Bought a Never splashed Colvic Countess 33 on eBay, Looking for infos

[chrishscorp]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

1-I still think you are bonkers
2-I still think it's not worth it financially or in terms of time, both of which I still think you have catastrophically under-estimated. If people could fit out a hull for 20 grand and a few months work we'd all be doing it.
3-HOWEVER-fair play to have got her moved...she does look good (on the outside!) I have to say!
4-Glad she didn't fold up when craned and the survey was OK. Don't go crazy on the osmosis/moisture...show me an old boat that hasn't had the pox at some point
5-If I were you I would not be fannying around with the outside of the hull now. You have precisely zero chance of finishing the boat this summer or next. So use the good weather to get the bulkheads cut and in. Get the internals sorted so when the nights draw in you can sit inside and plumb in engines/water/electrics to your heart's content. And I would not be planing so much as a micron off that hull laminate until I had some bulkheads in.

Crack on!

+1 Focus on the inside structurals give it some rigidity so when the days shorten you dont grind to a halt.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

<snip>.yet claims to be able to finish the boat in a matter of months despite hearing from those who have built this model (most were home completed) that completion times run into years, not months.<snip>

It's taken two months just to move it across the yard

 

[Just_sayin']

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

What utter nonsense.

Sadly, you don't appear to have much of a clue as to what you are doing.

I wish you well with your boat build, but it's now reached a point where i'm going to bow out of this thread.

Thank you and I hope you enjoyed coming along this far. Fair winds and Following seas.

Good reply Greg, sadly wasted as he has stomped. Never to return. Absolutely not. Never. Ever. Yeah right

It's taken two months just to move it across the yard

Oh dear. SO predictable.

 

[simonfraser]

Re: Coming out of Death Row.

Sadly, you don't appear to have much of a clue as to what you are doing.

I wish you well with your boat build, but it's now reached a point where i'm going to bow out of this thread.

uhm, you said goodbye .....

 

[Iain C]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

So, it is a lost cause.

I don't think it is a "lost cause" as such. It's only a lost cause when time, money, health, location or similar run out and the boat cannot be viably completed by the owners. I think the issue with the thread is the naivety around time and money and reluctance to take advice, and an honesty on what the boat actually represents. The OP has says it's a blue water/high latitude cruising yacht assembled in a matter of months with "special tools" for £20k with a number of potential untried systems such as a home made water maker, hybrid propulsion and climbing rope rigging. Clearly to those with more experience it will never be that, because right now we'd be seeing a boat with all the bulkheads and windows in, and an engine, rig and sails procured. Instead, we have a 75 page thread which to summarise is "bloke buys one of those sat in the corner of every boatyard shells off eBay, puts interior in skip, has survey, moves boat across yard".

However, if it was a case of "I wanted something to do something blokey with a mate that isn't the pub or fishing, we don't really care how long it takes or if in truth we could have just bought one and gone sailing...for us it's about creating something and doing the project for fun, and any advice would be gratefully received" then I suspect the thread would have gone down in a whole different way. However, it's interesting reading in it's own way, and I do hope that there's no-one on here who genuinely wants to see the project fail so they can have their "we told you so" keyboard moment. We all do things like this...my carbon bowsprit thread running at the moment could arguably fall into the same bracket...there was an ally one on eBay the other day for £300, I could have bought it, fitted it and known it would work, however I wanted to put my own stamp, (with a nod to many years building and sailing development class skiffs) on an otherwise bland mass produced cruising yacht and feel a bit of pride when someone one day asks me in a marina "what make of carbon bowsprit is that?" However there is a huge difference in the finances, commitment and risk involved in building a bowsprit and building a yacht!!!

 

[Aardee]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

I don't think it is a "lost cause" as such. It's only a lost cause when time, money, health, location or similar run out and the boat cannot be viably completed by the owners. I think the issue with the thread is the naivety around time and money and reluctance to take advice, and an honesty on what the boat actually represents. The OP has says it's a blue water/high latitude cruising yacht assembled in a matter of months with "special tools" for £20k with a number of potential untried systems such as a home made water maker, hybrid propulsion and climbing rope rigging. Clearly to those with more experience it will never be that, because right now we'd be seeing a boat with all the bulkheads and windows in, and an engine, rig and sails procured. Instead, we have a 75 page thread which to summarise is "bloke buys one of those sat in the corner of every boatyard shells off eBay, puts interior in skip, has survey, moves boat across yard".

However, if it was a case of "I wanted something to do something blokey with a mate that isn't the pub or fishing, we don't really care how long it takes or if in truth we could have just bought one and gone sailing...for us it's about creating something and doing the project for fun, and any advice would be gratefully received" then I suspect the thread would have gone down in a whole different way. However, it's interesting reading in it's own way, and I do hope that there's no-one on here who genuinely wants to see the project fail so they can have their "we told you so" keyboard moment. We all do things like this...my carbon bowsprit thread running at the moment could arguably fall into the same bracket...there was an ally one on eBay the other day for £300, I could have bought it, fitted it and known it would work, however I wanted to put my own stamp, (with a nod to many years building and sailing development class skiffs) on an otherwise bland mass produced cruising yacht and feel a bit of pride when someone one day asks me in a marina "what make of carbon bowsprit is that?" However there is a huge difference in the finances, commitment and risk involved in building a bowsprit and building a yacht!!!

Having waded my way through all 75 pages, this, for me, is a fantastic summary.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Re: Coming out of Death Row.

uhm, you said goodbye .....

And ?

 

[ghostlymoron]

My pal has one of these. Not home finished, boatyard finished, 3yr old yanmar 3 cylinder, relatively new nav equipment, ketch rig, newish sails including cruising chute, spinnaker, staysail. Fully equipped for cruising been all round UK. I've been to Ireland several times in her. Needs a bit of tlc (varnishing and upholstery). He'd happily take £20k for it.
I'm sure his is not the only one available at the moment. So Oddity not the only option and Greg's motive can't be to get a good boat at reasonable price. Oddity is a project, but boatyards all over the world are contain a few similar hulks tucked in the nether regions - most never to emerge. Maybe Greg will be the exception, I hope so but doubt it somehow.

 

[ghostlymoron]

As for osmosis and skin peeling. Most boats of similar vintage have the odd blister especially if they've been flooded for a few years but spot treatment is all that's needed - remember it's easy to plane off, not easy to put back on.

 

[Tranona]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

I don't think it is a "lost cause" as such. It's only a lost cause when time, money, health, location or similar run out and the boat cannot be viably completed by the owners. I think the issue with the thread is the naivety around time and money and reluctance to take advice, and an honesty on what the boat actually represents. The OP has says it's a blue water/high latitude cruising yacht assembled in a matter of months with "special tools" for £20k with a number of potential untried systems such as a home made water maker, hybrid propulsion and climbing rope rigging. Clearly to those with more experience it will never be that, because right now we'd be seeing a boat with all the bulkheads and windows in, and an engine, rig and sails procured. Instead, we have a 75 page thread which to summarise is "bloke buys one of those sat in the corner of every boatyard shells off eBay, puts interior in skip, has survey, moves boat across yard".

A very good summary of what is being proposed and exactly the reason why I said it was a lost cause.

If they want a nautical garden shed to escape then there are much less financially damaging ones around. If they want a boat to go high latitude sailing then there are many of those around as well.

 

[seaangler23]

Go for the bulkheads first by the time you’ve done them you will realise what a bastard/horrible/itchy/ dusty/awkward/time consuming job dealing with glass and resin is and you will be more than happy to gouge out the few osmosis blisters and fill them

 

[PCUK]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

Suggest you actually read the whole thread, then you might understand why this particular project is a lost cause. A DIY builder can indeed make many small (and some not so small) savings by good buying and making things oneself, the reality is that this is essentially a bare hull and deck so there are many unavoidable purchases of major equipment that will cost more than the market value of the boat. These boats sell in very good condition and fully equipped for around £20k. Indeed several forum members own exactly the same boat and can tell, or have told him what they are worth. Add to that he has no experience of boat building and particularly GRP work yet claims to be able to finish the boat in a matter of months despite hearing from those who have built this model (most were home completed) that completion times run into years, not months.

Like you I have successfully built boats in the past from both plans and mouldings and got my money back. But the past is the past and today's market conditions are very different and there is no way (if he ever finishes the boat) he will recover a fraction of his expenditure. Of course he may not want to sell, but if he wants to go sailing he can buy an up and running boat of the same type now for less than half of the (minimal) material cost of completing his hull and deck.

You're still wrong. Todays market has nothing to do with anything. The sales value is immaterial. It can still easily be done far cheaper than buying -if you know what you are doing!
p.s. 20K? I could do it for half that (and better than a factory knock off) and so can they. You obviously see DIY in a different light to those of us in the real world.

 

[Tranona]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

You're still wrong. Todays market has nothing to do with anything. The sales value is immaterial. It can still easily be done far cheaper than buying -if you know what you are doing!
p.s. 20K? I could do it for half that (and better than a factory knock off) and so can they. You obviously see DIY in a different light to those of us in the real world.

Another one living in a fantasy world. you will get on well with the OP with your pipe dreams.

Read this thread in its entirety. Many contributors who know what they are doing and have done take a very different view from you and the OP and I know which I prefer to believe.

 

[Dutch01527]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

You're still wrong. Todays market has nothing to do with anything. The sales value is immaterial. It can still easily be done far cheaper than buying -if you know what you are doing!
p.s. 20K? I could do it for half that (and better than a factory knock off) and so can they. You obviously see DIY in a different light to those of us in the real world.

How much could you buy and fit decent but second hand engine, gearbox, shaft, propeller, mast, boom, standing rigging and sails for. That lot alone has blown your budget unless you buy old clappped out, mis matched rubbish and if you do that you end up with a old, clapped out and mismatched boat which rather defeats the purpose.

Add onto that electronics, plumbing, bulkheads, internal fittings, deck fittings, winches, blocks, running rigging ect, ect.

To me this is a £40k project using decent second hand parts and a £80k project using new, excluding labour.

Reminds me of a Georgian Mill House we bought with a refurbishment budget of £100k. We spent £350k and that could of been doubled if we had not economised where ever possible. Difference is that the house made us a bit of money, a boat will not.

 

[Concerto]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

Every one still keeps missing the point of this project. They want to complete a boat for their own use.

Greg has experience of using many high tech materials and has a lot in stock to use. Wisely he has stripped out the rotten interior and has got the hull checked out before he starts work.

To many they seem another pair of dreamers taking on a project, however I believe they have plenty of time and skills to complete the whole job. Far more people should be encouraging them rather than knocking them.

Having read every post in this thread as they have been posted, it is clear many do not have the drive or skills to undertake a project like this. Thankfully there are a few dedicated people who decide to work on abandoned boats, but alas we also know many never get completed.

In this case I do think the project will get completed, but will take slightly longer and cost slightly more than they planned (as I have said before), but not wildly out.

So why not be more encouraging with your posts?

 

[Wansworth]

We live in a society that has the mantra.......will it pay

 

[Fr J Hackett]

It will take more than slightly longer and a considerable amount more than budgeted, it would be interesting and informative if at the end of each month a progress report was made and an up to date spend including yard fees and all those little incidentals that get forgotten like hire of aero props wooden shoring props etc. Even a retrospective start to such a costing and project report would have begun to make a hole in the initial £20K. Anyone that has done any significant project management will tell you that the original estimates of time and cost were nothing more that guesses with little knowledge behind them.
I wish them well in the project but a little bit of reality needs to set in.

 

[Dutch01527]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

.....Having read every post in this thread as they have been posted, it is clear many do not have the drive or skills to undertake a project like this.

In this case I do think the project will get completed, but will take slightly longer and cost slightly more than they planned (as I have said before), but not wildly out.

So why not be more encouraging with your posts?

If you look at the initial reactions to the original post they were encouraging until it was claimed that:
- the end of the season was seriously being considered as a completion date and
- a £20k maximum budget

It would be interesting if one of the people who thinks that is remotely possible could give the the highest level breakdown of a plan/budget e.g. buy and fit mast/rigging/chain plates/ lights/ mast wiring / wind gauge/ mast step ect ect - XX days @ £ XXXX including delivery and crane.

I defy anyone to come up with a feasible plan/budget that even gets close. I will donate £100 to a charity of their choice if anyone can do so. It would be worth that money to learn how it can be done.

Encouraging someone who is making a mistake is not really in anyone’s interest. If the budget / plan was to spend £500 per month and 200 hours time until a great boat was completed that is admirable and worthy of encouragement.

 

[pvb]

We live in a society that has the mantra.......will it pay

No, I don't think that's why people here haven't been more encouraging. I think it was the unrealistic timing and budget claims made about the project, supported by mysterious claims of having access to specialised equipment or rare materials. We all know that this project will take years, and cost 2 or 3 times the budget. Sadly, many who have tackled project boats themselves also know that the end result won't be worth it, and may be rather difficult to sell when the time comes. OK, the OP and his partner will have the joy of the experience of building a boat, but if they really want that they could get jobs in a boatbuilders and be paid handsomely for it.

 

[Tranona]

Re: VIDEO UPDATE. 005 the Lady itself.

Every one still keeps missing the point of this project. They want to complete a boat for their own use.

Greg has experience of using many high tech materials and has a lot in stock to use. Wisely he has stripped out the rotten interior and has got the hull checked out before he starts work.

To many they seem another pair of dreamers taking on a project, however I believe they have plenty of time and skills to complete the whole job. Far more people should be encouraging them rather than knocking them.

Having read every post in this thread as they have been posted, it is clear many do not have the drive or skills to undertake a project like this. Thankfully there are a few dedicated people who decide to work on abandoned boats, but alas we also know many never get completed.

In this case I do think the project will get completed, but will take slightly longer and cost slightly more than they planned (as I have said before), but not wildly out.

So why not be more encouraging with your posts?

The answer to your last question is exactly what you have written as "positives".

High tech stuff is totally irrelevant to this project. It is a 40 year old, old fashioned design. It need a set of hardware to turn it into a boat which has not changed in those 40 years and about 3000 hours of labour to attach those bits to the existing hull.

However much you try to say that clever work and clever buying will reduce this, there is a minimum of £40k worth of hardware required to turn it into a functioning boat of a basic standard. As in an earlier post you can buy one that is actually better than you could achieve for that budget for £20k. Never mind the labour hours required which would be over a year full time (60 hours a week) or 2 years at a more sensible pace. How do you think two novices who have never done this before are going to achieve that, particularly when they seem to reject all the advice from people, both professional and DIYers who have done all this before?

Why is there any virtue in working on abandoned boats except as a makework activity? given that so few ever get finished so remain abandoned having eaten up another load of money and time of deluded people.