 did in excess of four knots with both engines on tickover so in some area we had to drop to one engine or to slip in and out of gear so choosing a boat that will happily run on one engine helps and has the potential to half the hours on each when inland
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What sort of fuel consumption do you get on 1 or 2 engines at slow speeds? I was a bit alarmed by something I read on one post here that said his boat with older engines was using 3.5 x that of a newer single engined boat. Can't find it now so I'm not sure which boat it was. I looked at fuel costs based on the log of the Yanmar engined Nimbus I looked at and somebody with an Aquador here and it seemed reasonable.

 

[Greg2]

Whilst I don’t disagree with the argument that a yacht is perhaps better suited to Med cruising there are people who have and do cruise in mobos by coast hopping. I remember a write up in MBM about a couple in a Dutch steel cruiser who did just that and the quote below is from the owner of a Broom 450 when it was for sale with NYA:

• ‘Boat name’ was purchased from NYA in July 2019. We set off on our long planned adventure in August and travelled to the south coast of the UK and then crossed the English Channel to Honfleur and travelled through the rivers and canals of France.
• Passing through Rouen, Paris, the Champagne region, Lyon, Valence and finally to the Mediterranean at Port St Louis. We passed under low bridges and negotiated many locks, the hydraulic arch made this very easy. Our Mediterranean adventure took us to some amazing places including Corsica, Sardinia, Sicily, Malta and Greece travelling extensively in the Ionian and Aegean seas. The boat is very capable of long passages in all sea conditions, an amazingly adaptable cruiser.

The thing is that a mobo such as a Broom provides the flexibility to spend time inland and to cruise at sea, albeit usually day runs between ports / anchorages. It might not be ideal as a Med cruiser but it can do the job that the OP describes. I do agree that it is advisable to have eyes wide open to the issues raised though and particularly maintenance and other costs.

FWIW our boat choice has been with similar adventures to those proposed by the OP in mind as possibilities.
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[Greg2]

What sort of fuel consumption do you get on 1 or 2 engines at slow speeds? I was a bit alarmed by something I read on one post here that said his boat with older engines was using 3.5 x that of a newer single engined boat. Can't find it now so I'm not sure which boat it was. I looked at fuel costs based on the log of the Yanmar engined Nimbus I looked at and somebody with an Aquador here and it seemed reasonable.

With twin Perkins 265hp engines I recorded the following estimations in 2022 at sea based upon the plotter for distances, engine hours on the rev counters and fuel put in the tank:

• RPM 1000 - 1400
• Speeds 6-7 knots (maybe a little higher on occasion)
• Mixture of punching the tide and running with it
• Consumption approx:
  • 2.2nm per gallon
  • 2 litres per nm
  • 12-13 litres per hour / 2.66 gallons per hour

On inland waters at slightly lower speeds I would expect to use a bit less and with one engine less still but not half due to the drag of the stern gear of the side not in use.

Fuel consumption with a single may well be better but as with everything to do with boats there is a compromise somewhere. Twins provide redundancy and greatly enhanced close quarters manoeuvring ability but with increased maintenance and fuel costs. Also need to factor in the type of boats available with single engines with the style and accommodation they provide to map against your requirements and intended useage.
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[ingenious]

With twin Perkins 265hp engines I recorded the following estimations in 2022 at sea based upon the plotter for distances, engine hours on the rev counters and fuel put in the tank:

• RPM 1000 - 1400
• Speeds 6-7 knots (maybe a little higher on occasion)
• Mixture of punching the tide and running with it
• Consumption approx:
  • 2.2nm per gallon
  • 2 litres per nm
  • 12-13 litres per hour / 2.66 gallons per hour

On inland waters at slightly lower speeds I would expect to use a bit less and with one engine less still but not half due to the drag of the stern gear of the side not in use.

Fuel consumption with a single may well be better but as with everything to do with boats there is a compromise somewhere. Twins provide redundancy and greatly enhanced close quarters manoeuvring ability but with increased maintenance and fuel costs. Also need to factor in the type of boats available with single engines with the style and accommodation they provide to map against your requirements and intended useage.
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That is better than I thought. The log on the Nimbus showed an average of 1.7 litres/nm (230 hp Yanmar), the person on here was getting 1.1litre/km (So 2 litre per nm) Vs previous log of 1.4l/km on a 370hp Volvo
I am under no illusions that this is a cheap exercise but I have looked at ad-hoc mooring costs on the canals, at places like Dunkirk, Paris and south coast ports and along the coasts of Spain and Italy.
Engine servicing will be something I can find out about either 3rd party or doing it myself, major repairs/rebuilds is another matter which is why I asked in the first post. If I buy a boat with 2500 hours on the engines and add 400-500 a year for, say, 5 years, is it going to need rebuilds during that period or before I can sell it?
I am reasonably well off having sold the family 5 bed house and am living in a seaside cottage we used to rent out and will go back to Airbnb'ing when I am away. I am semi-retired, drawing down a private pension while I wait another 5 years for the state pension while still doing some consulting work which I can do remotely. In theory I could buy a much newer boat but my guy feeling is I will lose more on that.

 

[Greg2]

It is worth bearing in mind that at higher speeds fuel consumption increases exponentially. As a rule of thumb for a Broom working on approx 1nm per gallon at planing speeds won’t be far out. I think we did a little better that that with our Broom 41 but I am talking 1.1 or 1.2 nmpg. That, though, is a choice and tends to apply only on sea passages where you decide you want to get a wriggle on. We tend to run slower and use tides to our advantage where possible.

On engine hours it is worth bearing in mind that high hours on a leisure boat are likely to be primarily at river speeds so not under heavy load or stress. Depending upon the engine I think it unlikely that a rebuild would be required at 5k hours but it is worth noting that, as I understand it, the Yanmars aren’t designed to be rebuilt. Whilst I know of a couple that have been using new blocks from Toyota, my understanding is that there is no scope for re-bore or replacement piston liners due to them being very finely engineered.
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[ingenious]

It is worth bearing in mind that at higher speeds fuel consumption increases exponentially. As a rule of thumb for a Broom working on approx 1nm per gallon at planing speeds won’t be far out. I think we did a little better that that with our Broom 41 but I am talking 1.1 or 1.2 nmpg. That, though, is a choice and tends to apply only on sea passages where you decide you want to get a wriggle on. We tend to run slower and use tides to our advantage where possible.

On engine hours it is worth bearing in mind that high hours on a leisure boat are likely to be primarily at river speeds so not under heavy load or stress. Depending upon the engine I think it unlikely that a rebuild would be required at 5k hours but it is worth noting that, as I understand it, the Yanmars aren’t designed to be rebuilt. Whilst I know of a couple that have been using new blocks from Toyota, my understanding is that there is no scope for re-bore or replacement piston liners due to them being very finely engineered.
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Interesting about Yanmar although I found this https://www.yanmar.com/marine/service/repower/ so I might investigate further if I get serious about a Yanmar powered boat.
Also been doing searches on rebuilding the Perkins Sabre engines on the other boats I'm interested in. Am I right in saying the whole saloon floor comes up for major work whereas the hatches are for routine checks/maintenance?
Anyway, I'm going to have to put this on hold for a week or so as I've come down with flu!