clyst
Well-known member
Assuming both engines are 4cylinder what are the obvious differences from the outside . A friend has one or the other fitted in his Macwester Wight but doesn't know which .
cheers
cheers
BMC Captain and commodore engines
- Thread starter clyst
- Start date
vyv_cox
Well-known member
This information came from a man who worked at Newage Marine, later to become Tempest Diesels, in Stamford Lincs. They converted various BMC engines for marine use. These were:
BMC 1100 petrol engines (Vedette I think they were called)
1500 B series diesels (Captain)
2.2 BMC diesels (Commodore)
2.4 diesel (Commander)
3.0 litre BMC C (six cyl petrol called Sea Prince very rare).
Mine is the 2.2 litre 50 HP engine. I was told that the 2.2 can be distinguished from the 2.4 (2.5?) by the removable water jacket plug in the top of the cylinder head, which is not on the 2.4/5.
I have digital copies of the Tempest 1.5 and 2.5 workshop manuals, if required.
BMC 1100 petrol engines (Vedette I think they were called)
1500 B series diesels (Captain)
2.2 BMC diesels (Commodore)
2.4 diesel (Commander)
3.0 litre BMC C (six cyl petrol called Sea Prince very rare).
Mine is the 2.2 litre 50 HP engine. I was told that the 2.2 can be distinguished from the 2.4 (2.5?) by the removable water jacket plug in the top of the cylinder head, which is not on the 2.4/5.
I have digital copies of the Tempest 1.5 and 2.5 workshop manuals, if required.
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maxi77
Active member
There was also the 1800 version of the B series engine. There are still companies who will do a full recondition on a B series marine engine.
pheran
New member
My understanding is that both the 2.2 and the 2.4 cylinder diesels were known as Commanders and were derived from the engine fitted to London Black cabs. The name Commodore applied to the 3.4 and 3.8 engines - I had a pair of the 3.4s in a motor cruiser I owned many years back and the official parts microfiche I managed to acquire certainly had the name Commodore attached. The larger ones were derived from those fitted to a number of tractors of that era including the 60hp Nuffields
PCUK
Well-known member
The injection pump on the1.5 is on the port side of the engine sticking out sideways.
clyst
Well-known member
Thanks for you replies chaps . will have a look in the first instance at the injector pump .
magpie2
New member
I have a BMC 1500 diesel on my boat and the injector pump is on the starboard side above the starter motor.
Jcorstorphine
Well-known member
+1 and behind the alternator and I am sure that nearly all the Mac Wights were fitted with Captains at 30 HP
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...a=X&ei=Z1ZpUr3zGOjC0QWL-YGoAw&ved=0CDUQ9QEwAw
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maxi77
Active member
And is driven by what was the distributor drive on the petrol engine and is circular a bit like a distributor.
Jcorstorphine
Well-known member
And I dropped the above drive shaft into the sump when removing the Injection Pump. Had to lift the engine up about a foot to get the sump off and recover the drive shaft.
PCUK
Well-known member
Begging everyone's pardon. I was remembering the engine from the front as that is where my access was. Pump is on the starboard side as stated before. The big difference is that it sticks out sideways whereas the 2.2 pump is alongside the block
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praggers
New member
Hi vyv_cox
I would be very grateful for a digital copy of the Tempest 1.5 manual. I am new to this forum but I think there must be a way to get things sent to one's email address?
many thanks in anticipation,
praggers
I would be very grateful for a digital copy of the Tempest 1.5 manual. I am new to this forum but I think there must be a way to get things sent to one's email address?
many thanks in anticipation,
praggers
owenie
New member
I recently bought a Macwester Malin with a BMC 1.5 diesel. I have no paperwork or instruction for this engine and am anxious that I get the starting and running of this venerable power unit right. I have searched the web for information and this has proved to be a dead end as regards the type of document that I can download. My spirits lifted when I came across your thread on ybw and I hope you will send me the digital versions of the workshop manuals if you are able.
My email is owenie@blueyonder.co.uk
Thanking you in anticipation
Regards
Owen
My email is owenie@blueyonder.co.uk
Thanking you in anticipation
Regards
Owen
TimBennet
New member
For completeness there was also a 5.1 litre, 95HP, six cylinder BMC 'Sea Lord' engine. I re-engined a Baltic Trader in the mid seventies with one.
The old engine was a huge Danish, single cylinder, hot bulb paraffin / diesel engine and after all the work, we were never convinced our engine swap constituted an 'upgrade'. We missed the rhythmic throb which we had replaced with something that forever sounded like the No 92A bus.
The old engine was a huge Danish, single cylinder, hot bulb paraffin / diesel engine and after all the work, we were never convinced our engine swap constituted an 'upgrade'. We missed the rhythmic throb which we had replaced with something that forever sounded like the No 92A bus.
rogerthebodger
Well-known member
This may help you
http://the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/downloads/bmc1500L-diesel-workshop-manual.pdf
And this
http://www.nauticus.co.uk/bmc.pdf
http://the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/downloads/bmc1500L-diesel-workshop-manual.pdf
And this
http://www.nauticus.co.uk/bmc.pdf
RobinBirch
Active member
Definitely a case of 'downcycling'
TimBennet
New member
Indeed.
But it was the 1970's.
And we were young.
And like so much back then, it seemed like progress!
Jcorstorphine
Well-known member
Hi
Just a few words about the BMC 1.5 diesel engine
The engine is a diesel version of the old petrol Morris Oxford / Austin Cambridge 1498 cc engine of the late 50s. It is an indirect injection engine in that the injector fires into a small combustion chamber and the compression ratio is 23 to 1. Even with this high compression ratio, the engine will not start without the use of Glow Plugs.
There is a Glow Plug on each cylinder on the same side as the injectors. If you are electrically minded it would be a good idea to get a test meter and check that they are all working, the resistance should be about 1.5 Ohms as they use about 8 amps each.
The engines were designed and built before metrication so you will need to get a set of AF spanners / socket set.
The engine is indirect cooled in that you have two water pumps, one for seawater and the other is a circulation pump. If the boat has been laid up for some time, you should remove the front plate on the Jabsco seawater pump as there is a good chance the pump will have taken a set in that some of the lobes of the impellor will be bent and the engine will not pick up seawater. I would just mention that the seawater is pumped through the heat exchanger and injected into the exhaust. As the exhaust is usually rubber, you cannot run the engine for too long otherwise the rubber exhaust will start to be damaged.
Assuming you are still ashore, you will need to set up a water hose to the inlet of the seacock however this can cause problems if the engine does not start as the exhaust will be flooded. A better solution is to set up a hose from the seawater pump back into a bucket in which you can top up using the hose, the other alternative is to use a filter funnel attached to the hose and set the funnel hard up against the seacock inlet, that way you will not be forcing water into the engine.
Again, if the engine has been lying for some time, I would look at removing the rocker box cover (just two set screws) and cover the rocker shaft with some oil and pour a little down the push rods to help with the initial lubrication as all of the oil in these areas will have drained down.
It is not a bad idea to get a ratchet socket spanner and fit this to the front of the engine and turn it over by hand before you start it
One other precaution to take on an engine which is of unknown condition is to check that there are no ropes near or round the propeller / shaft as there are two possible reasons why the prop will start to turn immediately the engine fires, these being, there has been some corrosion in the gearbox causing the clutch plate to bind or the remote control (Teleflex) cable is not set up correctly.
To have a good change of getting the engine to start, you will need to turn on the glow plus for at least 30 seconds, possibly more and then press the starter. Please do not use any of the starting aids such as easy start, better to have fully charged batteries. If it is reluctant to start use a hot air gun or even a hair dryer to blast in hot air into the inlet by removing the circular chrome air filter.
Here are a few links, there is a lot more out there.
http://www.nauticus.co.uk/bmc.pdf
http://the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/downloads/bmc1500L-diesel-workshop-manual.pdf
http://www.kingfisherboatservices.co.uk/blog-BMC-Marine-Engines.php
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXlXrnprFwU
http://www.calcuttboats.com/engines.html
Let us know how you get on with the engine, take your time check things and remember, these engine are very easy to work on, very little special tools, even a strip down require only a Torque Wrench and a set of feeler gauges.
Any problems drop me a line, I have sent you my email address.
maxi77
Active member
From experience the BMC 1.5 needs a good kick from the starter motor to go so a good quality starter battery is a must. Also they seem to benefit from an Italian Tuneup.We found after a couple of 12 hour motorsails that the engine started better and after a 3 month cruise with quite a few long motorsails it would start without anf heat at all. Not bad when the manual tells you to use 30 seconds
arjohn
New member
Hi jacorstorphine, congratulations on your excellent and comprehensive over view of the bmc/british Leyland/tempest/thorneycroft and other names. I have had the same 1.5 in my colvic for forty years with only few repairs along the way the only standing fault is the small generic oil leak from the crankshaft seal which is taken care of by a small drip tray and the usual checking of oil levels. The only criticism I would make is that I would sooner have had the 2.2 which would make bucking a head sea and fairly strong wind a bit easier.On the other hand it has taken me thro the thames barrier against a full ebb, due to unfortunate eta timing,but it worked hard, all in all a very good marine engine,regards to you---Roger---