beneteau engine problem

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jim99bob

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Dickies international, nanni diesel

Boat is Beneteau Antares 980
HIN/CIN FR-BEYC2087L304 ref 059047
Boat is 2005 Beneteau Antares 9.8 with 2 x 200hp nannies. Aprox 400 hours on
both engines, full service history.

I bought this boat from Dickies Southampton in November 2009.
In July 2010 (after less than 50 hours use) the port engine began to emit white smoke/steam from the exhaust. (I instructed a local marine engineering firm to repair)
This was eventually traced to a hole in the cylinder head behind an exhaust valve.
A replacement head was purchased from A R Peachement. (Nanni distributors) The existing valves were fitted into this head but were too long to shim properly.
Peachement collected the head and valves, arranged for the valves to be shortened then returned the head with the shorter valves fitted.
This head was fitted and The engine was run in the marina for some time,
no problems, once it was out and the engines opened up to 2000rpm the port
engine would instantly overheat (ie less than a minute) and throw steam and
water out. Knock back the revs and the engine cooled down straight away.
Engine coolant topped up, exactly the same problem
Eventually after many hours everyone
was in agreement the head should come off, we found nothing apparently wrong with
the head or the gasket. We concluded there may be a problem with the head
internally, not matched to the engine or possibly an incorrectly punched head gasket.
Peachement replaced the head with a new one, this was fitted, and the engine
run for a hour or so in the marina - no problems, we took it out, boat ran
fine for 45 mins at 2000+ rpm. We all quite happy the fault had been solved
- however as we returned to Cowes the temperature rose on the port engine
and the oil pressure dropped to about 2 bar on tick over. The engine was also
noticeably noisy. We referred the problem to Ebbtide who diagnosed a failed balance shaft bearing. This was beyond repair – a new block was needed. At this point it became evident that Peachement/Nanni did not have a spare engine or block.
Eventually Nanni came up with a short engine (which I paid for), this has been now been fitted but the engine is not running properly and Ebbtide proposed taking the head off again…
It is now 1 year, I have spent much more than a replacement engine would have cost (if one was available) and I still have a totally unusable boat. I feel that I have had no support from Dickies or Peachement and the engine/ boat is not fit for purpose.
If anyone could help resolve this situation it would be appreciated.

I have a more detailed account of events, I also have the original head and block for inspection etc

Regards

Jim Payne (one very unhappy Beneteau owner)
 
jim99bob said:
Dickies international, nanni diesel

Boat is Beneteau Antares 980
HIN/CIN FR-BEYC2087L304 ref 059047
Boat is 2005 Beneteau Antares 9.8 with 2 x 200hp nannies. Aprox 400 hours on
both engines, full service history.

I bought this boat from Dickies Southampton in November 2009.
In July 2010 (after less than 50 hours use) the port engine began to emit white smoke/steam from the exhaust. (I instructed a local marine engineering firm to repair)
This was eventually traced to a hole in the cylinder head behind an exhaust valve.
A replacement head was purchased from A R Peachement. (Nanni distributors) The existing valves were fitted into this head but were too long to shim properly.
Peachement collected the head and valves, arranged for the valves to be shortened then returned the head with the shorter valves fitted.
This head was fitted and The engine was run in the marina for some time,
no problems, once it was out and the engines opened up to 2000rpm the port
engine would instantly overheat (ie less than a minute) and throw steam and
water out. Knock back the revs and the engine cooled down straight away.
Engine coolant topped up, exactly the same problem
Eventually after many hours everyone
was in agreement the head should come off, we found nothing apparently wrong with
the head or the gasket. We concluded there may be a problem with the head
internally, not matched to the engine or possibly an incorrectly punched head gasket.
Peachement replaced the head with a new one, this was fitted, and the engine
run for a hour or so in the marina - no problems, we took it out, boat ran
fine for 45 mins at 2000+ rpm. We all quite happy the fault had been solved
- however as we returned to Cowes the temperature rose on the port engine
and the oil pressure dropped to about 2 bar on tick over. The engine was also
noticeably noisy. We referred the problem to Ebbtide who diagnosed a failed balance shaft bearing. This was beyond repair – a new block was needed. At this point it became evident that Peachement/Nanni did not have a spare engine or block.
Eventually Nanni came up with a short engine (which I paid for), this has been now been fitted but the engine is not running properly and Ebbtide proposed taking the head off again…
It is now 1 year, I have spent much more than a replacement engine would have cost (if one was available) and I still have a totally unusable boat. I feel that I have had no support from Dickies or Peachement and the engine/ boat is not fit for purpose.
If anyone could help resolve this situation it would be appreciated.

I have a more detailed account of events, I also have the original head and block for inspection etc

Regards

Jim Payne (one very unhappy Beneteau owner)
Click to expand...

You must have the Toyota d4d base unit, generally a good unit.

I am at a loss as to anyone especially a dealer who would do such a stupid procedure as to shorten valves so they could be shimmed to the buckets and cam etc.

As they are the uk dealer I would have thought they would have sourced the correct diagnosis through nanni and toyota direct, therfore giving you the service you required.

So the route of your problem is an incorrect head, id say chase them legally for all your money back form peachment as its been as waste of time and money.

Did ebbtide know what they were doing or did they just fit anything to get you going again as its obvious that the block and head dont match, you could be looking at a repower job on your boat to make it useale now if the engine is no longer in production. I would not have engaged ebbtide are they nanni trained dealers? unless they are, id have put it back to peachment to sort out.

I am regularly in Shamrock quay if thats any help, the oil pressure at idle seems ok but you obviously have an overheat that may be something irrelevant or simple explanation.
 
If the boat was a brokerage boat you have the same rights as buying a car from a Car Auction and the engine went a month later, ie., Nothing.
What went wrong was a manufacturing fault. It isn't when the boat was made which is important, nor when the engine was made, but the date when the first owner bought the boat.
In the UK you are supposed to have a 6 year period to claim for faulty manufacture. I would get a Marine Surveyor to provide a report stating that the engine had a manufacturing fault, then write to Nanni asking for a new engine. And if unsuccessful get a solicitor and take them to the small claims court.
After all if this engine had been fitted in a Professional Fishing Boat, 400 hours would be equal to a months work.
 
don't know what was happening 1st July, but everyone ignored OP's post at that time, and what a horrible story. I have not a lot to add but really feel for the OP's engine issue. These sorts of engine issues can be made hugely worse by incompetence of "experts", got to say alarm bells rang when I read the valves had to be shortened...if the head was correct & valves correct... why? This has left OP out of pocket and out of a boat for a season.. :mad:

The experience I had with Dickies in Brighton was very good.. but I never had a problem, this is normally where true customer service is revealed.
 
volvopaul said:
You must have the Toyota d4d base unit, generally a good unit.

I am at a loss as to anyone especially a dealer who would do such a stupid procedure as to shorten valves so they could be shimmed to the buckets and cam etc.

As they are the uk dealer I would have thought they would have sourced the correct diagnosis through nanni and toyota direct, therfore giving you the service you required.

So the route of your problem is an incorrect head, id say chase them legally for all your money back form peachment as its been as waste of time and money.

Did ebbtide know what they were doing or did they just fit anything to get you going again as its obvious that the block and head dont match, you could be looking at a repower job on your boat to make it useale now if the engine is no longer in production. I would not have engaged ebbtide are they nanni trained dealers? unless they are, id have put it back to peachment to sort out.

I am regularly in Shamrock quay if thats any help, the oil pressure at idle seems ok but you obviously have an overheat that may be something irrelevant or simple explanation.
Click to expand...

It appears that Ebbtide are Nanni dealers. I would suggest as per Volvopaul's that you HAVE no choice but to go after the repairer. Talk of wrong length valves and incorrectly punched head gasket is all nonsensense. Failure of balancer shaft bearings is also very odd particularly as Ebbtide have been the only guys inside the engine.

As well as the above I would want particular attention paid to the engine installation there is a factor missing here.

Have no desire to cast doubt on the integrity of repairer however looking at their Facebook page I am amazed that they are ripping into a 14.6 liter Cummins VT903 one minute and big MAN V engines the next, both require very special skill base to avoid big problems in the future. All very odd.
 
my name is richard i work in aquaadventures panama fishing loge and all the boats are powered with 6cyl.320hp.nanni engines and all of them have the same problem for some resond the valve Knock on the piston head when it's throlling down. Servel machanic's have looked at it and no one can come up with a solution for it. If anybody can help or has had the same problem please let me know. ro_734@hotmail.com
 
latest development

Have been unable to get anything constructive from Benteau or Nanni. Total repair cost was 17k, and it took a year.
OTHER ENGINE NOW FAILED​

Yep, same problem, engine sending water vapour out of exhaust, overheated. turned over by hand with glow plugs out, No 4 cylinder full of fresh water, taken head off, currently in boot of car waiting to take it to be tested. It will have exactly the same hole in the head I suspect. Then it all starts again.......................Help!

Boat has full service history, engines full of antifreeze, boat heated and dehumidified when not in use.
 
Very sad story.

It sure is a Toyota Engine, model name is 1KZ-TE, same base as the earlier 1KZ and 1KZ-T.

Toyota makes some pre-marinisation and call it M1KZ-TE when sold for that purpose.

Many parts can be taken from the auto version from Toyota, but not all!

If you like to have it, I've put the workshop manual from Toyota up here:
http://www.spidybot.com/Ocqueteau/1KZ-TE.pdf

Sorry for the quality - it was scanned from paper.
 
Ouch that does not sound good ££££ wise but is good for you fom maybe a legal point of view in that both engines have failed which gives common ground with you fight that the first engine was not a one off failure.

I dont suppose yo have allowed the engine to freeze up over the winter? causing a crack in the head of maybe a dislodged core plug?.
 
Hi thanks for the manual it will be very useful.
The engines have plenty of antifreeze in them, the boats heated in the winter 24/7 and has a dehumidfier running. No issues with freezing.
Am hoping to get a response from Peachment (Nanni distributors) within the next 24 hours as to what to do next. They don't have replacement engines so that isn't an option.
jim
 
picture of head hole

headhole.jpg

Picture of where leak is. You can't actually see a hole, looks like the valve seats are sleeves and its leaking between the seat and the head. They may not be sleeves- it just looks like it.
 
Jim@sea said:
Thats not "Wear and tear" Its a manufacturing defect.
Click to expand...

I disagree.

Both engines appear to have suffered similar failure mode.

Nanni seem to have Cavalier approach to installations. Not sure I can get my head around the picture, however valve/Valve seat failure of this nature is 99.9% an installation issue causing excessive temperature in valve seat area.

Typical..........Engine always gets the blame.

Bet NOBODY can find original sea trial data..........
 
I would get an independent surveyor to look at it now then get the valve seat removed to check to see the sorce of the leak. You may find the machined recess where the valve seat is fitted has gone through into the water way and has only been sealed by the valve seat.

It still seems a bit odd about that balance shaft bearing going directly after rebuild. Is sounds like some debris entered the oil system.
 
Latestarter1 said:
I disagree.

Both engines appear to have suffered similar failure mode.

Nanni seem to have Cavalier approach to installations. Not sure I can get my head around the picture, however valve/Valve seat failure of this nature is 99.9% an installation issue causing excessive temperature in valve seat area.

Typical..........Engine always gets the blame.

Bet NOBODY can find original sea trial data..........
Click to expand...

I was reading this thread thinking to myself...I wonder if the other one will go pop too....then I was thinking......I bet Latestarter comes along and says its an installation fault....I bet LS says the EGT is too high underload....then I was thinking I bet he's right too....
 
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